The Wrestling Thread

[johnly]

Told you it was a crazy show.

You've gotta admit it was more interesting than Raw though!

Val's apparently going to be there for a bit, he had a match with Daniels at the tapings tonight.

I know what you mean about the main event... but it was still great. Not as good as Angle - Wolfe or Aj - Daniels from the last ppv, but very little is. Possibly too many false finishes, and perhaps the pace was off a bit, but it was still by a mile the best wrestling on either show last night. I almost think they went for the high speed, multiple big move sort-of bout just to provide a contrast to Orton's endless headlocks on raw. It worked for me anyway, not that I don't think the 2 of them can do better, but given the occasion etc it was pretty good.

As for giving away a PPV bout on free tv, well last night wasn't exactly a normal edition of impact either was it? I think that's probably why both the Wolfe - Pope and Abyss - Joe fights were so short though, especially the former, or the whole last hour would have been ppv quality.

Most importantly though, did you watch the knockouts tag Joe?

As for the NWO nonsense, I really really hope this doesn't go on long. I'm not convinced it will though, I can see Hogan/Bischoff turning on them quite soon or otherwise moving the story away from that. Hall & Waltmann's contracts are apparently very short term. You're totally right, that show was completely unsustainable going forward, they've got an awful lot of straightening out to do to make the show make sense to casual viewers, let alone everyone else, and have to be very careful not to lose what could make the company so good in favour of something that failed a decade ago.

Interestingly, from the tapings tonight, almost all the ring time looks like established tna guys rather than Hogan-inspired randoms. Joe v Wolfe sounds good. Tomko being AJ's attacker and getting a title shot less so. Young Bucks v Guns is a major win (even if "Generation Me" is an attrocious name), and best of all..... Angelina Love's back

Rumours also are that Gregory Helms and Matt Hardy are after their WWE releases to join Jeff and Shannon Moore in TNA.


Oh, and the ratings....

Overall, Impact did 1.5. That's pretty damn good, they usually get 1.0-1.1 on a Thursday with no competition. Raw was about 3.3.

The Hogan - Nwo segment around 9pm apparently rated over 2. Against HBK/Bret that's very strong.

It was possibly the most mental wrestling show I've seen in ages. They seemed to be using the 'throw everything and see what sticks' formula for this.

Mr. Towelman was good. Val can still talk and perform well enough. Pope's character has grown on me, I was worried when I heard Wolfe got beat, but it came off as a lucky win so not too damaging.

The steel asylum looks awful, unless the camera is inside, you can't really tell whats going on, it looks like a toy cage. The Jeff Hardy bit was cool, I think he's ****ed his chances of returning to WWE, who were planning a repeat of him and Punk later this year.

Womens stuff was great as always. Granted the divas are hotter, but they can't wrestle for ****

AJ/Angle, superb as you'd expect. The use of finishers was a bit giddy though.

The whole Hogan/NWO stuff better not last long. Hall looks pissed and pregnant and they just shouldn't be there.

Interesting to see how they go forward. Next week will be the big test, can they hold the rating? They need focus to keep it going properly. Oh and better cameramen/directors. They're still f'n awful

[Joe King]

Told you it was a crazy show.

You've gotta admit it was more interesting than Raw though!

Val's apparently going to be there for a bit, he had a match with Daniels at the tapings tonight.

I know what you mean about the main event... but it was still great. Not as good as Angle - Wolfe or Aj - Daniels from the last ppv, but very little is. Possibly too many false finishes, and perhaps the pace was off a bit, but it was still by a mile the best wrestling on either show last night. I almost think they went for the high speed, multiple big move sort-of bout just to provide a contrast to Orton's endless headlocks on raw. It worked for me anyway, not that I don't think the 2 of them can do better, but given the occasion etc it was pretty good.

As for giving away a PPV bout on free tv, well last night wasn't exactly a normal edition of impact either was it? I think that's probably why both the Wolfe - Pope and Abyss - Joe fights were so short though, especially the former, or the whole last hour would have been ppv quality.

Most importantly though, did you watch the knockouts tag Joe?

