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    #271
    Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
    I think the Jamaican police/pathologist may have ballsed it up. Like you I didn't but I'm starting to think they did.
    I suppose we'll see, or maybe we won't ever know the truth (which is what I expect), but there was more than one pathologist involved wasn't there?

    So what particular piece of evidence has caused you to change your thinking?
    Originally posted by Gordon Brown
    (1995)
    "A weak currency is the sign of a weak economy,which is the sign of a weak government"

    Comment

      #272
      Originally posted by Red Chilli View Post
      I suppose we'll see, or maybe we won't ever know the truth (which is what I expect), but there was more than one pathologist involved wasn't there?

      So what particular piece of evidence has caused you to change your thinking?
      I freely confess I haven't been following it closely so it's nothing more than gut feel based on rumour and sensationalist reports.

      It all just seems such a mess that the most likely explanation is the obvious one: overweight fiftysomething man in high stress job thousands of miles from home keels over in hotel room after suffering major heart attack.
      .
      Suppose you have a physicist and a sociologist standing at the side of a field, observing a set of events unfolding on the field. The physicist does [describes] it using the terminology of mass and velocity and frequency of radiation and the rest. And the sociologist does it by describing it as a rugby match.



      May the Lord bless this post.

      Comment

        #273
        Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
        I freely confess I haven't been following it closely so it's nothing more than gut feel based on rumour and sensationalist reports.

        It all just seems such a mess that the most likely explanation is the obvious one: overweight fiftysomething man in high stress job thousands of miles from home keels over in hotel room after suffering major heart attack.
        If he'd had a heart attack then the coronary occlusion would have been apparent at the post mortem (assuming that they looked for it).
        Woolmer was a big bloke, he was slightly overweight, but he also still took an active part in the coaching sessions of the Pakistan team. It seems strange to me that he has his heart attack the following morning from a match rather than 1)during a coaching session or in the immediate aftermath or 2) during the match or in the immediate aftermath i.e. at times of stress.
        Sudden heart attacks do happen but there would be a coronary occlusion identified.

        A few things seem strange about the whole thing:
        1) If there was ANY doubt, such that outside opinion had to be sought then why did they release the body for cremation?
        2) Immediately after it happened, Imran Khan was on worldwide TV saying 'it's obvious an ill man with uncontrolled diabetes (where did he get that from?) has died of a heart attack'. Then we get the reports that it was a murder after 2 people had looked at the body.
        3) Then after the event the Pakistan government send over their own investigation team (why? they have no power in SA)
        4) Thing get unofficially leaked to the press saying it wasn't murder.

        Now IF you had been asked for a professional opinion, by the Jamaican police, wouldn't you want to see the body? And wouldn't you report the findings directly to them instead of the press?
        I'm no expert in these procedures but common sense tells me it's a bit strange that these comments are being leaked to the press. Who sought the opinion of these Scotland Yard investigators? Was it the Jamaican police? Or was it someone else with a vested interest in causing suspicion and doubt about the competency of the investigators?

        Something is not right about all these press leaks.
        Originally posted by Gordon Brown
        (1995)
        "A weak currency is the sign of a weak economy,which is the sign of a weak government"

        Comment

          #274
          Originally posted by Red Chilli View Post
          If he'd had a heart attack then the coronary occlusion would have been apparent at the post mortem (assuming that they looked for it).
          Woolmer was a big bloke, he was slightly overweight, but he also still took an active part in the coaching sessions of the Pakistan team. It seems strange to me that he has his heart attack the following morning from a match rather than 1)during a coaching session or in the immediate aftermath or 2) during the match or in the immediate aftermath i.e. at times of stress.
          Sudden heart attacks do happen but there would be a coronary occlusion identified.

          A few things seem strange about the whole thing:
          1) If there was ANY doubt, such that outside opinion had to be sought then why did they release the body for cremation?
          2) Immediately after it happened, Imran Khan was on worldwide TV saying 'it's obvious an ill man with uncontrolled diabetes (where did he get that from?) has died of a heart attack'. Then we get the reports that it was a murder after 2 people had looked at the body.
          3) Then after the event the Pakistan government send over their own investigation team (why? they have no power in SA)
          4) Thing get unofficially leaked to the press saying it wasn't murder.

          Now IF you had been asked for a professional opinion, by the Jamaican police, wouldn't you want to see the body? And wouldn't you report the findings directly to them instead of the press?
          I'm no expert in these procedures but common sense tells me it's a bit strange that these comments are being leaked to the press. Who sought the opinion of these Scotland Yard investigators? Was it the Jamaican police? Or was it someone else with a vested interest in causing suspicion and doubt about the competency of the investigators?

          Something is not right about all these press leaks.
          Mark Shields used to work at Scotland Yard not Asda. He came to Scotland Yard asking for assistance. It's already been reported. I think people are looking for conspiracies that don't actually exist. This enquiry revolves around errors, incompetence, and too much talking to the media. It's not the X-files.

          Comment

            #275
            The truth is out there.
            .
            Suppose you have a physicist and a sociologist standing at the side of a field, observing a set of events unfolding on the field. The physicist does [describes] it using the terminology of mass and velocity and frequency of radiation and the rest. And the sociologist does it by describing it as a rugby match.



            May the Lord bless this post.

            Comment

              #276
              Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
              The truth is out there.
              Doo Doo Dooo Dooooo*

























              *That is supposed to be the X-Files music
              "Its not about the long ball or the short ball, its about the right ball." Bob Paisley

              Comment

                #277
                Originally posted by Red_Al_77 View Post
                Mark Shields used to work at Scotland Yard not Asda. He came to Scotland Yard asking for assistance. It's already been reported. I think people are looking for conspiracies that don't actually exist. This enquiry revolves around errors, incompetence, and too much talking to the media. It's not the X-files.
                Don't you think it's a bit poor and slightly unprofessional for Scotland Yard to leak their findings to the press?
                Apart from making the Jamaican police look incompetant, whether that's true or not, think about what it must be doing to the poor man's family.
                Originally posted by Gordon Brown
                (1995)
                "A weak currency is the sign of a weak economy,which is the sign of a weak government"

                Comment

                  #278
                  Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
                  The truth is out there.
                  ok....


                  i killed him!
                  In Rafa I Trust

                  Comment

                    #279
                    Not funny dee.
                    "Its not about the long ball or the short ball, its about the right ball." Bob Paisley

                    Comment

                      #280
                      It is now official - Jamaican Police say Bob Woolmer died of natural causes. What an absolute joke this investigation has been from beginning to end.

                      Mark Shields and his Department owe the Pakistani cricketers an apology. A shambles.
                      "Its not about the long ball or the short ball, its about the right ball." Bob Paisley

                      Comment

                        #281
                        Originally posted by looprevil View Post
                        It is now official - Jamaican Police say Bob Woolmer died of natural causes. What an absolute joke this investigation has been from beginning to end.

                        Mark Shields and his Department owe the Pakistani cricketers an apology. A shambles.
                        Agree, but they owe his wife and family a bigger apology. A lot of questions need to be asked of the pathologist. How do you get death by manual strangulation wrong?
                        Originally posted by Gordon Brown
                        (1995)
                        "A weak currency is the sign of a weak economy,which is the sign of a weak government"

                        Comment

                          #282
                          Seems to me that pretty much all of this should be down to the pathologist. If the pathologist says manual strangulation, the police surely have to go with that.

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