Originally posted by Shaggy
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Yep, although i meant more that he lashed out with that text about Strauss, by then he knew what was going on with Twitter, yet noone not even his capatin took it in hand, he felt he wasn't wanted or respected by certain senior players and was even being ridiculed by them. -
Pietersen is clearly a knob and not blameless in this. But it's interesting reading this thread and comparing it to the Roy Keane discussion in the other thread.
If successive England captains and management couldn't handle Pietersen, who is essentially just self-obsessed, arrogant and remarkably whiney, can you imagine what would happen if English cricket ever produced a Roy Keane type, pent up ball of rage?
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Alastair Cook: Kevin Pietersen claims have 'tarnished' England's successful era under Andy Flower
England captain Alastair Cook has spoken for the first time about Kevin Pietersen's explosive book and denied there was a bullying culture in the team
Kevin Pietersen’s claims of a bullying culture in the dressing room have “tarnished” the Andy Flower era according to England captain Alastair Cook.
Pietersen’s autobiography, published this week, was highly critical of Flower’s reign as coach and singled out several players for criticism, including wicketkeeper Matt Prior.
But Cook has defended former captain Andrew Strauss and Flower, who was in charge when England won three Ashes series and reached No 1, and denied there was a bullying culture.
Speaking for the first time about Pietersen’s allegations, Cook told the BBC: “It's been a really sad week for cricket. After talking to quite a few of my team-mates on the England team, we have to draw a line under it at some stage and this is a good time to do that.
“I am very proud of the era I have played in; to win three Ashes, to become the best side in the world; to play with some great players. I really only have fond memories of that.
“I am incredibly proud to have contributed in that period. To play under Andrew Strauss, to have played under Andy Flower as coach, I have only got respect for these guys. I do believe that era has been tarnished, and I am sad about that.
“I have known Andy since the Essex dressing room, when he took me under his wing as a player. Obviously, your relationship changes as a coach and captain and I only have respect for him as a man, and as a coach.
"He was an amazing coach for our side. Chatting to some of the guys about it, they feel the same; a lot of the success was down to his drive and determination to make us a tough England side.”
Pietersen highlighted in his book the way in which senior bowlers such as James Anderson, Stuart Broad and Graeme Swann would turn on players for misfields and dropped catches.
Cook said there were times when players overstepped the mark, but strongly denied the accusation of bullying.
“International cricket is a tough place and as a team you are striving for excellence at all times,” he said.
“Certainly at some stages those frustrations probably boiled over more than they should have done, but that was only people desperate to succeed and wanting to know the other 10 blokes around them were committed 100 per cent to them.
“Did it over step the mark a couple of times? Possibly, but we addressed those issues — this is something that always happens in teams. It certainly wasn’t a ‘bullying environment’ at all in my eyes.
"As the captain over the last couple of years, I have tried to make it as successful as I can for the young players coming in and to make them feel comfortable.
"International cricket is a tough environment to perform in compared to county cricket because of the level of scrutiny. It's a big step up and it is a tough environment."
Cook also defended Prior against the heavy criticism leveled at him by Pietersen.
"That was probably the biggest shock for me. He is a great man who has been a fantastic servant for English cricket," Cook said.
"Hopefully if he can get through his really nasty injury, we could see him again in an England shirt. He has to be remembered as a guy who put his heart and soul on the line for England all the time, and the team was all that mattered to him.
"He has put everything into the England shirt and he should be incredibly proud of that.”Comment
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Why does cook want prior playing for England?Comment
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He likes Prior to do all the talking as his number 2 as he can't communicate very well.
Apparently.Comment
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The silence is deafening
Ten days have now passed since the confidentiality agreement expired and still the ECB haven’t told us why they sacked Kevin Pietersen.
What are they waiting for?
Huge significance was attached to the lifting of Pietersen’s gagging clause. What would he say? And now he’s said it, what does it mean?
