Liverpool vs Man Utd - Premier League (20/21 - Game 18)

[Exiled_red]

One thing, Man U were not good in the first half. Given they are the 'form team' we totally nullified them. In the old days this would have resulted in a goal (or 2) the crowd going bezerk and us seeing the game out. We obviously dont have the crowd, and our reliance on the front three is obvious.

The worry is Mane, say what you like abut Salah, but he has chipped in with 13 goals. Mane has been miles from his best, and other than a brief burst of form after his Spurs goal so has Bobby. We dont have Jota, or Virgil who is a threat from corners, or Matip who chips in with one or two goals from corners also. Ox is a goal threat but needs a few games to get back into form, and Keita gets goals when he plays.

So from our attacking Arsenal, we have only really had Salah on form this season.

We need some solutions fast, and I think Klopp has to start trusting the likes of Minamino who just began to show a glimmer of form against Palace and hasnt been seen since. Other than the front three Klopp is tinkering constantly with the midfield and Centre backs which must be affecting rthym. Yet the area that is an issue remains constant every game.

Sticking with this misfiring front three game after game is a mistake as things stand.

I definitely want to see Ox get some game time to find form and think we miss that sort of thrust from midfield. Thiago showed in the first half what could be gained from beating a man.

Its the first time in, what, three seasons that questions have been asked and we havent delivered answers, and even that isnt resulting in any excess losses. We are just not turning draws into wins.

Burnley is a 100% MUST win. We have to get back on form and quick.

I am more concerned about Salah's form than Mane, while neither are scoring at the moment I feel that they are probably equally likely to score, but I feel Mane is more likely to create something, Salah keeps running into walls.

In terms of PL goal counts Salah's figures are skewed by penalties, 5 of Salah's goals in the PL are pens, which means if you take those out he has 8 compared to Mane's 6 and Jota and Firmino's 5 each

[Exiled_red]

Bobbi`s form and goal return is definitely a cause of concern 14 goals in a season and a half now and his link up play has also gone to ****

Bobby's goal return isn't far off where it has always been in the PL:

2015-16 : 31 games 10 goals
2016-17 : 35 games 11 goals
2017-18 : 37 games 15 goals
2018-19 : 34 games 12 goals
2019-20 : 17 games 5 goals

He averages around 1 in 3 in the PL which is almost where he's at at the moment, he really should get more and that is evident if you look at the chances he has had recently. As you say his link up play (or lack of) is the worry at the moment.

[Zapater]

I am more concerned about Salah's form than Mane, while neither are scoring at the moment I feel that they are probably equally likely to score, but I feel Mane is more likely to create something, Salah keeps running into walls.

In terms of PL goal counts Salah's figures are skewed by penalties, 5 of Salah's goals in the PL are pens, which means if you take those out he has 8 compared to Mane's 6 and Jota and Firmino's 5 each

I agree. I know this will never happen, but would love to see how we'd look tactically if we bought a complete number 9, put Bobby (or Shaqiri) into his 'natural' 10 role and played 4-2-3-1 exclusively for 4 or 5 consecutive games. Would we be able to unlock opposition instead of hitting clunky crosses? Apart from us being **** recently, the ease which teams have defended against us is disappointing.

[RichC]

To me, the fact that United **** out of having any sustained possession against a team with no recognised defenders in tells you everything about where the teams are still. There is no big power shift going on. United aren't great all of a sudden. We are just MILES off where we were the last 2 seasons. The absolute bedrock of our team has been ripped out from us and we're seeing the result of that slowly come home to roost.

Van Dijk doesn't just defend; he dictates a huge amount of our tempo, how we play, how high we play, how we confidently and comfortably press, the confidence of the other defenders, the confidence of the midfielders, where Fabinho plays, how high the full backs (confidently) go, the psyche of the opposition, the forwards (the forwards ffs!) actively look for passes from him. He is unreal.

[Exiled_red]

I agree. I know this will never happen, but would love to see how we'd look tactically if we bought a complete number 9, put Bobby (or Shaqiri) into his 'natural' 10 role and played 4-2-3-1 exclusively for 4 or 5 consecutive games. Would we be able to unlock opposition instead of hitting clunky crosses? Apart from us being **** recently, the ease which teams have defended against us is disappointing.

I know this is madness but I had been wondering these last few games 'what if we hadn't sold Brewster'. Probably desperation I know But Klopp did supposedly rate him and he seems a more natural goalscorer who would offer a different threat. It might have been a very different situation for both him and us

[Kenneth]

Yeah, that's pretty desperate.

[Buzzo]

To me, the fact that United **** out of having any sustained possession against a team with no recognised defenders in tells you everything about where the teams are still. There is no big power shift going on. United aren't great all of a sudden. We are just MILES off where we were the last 2 seasons. The absolute bedrock of our team has been ripped out from us and we're seeing the result of that slowly come home to roost.

Van Dijk doesn't just defend; he dictates a huge amount of our tempo, how we play, how high we play, how we confidently and comfortably press, the confidence of the other defenders, the confidence of the midfielders, where Fabinho plays, how high the full backs (confidently) go, the psyche of the opposition, the forwards (the forwards ffs!) actively look for passes from him. He is unreal.

Great points

[Pablo]

It's also Ok to admit United have improved a bit. They have.

That said we played them at their peak, and full of confidence and they still couldn't beat us.

[wiw]

It's also Ok to admit United have improved a bit. They have.

That said we played them at their peak, and full of confidence and they still couldn't beat us.

I agree they've definitely improved, and agree with your second point.

Let's see how they get on when they've improved to the point that opposition teams consistently play a low block against them. To me that's the real test. It's what City have been good enough to overcome and we've done the same. United still have a long way to go i'd say.

[Kenneth]

It's also Ok to admit United have improved a bit. They have.

That said we played them at their peak, and full of confidence and they still couldn't beat us.

They didn't try to. They achieved what they set out to with ease.

[Exiled_red]

They didn't try to. They achieved what they set out to with ease.

They wanted a point and they got it, in a similar manner to what West Brom, Newcastle and Southampton did (Southampton got a goal and nicked the win). I think that the main reason that they didn't win is because they didn't really try to rather than us negating them as the form team as some people have been suggesting.

[Pablo]

They didn't try to. They achieved what they set out to with ease.

They only really know how to play on the counter-attack and that's what they did. They were still arguably more dangerous than we were, and could have won the match.

I thought they were more ambitious than they have been in previous seasons, but thankfully they're not good enough to actually take control of the game.

My point really is although they've improved they are still some way behind us, even when we're off form and they are on a hot streak.

[Exiled_red]

Being better than them counts for nothing if they are getting results and we aren't. We can say how much better we have played how we have dominated games or how lucky they have been, but at the end of the day to be successful you have to find ways to win games, and at the moment they are doing that and we aren't.

[Norbs]

They didn't try to. They achieved what they set out to with ease.

Never quite get this opinion of games. Alisson made two or three superb saves that kept us in the game. Clearly they had chances to win it, they just had to play the game with a cagier gameplan. If Rushford had timed his runs better then he could've scored 3

Our approach is two predictable these days. We play way too far up the field and our opponents know that their best approach is to patiently wait for a missed pass and to counter. Until we find a way to get ahead in games we're going to be playing infront of a bus every week except against the occasional team who feel they have chance in a more open game

[Maxiedge]

A few different pass options in that first half and it would have been a different story. It's so disappointing, especially from Firmino who is usually so good with his selfless play. I still cant believe how much we let them off the hook in that first half. We were carving them open for a good 15 minute spell.