F1 Thread

[Gaz]

After thinking about it a bit more do you think Vettel had one eye on being behind Webber in the Drivers Championship and maybe wondering if he would have to play second fiddle this season if he ended up pulling out a big enough gap?

No matter what anyone thinks he is undoubtedly their number 1 driver but we've seen bigger teams back other drivers in the past, think back to 2008 Raikonnen was World Champion but had to back Massa as the number 1 Ferrari Driver in the title race against Hamilton.

I just don't think his ego could take it, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, after all it's made him a Triple World Champion

[RichC]

I wouldn't be surprised, no F1 driver wants to be playing catch up to their teammate and although very early in the season a couple more results in Webbers favour might have started the team thinking about putting more time into Webbers chances.

I guess in F1 you have to have immense belief in yourself and do what you must to be Number 1 in your team.

[Gaz]

Agreed, the more I think about it the more I see similarities to the Senna\Prost rivalry which could make things very interesting this season

[G]

Let's not forget Webber was leading Vettel in the 2010 championship at the last race and Vettel got where they needed him to be to jump him and Alonso. As a team I'd imagine they'd let them race to the bitter end, whether Vettel could handle that is another thing

[Daniel 7]

[Chazza]

Happy campers.

[Daniel 7]

Agreed, the more I think about it the more I see similarities to the Senna\Prost rivalry which could make things very interesting this season

Senna / Prost is an obvious comparison but not strictly accurate. Those two were the undoubted best drivers in F1 and there was a genuine dispute as to who was the best driver in the world at that time, let alone who was going to be the lead driver at McLaren.

Vettel and Webber aren't the best two drivers on the grid, they're bickering team mates. Vettel is indulged and has been for years, he's ruining his own credibility, which is a pity, because he is a genuinely fast and very talented driver.

What affects his legacy is that he's being drawn into a squabble with a driver he should be able to dominate legitimately.

[Daniel 7]

The other one to remember is that might have been a bit of revenge for Webber closing off Vettel in the title decider last season - it worked out for Vettel and he ended up with the championship, but not without being nearly put into the wall by his team mate first

[Chazza]

Mark Webber, Sebastian Vettel must part in 2014 - Flavio Briatore

Mark Webber and Sebastian Vettel's Red Bull partnership cannot continue into 2014, reckons ex-Formula 1 team boss Flavio Briatore, who has been part of Webber's management throughout his F1 career.

Vettel's current contract runs to the end of 2014, while Webber's deal is for this year only at present.

Briatore believes Vettel's decision to pass Webber for Malaysian Grand Prix victory despite Red Bull ordering them to hold station with the Australian ahead destroys the relationship between the team-mates and could cost them the championship.

"I think there's no relationship anymore," Briatore told RAI Radio.

"It was already very formal beforehand between the two Red Bull drivers, that was very clear last year.

"Now Vettel says he will help Mark, but Mark doesn't need any help. He should have won the race, and it's possible that Vettel will win every other race.

"I don't think this relationship can be fixed. They are two professionals, they will win races and so on, but it's unthinkable that Mark may help Vettel in the future and I don't think Vettel will help Mark.

"So we'll have two enemies inside a single team, and this will hopefully advantage Ferrari."

Asked if he now expected Webber or Vettel to leave Red Bull after 2013, Briatore replied: "That's for sure. Last year, already, there were problems.

"Their car is very competitive so drivers want to stay there, but [Sepang] was proof that no one is in charge at Red Bull.

"Vettel is the boss there. You can't have a team manager also doing the driving."

Briatore accused Red Bull team boss Christian Horner of weakness, alleging that the power balance between Horner, technical director Adrian Newey, Red Bull advisor Helmut Marko and company chief Dietrich Mateschitz is flawed.

"If there was a manager with balls, he would have had them switch positions again," said Briatore.

"The problem is that there are two people with different ideas on the pit wall, with Helmut behind them doing the talking with Mateschitz, so you understand they are all scared."

He also criticised the fact that Newey was on the podium rather than Horner.

"Normally the team principal goes on the podium at the first race win of the season," said Briatore.

"Christian didn't even have the strength to get on the podium - because they're terrified with a driver in charge instead of the team manager. You'd first go yourself if you win the championship or the first race, and after that you'd send race engineers or your technical director.