But amid all the heat and noise around his book (see our review by Tregaskis), it’s been slightly overlooked that the ECB themselves are now also free to speak. They can tell us what happened, openly and fully.
Surely they have something of great import to say. Only last week, Paul Downton told Mike Atherton in The Times that he “really didn’t see any alternative” to firing the leading run scorer in English cricket history.
You can only sympathise with the ECB, who all this time have been yearning to reveal all to their dearly-valued supporters. How they’ve longed to open up and get everything off their chests. If only it hadn’t been for that pesky confidentiality agreement getting in the way. What a nuisance!
We’ve all sensed their frustration at being – until now – unable to tell us exactly why they jettisoned Pietersen. When Paul Downton appeared on Test Match Special on 22nd May, he explained that the legal position limited what he could say. Seven weeks earlier, on 1st April, it was clear that Alastair Cook was champing at the bit to reveal all:
“I can’t actually answer that question totally at this precise moment in time, which is incredibly frustrating for me. Everyone will say I’m sitting on the fence but there are a number of reasons which will become clearer soon.
“You have to respect the decision, the position I’m in at this precise moment. Everyone is going to keep asking that question until we give the answers but at the moment we just can’t, so I’d love to talk about something slightly different if possible.
“It is frustrating. If anyone thinks the decision was taken lightly and without a lot of consideration and a lot of thought…a lot of things went into the decision. It was a tough decision and the decisions will be made clearer in due course, and you just have to respect that at the moment. It is frustrating but that is the position I’m in at the moment and that is what it is.”
Ever since February 4th, while we’ve fuminated and speculated, ECB sympathisers have always been able to say, ‘but you haven’t heard the other side of the story…they must have had their reasons’. Implicit in the ECB’s stance, and repeated references to the gagging clause, was the notion – almost a guarantee – that as soon as the embargo was lifted, they would speak.
Ten days have passed. Nothing.
Why does it matter? Because the ECB’s failure to explain goes to the very heart of this entire saga.
We were angry – we are still angry – because Paul Downton and Giles Clarke sacked our best player without telling us why. As they saw it, there was no need to explain to supporters – the people who are the very lifeblood of the game – why such an important cricketer had been summarily and permanently removed from the side.
There are two reasons why they haven’t told us.
The first is that they have nothing to say which would be remotely convincing or satisfactory. As the dossier, revealed, the ECB had no genuine reasons for firing Pietersen, beyond ill-defined dislike and Flower’s personal grudge.
Even Paul Downton is not quite so naive that he’d go into a press conference and talk about whistling and looking out of windows.
The second reason is much more profound. The ECB remain silent because they simply don’t see the need to tell supporters anything of substance unless it involves Waitrose or Buxton Water. We serve no purpose other than to keep quiet and buy the tickets. We should know our place and be grateful.
Giles Clarke holds us in contempt. Supporters are at best an irrelevance and at worst a bloody pain in the neck. Do you think he’s spent the last few days fretting about what we think?
This is what I wrote two days after Pietersen was sacked. Eight months on, I stand by every word. Have a read and tell me if I was exaggerating.
This is has been the most tumultuous week imaginable for English cricket, and what do the ECB want to tell us about? What’s on their minds? Take a look at their news site, and the big story is that renowned cricket enthusiasts the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge have been awarded life membership of the MCC. Congrats, Kate and Wills!
What have the ECB deigned to say? Dark Lord Downton has spoken twice about Pietersen, firstly at the Moores press conference, when he thanked the professional journalists for attending but forgot to address the punters who actually pay all their wages.
The best he could come up with was the ‘disinterested and disengaged’ twaddle which he then largely repeated on TMS a month later, an appearance so successful he ended up apologising to Pietersen, and mendaciously claimed that Pietersen had no supporters in the dressing room.
What else? Giles Clarke’s single reference to an affair came in the form of a third-person order:
English supporters must move on. There isn’t going to be any going back, that’s for sure.
And apart from that, nothing, save their infamous press release of 9th February. This was, as Dmitri Old acutely puts it, cricket’s Ratner moment, “the day they betrayed what they really felt about those not in positions of decision making, or close to the right kind of families”.
