Brighton away

[SB]

Absolutely absurd logic.

Clear as day pen and denying a goalscoring chance. He literally just has to get to the ball to shoot, which he clearly would've done if he wasn't grabbed by the collar.

The Salah pen was another thing too. How is that not a penalty?? Did they even look at it? He's missed the ball completely and taken Mo out.

This league is absolutely ****ed. Im really starting to not enjoy watching us anymore. It's felt like this season more than any is just one **** decision against us after another. Not a week goes by without some glaringly obvious decision costing us dearly. What's the ****ing point anymore

[Mr Pink]

Why was Nunez crap? What a dumb thing to say

He got zero service as usual. Still got an assist though, and using the Mo Salah metric of judging a performance via only goals and assists then he was good.

I thought he was good today, but didn’t get much service.

Got the assist for the first goal, was composed enough to pass to szoboszlai, in the penalty incident- would surely have been a second assist if he wasn’t fouled. And played szoboszlai through for the chance that gravenberch missed.

[S-RED]

Was at the game, not reading the neg's on previous page, but from what i saw. we played a good side & didn't settle until 35mins in to the game; if Grav had taken his chance at start of 2nd half we would have won at a canter. Mo should have had a pen 2nd half (not given as refs are not allowed to give pens against someone in red wearing 11.....) 2nd goal was bull****, Gomez shoulder to shoulder in their half was not a foul, March then dived & we defended like a pub team. I like Elliot, but he does occupy a space that Mo & Taa want to operate in, wasn't surprised he was hokked, Slonb operated much wider in the same role 2nd half & that made a difference to the team.

2-2 was a fair result & i would have taken that before kick off. Klopp was hampered by last weeks ****e, no Jones, No Jota, No Gakpo stifled any changes he could make 2nd half.

Away fans were in great voice throughout

[Exiled_red]

Absolutely absurd logic.

Clear as day pen and denying a goalscoring chance. He literally just has to get to the ball to shoot, which he clearly would've done if he wasn't grabbed by the collar.

The Salah pen was another thing too. How is that not a penalty?? Did they even look at it? He's missed the ball completely and taken Mo out.

This league is absolutely ****ed. Im really starting to not enjoy watching us anymore. It's felt like this season more than any is just one **** decision against us after another. Not a week goes by without some glaringly obvious decision costing us dearly. What's the ****ing point anymore

I am not at the 'what's the point stage yet' But the refereeing in the league has been shocking this season, and we have certainly got the ****ty end of it. Inconsistency is rife we have players booked for showing imaginary yellows, but week after week teams do it against us an nothing.

I don't have an issue with the VVD red if that level is applied consistently but it isn't. Look at the Gross incident. Do I think a Gross red card would have been harsh? Yes it probably would, but he didn't make an attempt to play the ball so it should be a red card by the letter of the law, we have heard all last week from the likes of Mike Dean how we have to stick to the letter of the law but... The arguement that Szoboszlai didn't have control of the ball so it wasn't a goalscoring opportunity, the same should apply to the VVD one, the arguement made there by the pundits was that VVD denied him the opportunity to control the ball so it was the a goalscoring opportunity, I don't see how the Gross one is any different...

Then there are the comparisons between Kovacic and Jones, Kovacic gets booked and VAR look at it and determine it isn't a red, despite the fact he gets nowhere near the ball, Jones rolls off the ball onto the player, Kovacic challenge is far worse IMO. I have seen it suggested that it wasn't a red because the point of contact was lower than Jones' but I don't buy that. Then there is the second yellow (or lack of it) for Kovacic that really is an unbelievable decision especially if you would consider him lucky to only have got a yellow for the first one.

At this point I can just about accept that they are subjective calls some you get, some you don't but the more you see one team having the letter of the law applied to them and others not the more likely people are to start asking questions. The officials really need to get a grip and get some consistency in how they are refereeing games as if it goes on any longer it will be undermining the game

[baitman]

I am not at the 'what's the point stage yet' But the refereeing in the league has been shocking this season, and we have certainly got the ****ty end of it. Inconsistency is rife we have players booked for showing imaginary yellows, but week after week teams do it against us an nothing.