"The fact that Christian didn't go on the podium after scoring a one-two says a lot about his weakness compared to the others."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/106393

[RichC]

I see Vettel has been incredibly contrite about the last race then! :sha

Gives Horner a problem as I fancy the guy above Horner has backed Vettel in all of this

Sebastian Vettel: I may disobey Red Bull orders again

Red Bull's Sebastian Vettel says he would "probably" ignore team orders again if he was instructed not to challenge team-mate Mark Webber.

Vettel was asked if he would repeat his actions from the Malaysian Grand Prix.

He said: "I'm not sure I can give a proper answer because in the moment it might be different but I would probably do the same."

Vettel added his move was "indirectly" a form of payback for what he said was a lack of past support from Webber.

Vettel said: "I never had support from his side. I have a lot of support from the team and think they are supporting both of us the same way. I respect Mark as a racing driver but there was more than one occasion in the past when he could have helped the team and he didn't."

Vettel was asked if he was getting revenge for Webber being less than helpful in last year's title-deciding race in Brazil, when Webber appeared to be obstructive twice despite being told by the team to help Vettel in his championship battle with Ferrari's Fernando Alonso.
The German replied: "Probably you could say indirectly so."

Vettel did not mention the several times in the past that Webber has obeyed team orders not to challenge Vettel, even when he felt he was faster and was himself a title contender - as for example in Canada, Japan and Brazil in 2010.

Asked if he would have given the place back had team principal Christian Horner ordered him to do so over the radio, Vettel said: "I didn't mean to ignore the team's order. I heard it, but I didn't understand it the proper way. I apologised for that.
"Had I understood, I think (if) I had thought about it and reflected on what leaving Mark in first place meant, I probably would have done the same thing because Mark doesn't deserve that."

Vettel explained that he did not initially understand the team's message "Multi 21" - a coded team order for Webber (car number two) to finish ahead of Vettel (car number one).

Webber experienced the same confusion in Brazil last year, when he was given the message "Multi 12" - an order for Vettel to finish ahead of Webber.

Vettel said he had not been punished by the team.

"I did speak up and apologise," he said. "Sanction, punishment, what do you expect to happen? We dealt with it internally. I did apologise to the team as soon as I could, the whole team, not just the people working here."

He admitted his actions had undermined Horner's authority.

"You could say so," Vettel said, "but I went to talk to everyone straight afterwards. The intention was not to undermine the team principal."

When it was suggested Horner was no longer in control of the team, Vettel said: "That is not right. He is the boss, he is in control of all the employees. I am not in any other position than I am. I am the driver."

Webber said everything was "fine" within the team.

He added: "For me it's not an unusual situation and I'm looking forward to racing here this weekend and getting on with it.

"When you're at the front in Formula 1 there's always stuff going down, so it just depends on how much is going down that you've got to manage.

"I'm looking forward to driving the car here, putting it in first gear and driving out of the garage and getting down there to feel what the car's like on the circuit."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22106490

[Sarb]

Vettel has a serious lack of class. I'd love him to go to Ferrari and team-up with Alonso. He's always been no. 1 at Red Bull so he's talking absolute crap as to a lack of support. He's been given everything to be able to win the title. In a team of Alonso and Vettel there is no way he would get the preferential treatment...let's see how he does then.

Can't stand the guy

[Jas]

Vettel has a serious lack of class. I'd love him to go to Ferrari and team-up with Alonso. He's always been no. 1 at Red Bull so he's talking absolute crap as to a lack of support. He's been given everything to be able to win the title. In a team of Alonso and Vettel there is no way he would get the preferential treatment...let's see how he does then.

Can't stand the guy

[RichC]

I see Red Bull have decided to reduce team orders! Sounds like the owner has told Horner how he wants it going forwards

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22109935

[RichC]

Vettel has a serious lack of class. I'd love him to go to Ferrari and team-up with Alonso. He's always been no. 1 at Red Bull so he's talking absolute crap as to a lack of support. He's been given everything to be able to win the title. In a team of Alonso and Vettel there is no way he would get the preferential treatment...let's see how he does then.

Can't stand the guy

Id imagine a distant 2nd in the same car as Alonso

[Aj34]

I love f1 but something needs to be done to spice it up a bit. Bring back refuelling just as a start. I. Agree vettel is a ****** but he's a winning ****** can see him winning many more championships ( unfortunately )