It was also masterpiece of self-pity and sour hostility.
It has been a matter of great frustration that until now the England and Wales Cricket Board has been unable to respond to the unwarranted and unpleasant criticism of England players and the ECB itself, which has provided an unwelcome backdrop to the recent negotiations to release Kevin Pietersen from his central contract.
Those negotiations have been successfully concluded and whilst both parties remain bound by confidentiality provisions the ECB would like to make the following comments.
The ECB recognises the significant contribution Kevin has made to England teams over the last decade. He has played some of the finest innings ever produced by an England batsman.
However, the England team needs to rebuild after the whitewash in Australia. To do that we must invest in our captain Alastair Cook and we must support him in creating a culture in which we can be confident he will have the full support of all players, with everyone pulling in the same direction and able to trust each other. It is for those reasons that we have decided to move on without Kevin Pietersen.
Following the announcement of that decision, allegations have been made, some from people outside cricket, which as well as attacking the rationale of the ECB’s decision-making, have questioned, without justification, the integrity of the England Team Director and some of England’s players.
Clearly what happens in the dressing room or team meetings should remain in that environment and not be distributed to people not connected with the team. This is a core principle of any sports team, and any such action would constitute a breach of trust and team ethics.
Whilst respecting that principle, it is important to stress that Andy Flower, Alastair Cook and Matt Prior, who have all been singled out for uninformed and unwarranted criticism, retain the total confidence and respect of all the other members of the Ashes party.
These are men who care deeply about the fortunes of the England team and its image, and it is ironic that they were the people who led the reintegration of Kevin Pietersen into the England squad in 2012.
Eight months later, and nothing has changed. The ECB remain arrogantly aloof and aggressively detached from the people whose support alone sustains the game of which they are merely the temporary custodians, and not, as they believe, the proprietors.
We have been disenfranchised, patronised, and exploited. This is why we became angry and why we continue to be angry. Not because of one man but forf what his assassination symbolised. We know that Pietersen will never return to the side but that is completely besides the point. We want them to listen, to apologise, and to respond. Until then we cannot move on. Because nothing has changed.
All you need is baby steps, Giles. Just tell us why you fired him. Is it really that difficult?
You thought this would all blow over and after a few months and a win against India, we’d just forget about it. You were wrong.Comment
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Steve Harmison backs Kevin Pietersen over England ‘bullying’ claims
Steve Harmison believes Ashley Giles missed out on the England coach’s job because of his relationship with Kevin Pietersen and has backed up his former team-mate’s claims that there was a culture of bullying in the dressing room.
Peter Moores was named as Andy Flower’s replacement in April and, in Harmison’s view, Giles was overlooked because of his support for Pietersen, who was sacked by the ECB eight months ago.
“I think that cost Ashley Giles the coach’s job,” the former bowler wrote in a column for the Newcastle Chronicle. “I saw Ash the other day and it’s great he is still in cricket with a great job at Lancashire, but his relationship with KP will have cost him the big one.
“He would have walked into that interview and told the ECB; ‘I know KP, I played with him and I’ll get the best from him. We need the guy.’ That sealed his fate. The ECB should have been upfront with Ashley about their plans for Kevin.”
Pietersen alleged in his new book, which was released last week, that the wicketkeeper Matt Prior and senior bowlers Jimmy Anderson, Stuart Broad and Graeme Swann would force team-mates to apologise for misfields and dropped catches during matches. While those accusations have been denied by Swann and Prior, Harmison said he was aware of divisions within the team and that not enough was done to stop it, although he did not feel that Pietersen was a victim of bullying despite his hurt over the controversial @KPgenius Twitter account.
“The culture of bullying, if you want to call it that, had to be nipped in the bud,” Harmison said. “It wasn’t. That was a big mistake. It was allowed to go on and on, until Kevin clearly believed the other senior players were against him. However, I struggle a bit to see Kevin Pietersen as a bullying victim. That’s hard to picture.
