Voronin: Chelsea captain Terry a jerk!

[dww]

21.05.10 | tribalfootball.com

Dynamo Moscow striker Andriy Voronin has slammed Chelsea captain John Terry.

The former Liverpool forward went under the knife this week to correct a nose injury suffered when Terry's flailing arm smashed into his face during England's 2-1 win against Ukraine at Wembley last year.

"Terry couldn't clear the ball cleanly, so hit me in the face," he said. "Jerk! In my opinion, he did it deliberately. Terry is capable of wickedness. As are Jamie Carragher and Rio Ferdinand. They are the masters."

On his time in England, Voronin added: "In England it's carnage. If in a match one of the players doesn't bleed, doesn't smash his head in a collision or lose his leg, the fans feel cheated - the game was a failure.

"It's a crazy pace from the first minute to the final whistle. Complete dedication, tremendous atmosphere in the stadiums, but the tactics of most teams are simple in the extreme: throw the ball 50 yards up the pitch and then mob rush up to the opposition goal to score."

[dww]

He is certainly right about Terry

Does however give an insight into why he wasn't a success in the PL.

I do wonder if the concentration on being hard over tactically adept has had a negative effect this season in particular on PL defensive quality. For whatever reason players seemed less physically fit almost across the league this season and it resulted in some pretty awful defensive displays. It was notable how much fitter Bayern looked in the CL than the English teams and in other games too PL teams didn't have the advantage in that area that they have seemed to in recent seasons.

[-V-]

Andriy who?

Btw whatever happened to Rafa's famous tactic of only signing players with the right mentality? Did he completely abandon it a few years ago?

[Exiled_red]

I don't think many on here will argue about Terry

[Guest]

He's also right about the tactics as well. It's 'gung-ho' football at its best.

[Leyton388]

**** player and knobhead just like terry then!

[Maxiedge]

Andriy who?

Btw whatever happened to Rafa's famous tactic of only signing players with the right mentality? Did he completely abandon it a few years ago?

I think thats a very good point mate. Add Riera to that list. Bellamy, Pennant...

[Vermilion]

Andriy who?

Btw whatever happened to Rafa's famous tactic of only signing players with the right mentality? Did he completely abandon it a few years ago?

I think thats a very good point mate. Add Riera to that list. Bellamy, Pennant...

Try to sign players with the right menality...TRY! He's never said we "only" sign players with the right mentality...he just says we try to, **** me talk about trival digs at the manager, if we were paying upwards of 30mill for players like our rivals started to do years ago, and added a few 20mill plus players to them it would be far easier to find players with the right mentality too.

[Maxiedge]

Try to sign players with the right menality...TRY! He's never said we "only" sign players with the right mentality...he just says we try to, **** me talk about trival digs at the manager, if we were paying upwards of 30mill for players like our rivals started to do years ago, and added a few 20mill plus players to them it would be far easier to find players with the right mentality too.

If you're suggesting that I'm having a dig at the manager then you're absolutley right. Trivial?! Come on mate. I back Benitez but he's not immune from criticism. He does always go on about signing players with the right mentallity and this suggests to me battlers, players who'll wear their heart on their sleeve. Then we go and sign Voronin and Degen. I understand there's a lack of funds but at the end of the day these players were singled out by Benitez and offered contracts.

I think by his own admission, he ****ed up, hence the much more astute 'cheap' signings of Kygriakos and Maxi. That Jovanovich guy looks like he'll give it some too.

[MrMichael]

If you're suggesting that I'm having a dig at the manager then you're absolutley right. Trivial?! Come on mate. I back Benitez but he's not immune from criticism. He does always go on about signing players with the right mentallity and this suggests to me battlers, players who'll wear their heart on their sleeve. Then we go and sign Voronin and Degen. I understand there's a lack of funds but at the end of the day these players were singled out by Benitez and offered contracts.

I think by his own admission, he ****ed up, hence the much more astute 'cheap' signings of Kygriakos and Maxi. That Jovanovich guy looks like he'll give it some too.

Most, not all of course, but most of Benitez signings have been pretty good pros. The likes of Benayoun, Alonso, Garcia, Reina, Torres, Kuyt etc etc easily counter the odd mentality fail, especially if they were a free like Voronin, Degen I think is harsh to include, his issue is being made of glass, not mentality imo. The most incongruous for me is actually Babel, always thought that was a very odd signing; his mentality and Rafa's management style never seemed a good fit.

[the rev leeroy brown]

Most, not all of course, but most of Benitez signings have been pretty good pros. The likes of Benayoun, Alonso, Garcia, Reina, Torres, Kuyt etc etc easily counter the odd mentality fail, especially if they were a free like Voronin, Degen I think is harsh to include, his issue is being made of glass, not mentality imo. The most incongruous for me is actually Babel, always thought that was a very odd signing; his mentality and Rafa's management style never seemed a good fit.

again i find myself sticking up for rafa ( sort of ).........not enjoying this at all.......but you're right - i think most of rafa's signings have been good pro's with a good mentality about them.

the probelm arises IMO with rafa's handling of those players who stick out in peoples minds ( the pennants, rieras, keanes, bellamys etc....) where he cant find a way, like their previous managers seem to do, in bringing out the best in them.....thats just a flaw in rafas style not the players. so to me it is not that he buys players with a bad mentality, its more that he brings out that aspect in them.

as for your comments over sir ryan of babel, i dont see why you thought he was an odd signing - he was courted by a lot of the big teams ( the arse, ac milan, sevilla were all in for him ) - and for the first season at least he looked every part of a shrewd buy....untill again rafa's style brought out the worst in him. he does seem to have screwed the head on a bit now though so next season will be make or break for him.