As for the NWO nonsense, I really really hope this doesn't go on long. I'm not convinced it will though, I can see Hogan/Bischoff turning on them quite soon or otherwise moving the story away from that. Hall & Waltmann's contracts are apparently very short term. You're totally right, that show was completely unsustainable going forward, they've got an awful lot of straightening out to do to make the show make sense to casual viewers, let alone everyone else, and have to be very careful not to lose what could make the company so good in favour of something that failed a decade ago.

Interestingly, from the tapings tonight, almost all the ring time looks like established tna guys rather than Hogan-inspired randoms. Joe v Wolfe sounds good. Tomko being AJ's attacker and getting a title shot less so. Young Bucks v Guns is a major win (even if "Generation Me" is an attrocious name), and best of all..... Angelina Love's back

Rumours also are that Gregory Helms and Matt Hardy are after their WWE releases to join Jeff and Shannon Moore in TNA.


Oh, and the ratings....

Overall, Impact did 1.5. That's pretty damn good, they usually get 1.0-1.1 on a Thursday with no competition. Raw was about 3.3.

The Hogan - Nwo segment around 9pm apparently rated over 2. Against HBK/Bret that's very strong.

It was crazy but far from interesting. I'm not a fan of Raw but at least there seems to be a direction going into Wrestlemania, never mind Royal Rumble. As johnly said, it's the old Bischoff approach of seeing what works and what doesn't.

I think if Bischoff is controlling the format, the X Division may suffer. The cruiserweight division in WCW was incredibly undermined with every show starting with a cruiserweight match and no progression for a lot of the wrestlers into other feuds besides Eddie Guerrero, Jericho and Mysterio.

I thought it would have made more sense to have a big six, eight man tag as the main event, clearly showing the faces and heels whilst Tenay and Taz explained the story.

Of course I didn't watch the knockout tag. Awesome Kong is vomit inducing.

What did you think of the crowd?

[MrMichael]

I was unconvinced. They were hot in a way... and the "this is bull****" chants at the end of the Asylum chaos were funny. However, there were a lot of quite obvious plants, and the Impact Zone is a crazy venue anyway, usually half the audience aren't wrestling fans.

The X-div's been in a rut for a while to be honest, same group of wrestlers doing the same spots, its great fun but its not what it was since the likes of Joe, Daniels and AJ moved up the card. Its inconsistently booked and consistently used to warm the crowd up more than anything else. That horrible steel asylum shows how badly that division has been used of late.

At least there's Guns v Bucks to save the day.

Dude, seriously, you'll watch dx and a midget skits, but you won't watch some proper women's wrestling? Awesome Kong is ****ing awesome. If Vince signed Awesome Kong I'd start watching wwe properly again, can you imagine the carnage? It would be hilarious. Anyway, Hamada was in that tag too, and she could have a good match against a corpse, let alone with Sarah Stock also in the ring.

[Joe King]

I seriously think they need to move from the Universal Studios, and start doing a roadshow across the East Coast in smaller venues of 1,500-2,000. Similar to what Raw did when it was initially launched in the mid 90s. Planted crowd, especially all the ones wearing the yellow t shirts, seriously got on my nerves, including the girl doing the loser sign That was ridiculous.

Homicide must have been trapped at the top for nearly a minute. That was scary.

I don't know why the WWE feel the need of having comedy skits. There is no need with boring people like Triple H doing it. A few weeks back, Jericho and Show had a brilliant segment where they acted out as if they were breaking up like a couple. They are genuine actors in that sense.

[refugee]

There were some good matches out there especially the main event. Good match but then why should I buy the PPV? I've already seen the damn match and the match didn't really progress the storyline. Bad move in that sense. I could be critical about the narrative of the match and how they didn't manage the tempo nor did they sell any of the big moves, I was never convinced for large parts after Styles attempt 343 Styles Clash's that Angle would lie for the three. Too many big moves, is what I'm saying.

I know what you are saying but I think you are wrong about this. Because of the increased exposure, TNA were obviously expecting a number of new viewers who aren't aware of the existing storylines. They needed to put on a good match to maximise the chances of them tuning in next week. Once the new viewers know what the wrestlers are capable of then they will be more willing to follow the storylines and buy the ppv.

