Group C (England, Algeria, Slovenia, USA! USA! USA!)

[DannyMan2006]

Of course it matters Danny, the harder your run, the less likely you are to win it.

So if England do indeed have ambitions to win it, an easier run makes this more likely.

England CAN beat Germany and Argentina, they can beat anyone. But the more of those top sides you face, the less likely that you're going to overcome them all.

Nonsense IMO. An easier draw will mean you will progress further, but it doesn't mean you have a better chance of winning it.

On the contrary, beating the best teams gives you the confidence you can actually win the thing.

And as far as I'm concerned, I have not been as impressed with Germany or Argentina as others have been. If England play well they will beat both those teams. Neither side will sit back and defend and that is ideal for England, which is a side that is built around playing the top sides. England lack craft and guile to break packed defences, neither Germany or Argentina are capable of sitting back and defending, nor will they attempt it.

Had Ghana had even a half decent finisher in their team tonight they would have beat germany. The fact Ghana have only scored from the penalty spot is a telling statistic and no great suprise to anyone who has bothered watching them. The other team they beat were Australia, potentially the worst team performance I have seen defensively in the whole tournament when they Played the Germans. Their off side trap was suicidal and the Germans did not have to break sweat to score past the Aussies. The other team in the group, Serbia, beat them.

Argentina themselves have of course a decent front line, but also have a poor back line. They got lucky themselves by being in a piss poor group which allowed them to build momentum. I suggest they will come down with a bump as soon as they meet a capable side.

Of course, everything I say is dependant on which England team turns up. But strangely, I think there is less pressure on them now than there was prior to today. We were expected to walk over the teams in our group and when it didn't happen from the off you could visibly see the confidence drain away from them.

I would not think they will go into games now expecting to brush teams aside, and as such will not panic so much if they don't find the early goal. I know how it looks, but trust me, England are far better having a tougher draw as opposed to an easy one.

[Leyton388]

If we beat the germans, Argies, spanish and brazilians and win the WC that will be the greatest WC win ever and will beat 66 hands down. If we do beat those teams **** me we deserve to win it without a shadow of a doubt and no one could begrudge that.

[DannyMan2006]

If we bear the germans, Argies, spanish and brazilians and win the WC that will be the greatest WC win ever and will beat 66 hands down. If w do beat those teams **** me we deserve to win it without a shadow of a doubt and no one could begrudge that.

Damn right.

[Craig_H]

Nonsense IMO. An easier draw will mean you will progress further, but it doesn't mean you have a better chance of winning it.

On the contrary, beating the best teams gives you the confidence you can actually win the thing.

And as far as I'm concerned, I have not been as impressed with Germany or Argentina as others have been. If England play well they will beat both those teams. Neither side will sit back and defend and that is ideal for England, which is a side that is built around playing the top sides. England lack craft and guile to break packed defences, neither Germany or Argentina are capable of sitting back and defending, nor will they attempt it.

Had Ghana had even a half decent finisher in their team tonight they would have beat germany. The fact Ghana have only scored from the penalty spot is a telling statistic and no great suprise to anyone who has bothered watching them. The other team they beat were Australia, potentially the worst team performance I have seen defensively in the whole tournament when they Played the Germans. Their off side trap was suicidal and the Germans did not have to break sweat to score past the Aussies. The other team in the group, Serbia, beat them.

Argentina themselves have of course a decent front line, but also have a poor back line. They got lucky themselves by being in a piss poor group which allowed them to build momentum. I suggest they will come down with a bump as soon as they meet a capable side.

Of course, everything I say is dependant on which England team turns up. But strangely, I think there is less pressure on them now than there was prior to today. We were expected to walk over the teams in our group and when it didn't happen from the off you could visibly see the confidence drain away from them.

I would not think they will go into games now expecting to brush teams aside, and as such will not panic so much if they don't find the early goal. I know how it looks, but trust me, England are far better having a tougher draw as opposed to an easy one.

So progressing further doesnt increase your chances of winning it? Sounds a bit arse-about-face mate, that logic.

Of course beating the best sides gives you confidence, but i think you'd find that if the team keeps progressing through the knock out phase, confidence and momentum will snowball anyway. Regardless of who's been beaten on the way. Just look at the reaction to today's win - against mighty Slovenia. A win is a win and it generates confidence.