[MrMichael]

again i find myself sticking up for rafa ( sort of ).........not enjoying this at all.......but you're right - i think most of rafa's signings have been good pro's with a good mentality about them.

the probelm arises IMO with rafa's handling of those players who stick out in peoples minds ( the pennants, rieras, keanes, bellamys etc....) where he cant find a way, like their previous managers seem to do, in bringing out the best in them.....thats just a flaw in rafas style not the players. so to me it is not that he buys players with a bad mentality, its more that he brings out that aspect in them.

as for your comments over sir ryan of babel, i dont see why you thought he was an odd signing - he was courted by a lot of the big teams ( the arse, ac milan, sevilla were all in for him ) - and for the first season at least he looked every part of a shrewd buy....untill again rafa's style brought out the worst in him. he does seem to have screwed the head on a bit now though so next season will be make or break for him.

I'm not sure its entirely like that. Players with a good, solid, professional attitude who do not need particular "nurturing" off the pitch, the likes of Reina, Kuyt etc, seem to do well under Benitez, and in general I think he has tried to sign that sort of player. The issue comes a bit however with those who do seem to need an arm round their shoulder, and personally I would class those you mention along with a few more in that group. I'm struggling to think of many players who have really thrived under Benitez who have been the more mecurial personality type. I'm not sure its fair to say though that he brings out a bad mentality in them, some have dubious mentalities in the first place, and others I just don't think were or are quite good enough under any conditions.

As for Babel, well I just never thought he and Benitez style would be a good fit. He has come over at points as being rather prone to sulking and with not necessarily the greatest work ethic, and that was thought about him while at Ajax too. That's not to say he didn't have natural talent, obviously he did and does, but as much as top clubs may have been looking at him back then they haven't exactly been falling over themselves to pry him away from our bench since then. Now whether managers with a different style would have gotten more out of him is certainly possible, but I still think how it has gone with us so far has ultimately been more about flaws with Babel than Benitez for me, though both may have been a factor.

[dww]

On the topic of Babel - he seems to have grown into a player with at least some of the necessary mental qualities to succeed under Rafa. I wonder whether the problem is more one of players needing to adjust and be willing to adapt. I know Gerrard has sulked this season but that could be as much about his injury as his relationship with the manager but he too had to learn to adapt to a different style of man management. Perhaps we simply haven't had the patience that Rafa has shown to Babel when judging either of the pair?

I think that for older players (who don't have a connection to the club like Gerrard) there is more of an expectation of an instant impact which means that this process of adaptation is harder. A prime example being Keane who really seemed to object to having to progress as a player or a man in order to get into the first team.

I'm not sure people are giving Babel (or Rafa) enough credit for his second half of last season. I'm still not a massive fan but I do now think he may go on to fulfil his potential (even if I don't think that is as great as some make out).

[the rev leeroy brown]

On the topic of Babel - he seems to have grown into a player with at least some of the necessary mental qualities to succeed under Rafa. I wonder whether the problem is more one of players needing to adjust and be willing to adapt. I know Gerrard has sluked this season but that could be as much about his injury as his relationship with the manager but he too had to learn to adapt to a different style of man management. Perhaps we simply haven't had the patience that Rafa has shown to Babel when judging either of the pair?

I think that for older players (who don't have a connection to the club like Gerrard) there is more of an expectation of an instant impact which means that this process of adaptation is harder. A prime example being Keane who really seemed to object to having to progress as a player or a man in order to get into the first team.

I'm not sure people are giving Babel (or Rafa) enough credit for his second half of last season. I'm still not a massive fan but I do now think he may go on to fulfil his potential (even if I don't think that is as great as some make out).

this is the point i try endlessly to get across to people.

yes babel isnt the finished article ( no where near ) but the 2nd half of the season when he screwed the head and rafa gave him more of a prominant role in the team, he showed that he may be capable of fulfilling his undoubted potential. he did come on to a better game than he had showed in his countless 5 - 7 min cameo sub apearances. this is all i ask of people to realsie when i back his corner.

a share of the credit must go to rafa for playing him and believeing in him too i must add.

[MrMichael]

this is the point i try endlessly to get across to people.

yes babel isnt the finished article ( no where near ) but the 2nd half of the season when he screwed the head and rafa gave him more of a prominant role in the team, he showed that he may be capable of fulfilling his undoubted potential. he did come on to a better game than he had showed in his countless 5 - 7 min cameo sub apearances. this is all i ask of people to realsie when i back his corner.

a share of the credit must go to rafa for playing him and believeing in him too i must add.

Yeah, I'll go with that, he did look like he had matured somewhat, if he can maintain that attitude and continue improving on the pitch then he'll deserve a lot of credit. As probably will Rafa, and it would really prove to be a vindication of how he has dealt with Babel with a view to the long-term. We'll see.

I'm not sure if this professionalism/attitude thing, important though it is, should be such a dominant aspect as Rafa sometimes makes it..... as I do at times whether El Zhar goes to bed at 7 and is training at 5.30am on a Sunday.


Anyway, errrr, yeah, Voronin, he's a ****, And Terry. Yeah, him too.

/thread