[Joe King]

I know what you are saying but I think you are wrong about this. Because of the increased exposure, TNA were obviously expecting a number of new viewers who aren't aware of the existing storylines. They needed to put on a good match to maximise the chances of them tuning in next week. Once the new viewers know what the wrestlers are capable of then they will be more willing to follow the storylines and buy the ppv.

I'll put it to you like this. They've pre-taped Impact already, something like nine days before transmission, which in itself is weird. That Impact is three days before Genesis and surely no storyline can be built within one show enough for me (or the US audience) to care enough to buy the PPV. If TNA wanted maximum exposure, they should have put Joe, Styles, Daniels (by the way had 30 secs of air time), Angle, Wolf (disgustingly buried), Pope, Abyss, Rhino in a series of good, lengthy matches which help build the brand and illustrate how it differentiates to WWE and their huge focus on boring promos and goofy comedy.

Instead, TNA predictably went down the WCW route and had all the big chums delivering stupid, boring, long ass promos which mean nothing to me. The irony of Hogan saying he wants to push 'younger talent' but wasting nearly twenty minutes was unbelievable and also Jarrett as well. It was absolute bull****. Time wasted when they could have showcased Beer Money (the best tag team in the industry) rather than having them been beaten up by:

Tyson ****ing Tomko

The Nasty Boyz featured more than Beer Money. What a ****ing joke.

[MrMichael]

Maybe.

Or maybe everyone would have switched over to watch Brett Hart.

You know I agree with you about the wrestling. I also like a well done backstage angle, but in many respects that show was a dreadful mishmash of worked shoots, uninteresting randoms and messed up matches. However, I found it compelling viewing, and in general both the smarks and the viewing public agreed. Apparently the numbers were good enough Spike might go for a regular Monday night live slot. They have to go live, and they need a second show. Then they can start trying to provide a real alternative.

They've got a lot of fresh talent there; Wolfe, Joe, Aj, Daniels, Dinero, Morgan, Hernandez, Beer Money, Brits, MCMG - and some vets that are great workers and have been putting the young guys over. Bischoff's no fool, this month and this ppv is a bit of a write off, they'll use it to change set & production, dump a few angles and set up a few more. Lots of existing story was a mashup, and Russo's still involved so..... Talk of more debuts at the ppv will keep buyrates up where they have been, the issue on Monday was letting more casual fans know they exist.

BTW, don't forget they don't often go live on Impact, and a lot more went on in that show than does on a ppv. I think Pope v Wolfe was supposed to get more time but got cut short, and I know there were a few other borks in the show. Especially the way Jarrett came over - he's supposed to be more heelish himself.

[Joe King]

Maybe.

Or maybe everyone would have switched over to watch Brett Hart.

You know I agree with you about the wrestling. I also like a well done backstage angle, but in many respects that show was a dreadful mishmash of worked shoots, uninteresting randoms and messed up matches. However, I found it compelling viewing, and in general both the smarks and the viewing public agreed. Apparently the numbers were good enough Spike might go for a regular Monday night live slot. They have to go live, and they need a second show. Then they can start trying to provide a real alternative.

They've got a lot of fresh talent there; Wolfe, Joe, Aj, Daniels, Dinero, Morgan, Hernandez, Beer Money, Brits, MCMG - and some vets that are great workers and have been putting the young guys over. Bischoff's no fool, this month and this ppv is a bit of a write off, they'll use it to change set & production, dump a few angles and set up a few more. Lots of existing story was a mashup, and Russo's still involved so..... Talk of more debuts at the ppv will keep buyrates up where they have been, the issue on Monday was letting more casual fans know they exist.

BTW, don't forget they don't often go live on Impact, and a lot more went on in that show than does on a ppv. I think Pope v Wolfe was supposed to get more time but got cut short, and I know there were a few other borks in the show. Especially the way Jarrett came over - he's supposed to be more heelish himself.

To be honest, during the period where Michaels and Hart were in the ring, Impact was always going to lose. It was the most compelling promo I've seen in a long time and it was given by two of the best ring performers I've ever seen in the States.