I don't have an issue with the VVD red if that level is applied consistently but it isn't. Look at the Gross incident. Do I think a Gross red card would have been harsh? Yes it probably would, but he didn't make an attempt to play the ball so it should be a red card by the letter of the law, we have heard all last week from the likes of Mike Dean how we have to stick to the letter of the law but... The arguement that Szoboszlai didn't have control of the ball so it wasn't a goalscoring opportunity, the same should apply to the VVD one, the arguement made there by the pundits was that VVD denied him the opportunity to control the ball so it was the a goalscoring opportunity, I don't see how the Gross one is any different...

Then there are the comparisons between Kovacic and Jones, Kovacic gets booked and VAR look at it and determine it isn't a red, despite the fact he gets nowhere near the ball, Jones rolls off the ball onto the player, Kovacic challenge is far worse IMO. I have seen it suggested that it wasn't a red because the point of contact was lower than Jones' but I don't buy that. Then there is the second yellow (or lack of it) for Kovacic that really is an unbelievable decision especially if you would consider him lucky to only have got a yellow for the first one.

At this point I can just about accept that they are subjective calls some you get, some you don't but the more you see one team having the letter of the law applied to them and others not the more likely people are to start asking questions. The officials really need to get a grip and get some consistency in how they are refereeing games as if it goes on any longer it will be undermining the game

I cannot accept we are just getting the rub of the green.
I'm sure there is an agenda. Whether it's a "mates clique" at pgmol, making sure we don't get the 50/50s, being much more strict with us yet giving city, manure, etc the "benefit of the doubt"
The recent refs trip to the middle east has thrown up the issue of new money and corruption. I'm sure it has been going on for years. Dbf was always "looking after" the officials, after match drinks, and god know's what else!
It all stinks.

[rudedog]

So Isaac didn’t have ‘possession of the ball’ when Virgil got sent off

When they got Dermot Gallagher in to explain why it was a red, he said they look at ‘did he have possession of the ball OR is he able to gain possession of the ball’

The above statement is about 25 seconds in:

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12949635/ref-watch-was-van-dijks-red-card-harsh

So yet again complete inconsistencies week to week

[rudedog]

And why wasn’t Marsh’s tackle on Salah checked?

Just because we know VAR love a still image to help make peoples minds up, here is one for the above which shows March tripping Salah in the box whilst simultaneously having both hands around him to help him on his way



No VAR check
No penalty

[Exiled_red]

So Isaac didn’t have ‘possession of the ball’ when Virgil got sent off

When they got Dermot Gallagher in to explain why it was a red, he said they look at ‘did he have possession of the ball OR is he able to gain possession of the ball’

The above statement is about 25 seconds in:

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12949635/ref-watch-was-van-dijks-red-card-harsh

So yet again complete inconsistencies week to week

Can we look forward to some mental gymnastics to hear why the Gross one wasn't a red or will they not talk about it?

[rudedog]

Can we look forward to some mental gymnastics to hear why the Gross one wasn't a red or will they not talk about it?

They already said it’s because Dom didn’t have control of the ball.

That seems to be the end of discussion as far as they are concerned.

[Buzzo]

Paul Merson was right (never thought I would ever say that) they need to get a grip and make the decision that is best for the actual game in front of them. Protocols should exist to guide them.

All this push back around, 'you can't break the rules' is nonsense. Refereeing is a judgement game, so use good judgement. The rules should then back up that good judgment.

What is happening is everyone involved is too scared to make an actual decision and instead falls back on the comfort of the rules for good, bad or outright horrendous. Then the process can be blamed. Take ownership, grow a set of balls and take the time to make the correct decision. Aim for clarity and accuracy, time is a third consideration. We all as supporters want to walk away from a game knowing the outcome was as close to accurate as possible.

This means stopping the match clock.