Agree with your point about Germany and Argentina, but i'd also point out that Germany are incredibly shrewd at this level and have all the know-how in the world. I've no doubt that Ghana would've been a much easier obstacle for England.

I also agree that England play better when they face stronger opposition, but that will only take them so far. The cumulative levels of difficulty of a run such as Germany, Argentina, Spain and Brazil would make it hugely difficult for them, compared to, say, Ghana, Denmark, Italy and Holland.

If it was as simple as to say "England are more likely to go all the way when they face hard opponents and are under less pressure", they wouldnt have been dumped out by Brazil and Portugal, the last few tournaments.

It's a balancing act and i do think you need to face someone decent, but at the same time, the more top class sides they face, the harder and less likely it becomes, for them to win the trophy.

[Fernandinho]

Well done to the US for topping their group, they will easily take Ghana who are totally **** I think.

[BrooklynRed]

If we beat the germans, Argies, spanish and brazilians and win the WC that will be the greatest WC win ever and will beat 66 hands down. If we do beat those teams **** me we deserve to win it without a shadow of a doubt and no one could begrudge that.

In fact, if anyone from that half of the draw wins the World Cup, they will certainly be a deserving champion. That is a tough road for any team.

[BrooklynRed]

Well done to the US for topping their group, they will easily take Ghana who are totally **** I think.

We have some unfinished business with them....

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOCLXoSyqPU"]YouTube- Round 3. Ghana vs USA 2-1 (Fifa Highlights)[/ame]

[BrooklynRed]

Also, I thought you might enjoy this. The scene at a pub in Lincoln, Nebraska-- home of the supporters group American Outlaws-- in the final moments of the match... pretty great. If you have seen the goal, you can follow this beat for beat...

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfS9kbyfiMM"]YouTube- Landon Donovan Goal vs Algeria at American Outlaws HQ, Lincoln Nebraska.[/ame]

[little dave hedgehog]

We have some unfinished business with them....

YouTube- Round 3. Ghana vs USA 2-1 (Fifa Highlights)

i had forgotten about that dempsey goal. i love it when they thump them in like that.

except that pretty much never happens for us.

[Fernandinho]

haha who cares, come on USA. its in the bag Landon Donovan and Clint Dempsey. BTW i cant believe poms on here have any reason not to follow their national team... doesnt make any sense to me

[The_weatherman]

so the us would have ghana, uruguay and brazil? i'd have snapped your hand off for that before the tournament.

Actually I think Uruguay would beat the US, they are a decent team IMO and I think may surprise a few. But Ghana should not be an obstacle though.

[PTP]

bit gutted england didn't top the group - means i need to re arrange a day's holiday as i gambled that we would have won it (and should really)

The game should have been wrapped up yesterday 2 or 3 nil imo with chances for gerrard rooney and defoe that you'd expect to be scored. That siad from what i remember (i was bladdered) slovenia had a couple of chances themselves.

Part of me wanted the easy route - you'd expect on paper to beat ghana and uruguay to get to the semis - but......what i have seen of england so far (with all due respect to the opposition in the group - scored 2, conceded 1 is hardly inspiring) i really cna't see england going that far whatever route.

So I have taken the stance i have always taken with liverpool in europe - you have to beat the best to be the best, and so similar to liverpool it's scary - we seem to raise it against the 'bigger more fancied sides' and when the backs are against the wall. Plus like liverpool, when given the choice of playing say a Marsielle(ghana) or Inter Milan(germany) in the next round - i'd always pick the tougher draw - the way i look at it is this

If we were playing ghana we'd be favourites - a win would be meh, but a loss would be a ****ing disaster

If we play the germans though, on paper a 'bigger game' then the type of pressure changes and a loss would "unlucky" where a win would lift the ****ing roof off.

[Matt]

England have shot themselves in the foot with the route that they need to take now. No way should USA have topped the group and they'll make the quarters unless Ghana have a good day.

[SK]

[Bender]

Franz Beckenbauer believes England made a stupid mistake by failing to avoid a second-round match against Germany at the World Cup in South Africa.
The two sides will meet in Bloemfontein on Sunday after England failed to win Group C despite beating Slovenia 1-0.
"Stupidly, the English have slipped up a little by finishing second in their group," said German great Beckenbauer.
"The English look a little tired... they are burnt out. We respect them but we certainly don't fear them."
BBC