Australia Vs. India Test Series Thread

[Red Chilli]

No.

Because for them it's not a racist insult for Indians

But it is for Afro-Caribbeans, which Symonds is

[disco]

I am from India and my mom has called me a monkey infinite number of times while growing up. It is a commonly used for scolding misbehaving kids and is not considered racist in any way.

But that does not condone Bhajji if he had called symonds a monkey. When your in a different culture it is your responsibility to adhere to the customs of that culture. If he had actually called Symonds a monkey I would support let alone a 3 match even a 10 match ban as he should have had better sense.

But the question here is did he? Is there any proof. Considering the way the Indian team has campaigned in support of him I dont think so. I trust Sachin Tendulkar more than Ricky Ponting. Considering that there is no substantial evidence I think the ban was harsh.

And I hope Proctor will be equally harsh on Hogg.

I honestly think that's harsh - penalised for ignorance. He should be warned.

Or for consistency Hogg should be banned for 3 games.

[disco]

But it is for Afro-Caribbeans, which Symonds is

Well spotted, but you editted out my whole argument that it's ignorance, not racism

[disco]

I think we're going to go around in circles debating the finer points of racism/ignorance/insults/different cultures etc. so slightly different question :

Could this have been sorted out in the changing rooms/bar/meeting room, rather than getting the referee involved? You can probably guess my answer - without any doubt whatsoever. Just needed some understanding of other cultures - from both sides!

[tsb]

How can any right minded person criticise someone who highlights racial discrimination?

I'm not criticising him for highlighting the racism issue, he's looking out for his team and I would expect every captain to do what he did. As I said earlier, there are two issues which have emerged and what I'm criticising him for is dragging his talented team down by his own actions on the field (Waugh never acted like that). If the two issues have become clouded, I'm sorry (I did try to split them out).

[peekay]

I honestly think that's harsh - penalised for ignorance. He should be warned.

Or for consistency Hogg should be banned for 3 games.

Dunno about that mate. We will have to agree to disagree on that.

As for Hogg- he needs to be banned otherwise this series is a joke. If Hogg is not banned for a similar number of tests, I honestly cannot see this series proceeding.

[disco]

Dunno about that mate. We will have to agree to disagree on that.

As for Hogg- he needs to be banned otherwise this series is a joke. If Hogg is not banned for a similar number of tests, I honestly cannot see this series proceeding.

Fair enough, at least we're being consistent.

What beggars belief is how much other abuse goes on - ****, the Aussies have their own top 10 list of sledging insults which are incredibly offensive. But because this involves race there's a ban.

[MARTINOZ]

No.

Because for Indians it's not a racist insult

My only point about Symonds race is that if Singh didn't know then you can't even call him ignorant.

That is rubbish! So the crowd in India were making monkey gestures and monkey noises at Symonds, but it wasn't being racist, it was just calling him ugly. Pathetic argument mate and you know it. Singh if he did say it knew what it meant to Symonds.

[MARTINOZ]

But because this involves race there's a ban.

Please mate - stop now!

[disco]

That is rubbish! So the crowd in India were making monkey gestures and monkey noises at Symonds, but it wasn't being racist, it was just calling him ugly. Pathetic argument mate and you know it. Singh if he did say it knew what it meant to Symonds.

That's where we're going to have to disagree.

Do you think Hogg 'knew what it meant' to Singh? Just because ******* is a term of endearment in Australia, doesn't mean you can use in a culture where it's very offensive (and vice versa for Singh)

[disco]

Please mate - stop now!

Why? IMO there has been two insults thrown which are commonly used in their nations and aren't racist or particularly offensive in each person's nationality.

Someone of a different nationality, with different moral system has used their own system to decide ONE of the insults racist and deserved of a ban. We wait to see what happens with the other one. Can no-one see what's wrong with that?

As I said, it should have been sorted out behind the scenes, but that's not in the Aussies' interest.

BTW If Hogg gets banned I'll still stick up for him and say he was ignorant, not racist (or whatever phrase is used for terms very offensive, but not racist )

[Red Chilli]

Why? IMO there has been two insults thrown which are commonly used in their nations and aren't racist or particularly offensive in each person's nationality.

Someone of a different nationality, with different moral system has used their own system to decide ONE of the insults racist and deserved of a ban. We wait to see what happens with the other one. Can no-one see what's wrong with that?

As I said, it should have been sorted out behind the scenes, but that's not in the Aussies' interest.

BTW If Hogg gets banned I'll still stick up for him and say he was ignorant, not racist (or whatever phrase is used for terms very offensive, but not racist )

Calling someone a ******* is a tricky one. It may well have been true or Hogg might have thought it was true.
I doubt Harbs could have claimed that he thought Symmonds was actually a monkey

[disco]

Calling someone a ******* is a tricky one. It may well have been true or Hogg might have thought it was true.
I doubt Harbs could have claimed that he thought Symmonds was actually a monkey

Fair point

Anyway, think I've made my point enough times.

One thing we don't know is the manner and tone etc. that it was said - so we're all speculating to a degree. I'm giving Singh the benefit of the doubt. - we'd need camera or audio to even have a clue.

[Sir Bob]

I think to suggest Singh didn't know monkey would be an offensive term to Symonds is very very unlikely. However, the real issue is did Singh say it. Hemay or may not have done but to convict him on the players word only is very harsh and sets a very dangerous precident

[peekay]

I think to suggest Singh didn't know monkey would be an offensive term to Symonds is very very unlikely. However, the real issue is did Singh say it. Hemay or may not have done but to convict him on the players word only is very harsh and sets a very dangerous precident

Nail.Hit.Head.