It is not in anyway difficult what they are trying to do they are making it difficult.

They are making it ****.

[RichC]

Paul Merson was right (never thought I would ever say that) they need to get a grip and make the decision that is best for the actual game in front of them. Protocols should exist to guide them.

All this push back around, 'you can't break the rules' is nonsense. Refereeing is a judgement game, so use good judgement. The rules should then back up that good judgment.

What is happening is everyone involved is too scared to make an actual decision and instead falls back on the comfort of the rules for good, bad or outright horrendous. Then the process can be blamed. Take ownership, grow a set of balls and take the time to make the correct decision. Aim for clarity and accuracy, time is a third consideration. We all as supporters want to walk away from a game knowing the outcome was as close to accurate as possible.

This means stopping the match clock.

It is not in anyway difficult what they are trying to do they are making it difficult.

They are making it ****.

Even with the process that's in place is horribly flawed. If they don't look at someone they'll trot out "it wasn't a clear and obvious error" even though the decision that's given is wrong.

Everything with VAR that's in place feels like protectionism for the refs rather than actually getting the calls right.

The gall of Mike Dean with Merson, a few weeks back he was admitting he didn't flag an incorrect decision.

“I missed the stupid hair pull at Chelsea versus Tottenham, which was pathetic from my point of view,” Dean told Simon Jordan’s Up Front podcast. “I didn’t want to send him [Taylor] up because he is a mate as well as a referee, and I think I didn’t want to send him up because I didn’t want any more grief than he already had.”

[Cerbie]

Paul Merson was right (never thought I would ever say that) they need to get a grip and make the decision that is best for the actual game in front of them. Protocols should exist to guide them.

All this push back around, 'you can't break the rules' is nonsense. Refereeing is a judgement game, so use good judgement. The rules should then back up that good judgment.

What is happening is everyone involved is too scared to make an actual decision and instead falls back on the comfort of the rules for good, bad or outright horrendous. Then the process can be blamed. Take ownership, grow a set of balls and take the time to make the correct decision. Aim for clarity and accuracy, time is a third consideration. We all as supporters want to walk away from a game knowing the outcome was as close to accurate as possible.

This means stopping the match clock.

It is not in anyway difficult what they are trying to do they are making it difficult.

They are making it ****.

It's not the Rules, it's the Law according to Dean on Sky. If Hopper had stopped play to go back to VAR after the incorrect offside call - Dean said he wouldn't referee again all year.

But on Saturday, Attwell did exactly that in the Burley vs Chelsea match for the 3rd Chelsea goal. So, if Deans assertions are right, we shouldn't see Attwell again until August... Let's see where he pops up after the international break.

[vlahka]

Just because we know VAR love a still image to help make peoples minds up, here is one for the above which shows March tripping Salah in the box whilst simultaneously having both hands around him to help him on his way



No VAR check
No penalty

Well done rudedog, good process!

[BG1973]

Paul Merson was right (never thought I would ever say that) they need to get a grip and make the decision that is best for the actual game in front of them. Protocols should exist to guide them.

All this push back around, 'you can't break the rules' is nonsense. Refereeing is a judgement game, so use good judgement. The rules should then back up that good judgment.

What is happening is everyone involved is too scared to make an actual decision and instead falls back on the comfort of the rules for good, bad or outright horrendous. Then the process can be blamed. Take ownership, grow a set of balls and take the time to make the correct decision. Aim for clarity and accuracy, time is a third consideration. We all as supporters want to walk away from a game knowing the outcome was as close to accurate as possible.

This means stopping the match clock.

It is not in anyway difficult what they are trying to do they are making it difficult.

They are making it ****.

On the flip side that would mean total inconsistency, careful what you wish for.

[Buzzo]

On the flip side that would mean total inconsistency, careful what you wish for.

I actually think these steps would end up with greater consistency. Trust themselves within the process. They are currently clearly scared to do so (the audio on the Spurs game tells us this much at least!), the 'why' of that is what leads to conspiracy theories.