“I’m not saying he was a bully but I saw for myself the way he could behave towards guys that ‘weren’t up to it’. He didn’t give James Taylor or Michael Carberry much of a chance. KP wasn’t afraid to criticise.”
Harmison said he did not like the way some players behaved. “I saw plenty of bowlers have a real go at a team-mate for a dropped catch or a misfield,” he said. “I was never a fan of that. I didn’t do it. Is that bullying? I’m not so sure. Although it’s not nice to be given a rollocking either out on the field or back in the dressing room. Kevin does have a point here. Looking from outside, I didn’t like the way the players behaved at times and they did cross a line.
“The senior players should have dealt with this. They would have in my day. When that went on, and it did at times, myself or Andrew Flintoff would have a word in the ear of someone who was letting off steam.”
But David Collier, the former chief executive of the England and Wales Cricket Board, told BBC Radio 5 Live it would not have been possible for England to enjoy so much success over the last decade had Pietersen’s claims had any substance to them.
“No accusation of bullying was ever made to me,” he said. “In any professional sport certain managers and leaders do have intensity from time to time. People that we respect as some of the greatest football managers have been known to be fairly robust in dressing rooms. Andy [Flower] is an intensely passionate man, he has the most superb integrity.
“There is no way we could have had the success over his long and successful period if there hadn’t been huge respect within that dressing room.”Comment
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Gooch called Swann a coward for leaving the Ashes early and said his actions made the team a laughing stock.Comment
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Trott back in the Lions Squad for the 2015 tour of South Africa.
Mixed feelings on if I want him straight back in the side after that. Ballance has been doing really well at 3. So I dont know if there is a place for him. However, maybe he will be asked to open? Could see that.*Except Michael, who died.Comment
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I don't understand why Ballance is in the Lions squad?
Thanks very much for being ‘This Mornings’ Farmer’Comment
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I guess its because he isnt going to the WC? Keeps him playing.
Either that, or its so they can look at Trott, Ballance and Robson together? Then they can pick 2 from the 3?*Except Michael, who died.Comment
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Read a really interesting article in this months edition of The Cricketer about stats that should be used in cricket.
One of them suggested is the plus/minus - a measure of player's defensive liabilities against offensive output - which is an established stat in ice hockey. The article suggests that in cricket this could be an essential evaluation tool for wicketkeepers. They applied this method to the Indian series from the summer:
In the first two tests Matt Prior conceded 159 runs (46 byes and 113 extra runs off four dropped chances) and scored 40. So his plus/minus per Test was a terrible -59.50 which when you consider India beat us by 95 runs at Lord's was quite a significant contributing factor!
In contrast, Jos Buttler conceded 45 byes and 15 runs off one missed chance, and scored 200 runs in the next three Tests. So Buttler contributed +46.67 per Test. Comparing the two shows that Buttler's selection resulted in a 106 run positive swing per Test!!!! So arguably England might have won the series 4-0 had he played the whole series.
For India, Dhoni scored 349 in five Tests, the second highest of the team, however he conceded 210 runs - 56 byes and 154 runs in four missed opportunities (two catches, one stumping and a run-out) which made his net contribution +27.80 per Test, about 20 fewer than Buttler. This reflects poorly on his wicketkeeping, particularly because England batted in only 7 out of a possible ten innings in the series!!!
In summary then: Buttler > The Big CheeseComment
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The Big Cheese can **** off
Thanks very much for being ‘This Mornings’ Farmer’Comment
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I laughed too when I read it. The stats make The Big Cheese look ridiculously bad, he was nothing short of a liability. A 106 run positive swing from dropping himOriginally posted by Shaggy View Post
The Big Cheese can **** off
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Pakistan just clinched a 2 nil series whitewash v Australia. So proud of this nomadic team who are now up to 3rd in the test rankings.
"Its not about the long ball or the short ball, its about the right ball." Bob PaisleyComment
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