I've seen bad Impacts in the past - god knows how many times I've felt like gouging my own eyes out with a Stanley knife after some rubbish finishes and nonsensical and inconsistent bookings and storywriting - this, in that sense, wasn't one of them. I feel if UFC Unleashed does a better rating than Raw and it could well do, even though Tyson's hosting, UFC has a better chance of going to Monday nights. MMA at the moment it's at its peak and given free good matches could help compliment PPV buyrates. If Impact was given the green light and go Monday nights, the booking has to be seriously so much better and air time needs to be given to the TNA originals rather than your washed up individuals who won't stick around for a long time.

I like how you say 'Bischoff's no fool' He is a bit of an idiot when he has general stroke along with Hogan. At the moment, the most sane man in writing is Vince Russo

I've been told , if TNA does 1.2 on Thursdays, which wasn't publicised as much for new viewers to Impact, as we are heading into the Rumble and Wrestlemania, they could well face Raw come the summer months.

[johnly]

To be honest, during the period where Michaels and Hart were in the ring, Impact was always going to lose. It was the most compelling promo I've seen in a long time and it was given by two of the best ring performers I've ever seen in the States.

I've seen bad Impacts in the past - god knows how many times I've felt like gouging my own eyes out with a Stanley knife after some rubbish finishes and nonsensical and inconsistent bookings and storywriting - this, in that sense, wasn't one of them. I feel if UFC Unleashed does a better rating than Raw and it could well do, even though Tyson's hosting, UFC has a better chance of going to Monday nights. MMA at the moment it's at its peak and given free good matches could help compliment PPV buyrates. If Impact was given the green light and go Monday nights, the booking has to be seriously so much better and air time needs to be given to the TNA originals rather than your washed up individuals who won't stick around for a long time.

I like how you say 'Bischoff's no fool' He is a bit of an idiot when he has general stroke along with Hogan. At the moment, the most sane man in writing is Vince Russo

I've been told , if TNA does 1.2 on Thursdays, which wasn't publicised as much for new viewers to Impact, as we are heading into the Rumble and Wrestlemania, they could well face Raw come the summer months.

The return of the monday night wars is exactly what Hogan/Bischoff want. they'll really push for these figures. They've got the talent there, they just need to pick the bits that stick out of the aformentioned throw everything at it method and they could get going well. Decent directors/cameramen/scriptwriters are a good start. There were some serious continuity problems on that show, (Hogan's motorcade being shown every 5 seconds, then him coming out saying he'd "been in the back all day") Cut out the **** and promote the hell out of the shows, get the buyrates and then they can be considered serious competition. Also get rid of Bubba the Love Sponge. I work in radio, I present, I would never dream of doing TV cos there's only a few that can crossover. It's a different style or presenting or in this case reporting. He was trying to be Bubba the radio guy, not Bubba the backstage reporter.

On the other side of the coin, I hope the Vince/Bret stuff picks up momentum fast. It will be a spectacle that's for sure

[Joe King]

Which radio station do you work for? I do uni radio, very rarely now.

Vince/Bret have three months, no rush IMO.

[johnly]

Which radio station do you work for? I do uni radio, very rarely now.

Vince/Bret have three months, no rush IMO.

Work for 2 mate, Galaxy and Pennine FM in Hudderfield. Present Sat breakfast and Sunday afternoons on Pennine and produce and stuff at Galaxy.

Vince/Bret will get there, this storyline is big time it'll come off in the end.

[Joe King]

Work for 2 mate, Galaxy and Pennine FM in Hudderfield. Present Sat breakfast and Sunday afternoons on Pennine and produce and stuff at Galaxy.

Vince/Bret will get there, this storyline is big time it'll come off in the end.

If ever I needed to describe an internet wrestling fan, it would be you having seen your pic

[johnly]

If ever I needed to describe an internet wrestling fan, it would be you having seen your pic

Ha! How rude. Forced poses mate, forces poses

[Jayesh87]

what time is RAW on sky tonight?

[johnly]

what time is RAW on sky tonight?

9 I think mate