Manchester City

[Cerbie]

Has anyone ever been stripped of a league title or Cup trophy, and was it then handed to the 2nd place team.
Surely to have the next best points total in the year (and the winner is removed ) is proof that you are the winner by default.
Works in athletics, etc. Maybe not cycling after Lance, as they were all bang at it.

Inter were awarded the 05/06 Serie A title when Juve were convicted of match fixing. Bizarrely they were also stripped of the 04/05 title, but it was not awarded to the runner up. I think AC Milan were the runners up and they were also caught up in the match fixing scandal although not to the same extent as Juve.

[Exiled_red]

Don't the charges only relate to up to something like 2018 so if they were to strip titles it could only be in those seasons, even though the impact of what they have done extends to present day.

Also awarding titles to the team in second place is a complex issue, for the seasons where us and City were well ahead of the field it's easy, but for closer seasons do you redraw the table discounting points against City or let the table stand as is? You could also make the argument in seasons that City were so far ahead the team in 2nd might not have won it, the team in 3rd might have focused on other trophies or at least would have approached games differently if they had been in a title race. Knockout competitions are even more difficult to do this with. The team that lost to City in a final might not have beaten the team City put out in the semi final or earlier rounds...

I am sure the players would appreciate the medals but for fans being awarded titles would be somewhat hollow, not being able to see the players celebrate and lift the trophy and the emotion that goes along with that is a massive part of what football is about. Also it would be weird to now learn that Rodgers side in 2013-14 won the title and that we didn't have to wait 30 years...

But as I say it's unlikely City would be stripped of anything and even more unlikely that trophies would be awarded to anyone else.

[Buzzo]

[ame]https://twitter.com/espnfc/status/1866965320641995109[/ame]

[Sus]

Don't the charges only relate to up to something like 2018 so if they were to strip titles it could only be in those seasons, even though the impact of what they have done extends to present day.

Also awarding titles to the team in second place is a complex issue, for the seasons where us and City were well ahead of the field it's easy, but for closer seasons do you redraw the table discounting points against City or let the table stand as is? You could also make the argument in seasons that City were so far ahead the team in 2nd might not have won it, the team in 3rd might have focused on other trophies or at least would have approached games differently if they had been in a title race. Knockout competitions are even more difficult to do this with. The team that lost to City in a final might not have beaten the team City put out in the semi final or earlier rounds...

I am sure the players would appreciate the medals but for fans being awarded titles would be somewhat hollow, not being able to see the players celebrate and lift the trophy and the emotion that goes along with that is a massive part of what football is about. Also it would be weird to now learn that Rodgers side in 2013-14 won the title and that we didn't have to wait 30 years...

But as I say it's unlikely City would be stripped of anything and even more unlikely that trophies would be awarded to anyone else.

I think there are additional issues around awarding the title to second place - how would it work for clubs that were relegated in those seasons or just missed CL / Europa league spots, and especially if there were clubs who weren't relegated / or qualified for Europe based on their results against City (no idea if this was the case)?

If the PL awards the title to runners up then I think it becomes a slippery slope very quickly

[Norbs]

You’d hope so, but it wouldn’t really fix anything in terms of what Liverpool’s fans and players have been cheated out of.

Absolutely. Wouldn't United have had another 2 titles too? Every cloud...

[Norbs]

I think it’s fanciful to think they will strip titles, never mind handing them out to the teams that finished second.

Without that it's a pretty pointless process

[Norbs]

Did it not happen in Italy with Juve? Too lazy to check

Yep, stripped of 2, one of which was given to Inter. They bounced back from relegation and won 9 of the next 17 Serie A.

All off the top of my head

[danperkins]

I think it’s fanciful to think they will strip titles, never mind handing them out to the teams that finished second.

[rudedog]

Without that it's a pretty pointless process

Could be yeah, I’m still hoping they get relegated though and miss out on CL for a couple of years

Likely outcome is a points deduction and big fine

[Scratch]

Wonder if Pep would be happy to get the sack now, take his big payday (did he sign a new contract, or was that just a rumour?) and then be free to take up a managerial role for the National team? He seems unmotivated and down...losing Rhodri should not have the impact it is having to the team, the malaise has to come from Pep himself.

[RedReet]

I think there are additional issues around awarding the title to second place - how would it work for clubs that were relegated in those seasons or just missed CL / Europa league spots, and especially if there were clubs who weren't relegated / or qualified for Europe based on their results against City (no idea if this was the case)?

If the PL awards the title to runners up then I think it becomes a slippery slope very quickly

I don't see how it would be an issue for 2nd place or relegated teams. They all played the same City team, as did everyone in the league, so nobody gained unfair advantage. I get why trophies might be taken away, but don't see why results wouldn't stand.

And if City did lose their titles, I don't see why it would be much of an issue awarding to runners up, as would happen in most sports if the winner is disqualified. In horse racing when a horse is disqualified for impeding, it's often other horses in the race that are impacted, not the one in 2nd, so it's just bad luck. If teams approached matches differently because they thought City had won the league, that's on them IMO.

[Sus]

I don't see how it would be an issue for 2nd place or relegated teams. They all played the same City team, as did everyone in the league, so nobody gained unfair advantage. I get why trophies might be taken away, but don't see why results wouldn't stand.

And if City did lose their titles, I don't see why it would be much of an issue awarding to runners up, as would happen in most sports if the winner is disqualified. In horse racing when a horse is disqualified for impeding, it's often other horses in the race that are impacted, not the one in 2nd, so it's just bad luck. If teams approached matches differently because they thought City had won the league, that's on them IMO.

Fair enough perspective - would love a couple of titles to come to us out of this, BTW, just think it is unlikely, as it will open the potential for extensive litigation against the PL

[rudedog]

I don't see how it would be an issue for 2nd place or relegated teams. They all played the same City team, as did everyone in the league, so nobody gained unfair advantage. I get why trophies might be taken away, but don't see why results wouldn't stand.

And if City did lose their titles, I don't see why it would be much of an issue awarding to runners up, as would happen in most sports if the winner is disqualified. In horse racing when a horse is disqualified for impeding, it's often other horses in the race that are impacted, not the one in 2nd, so it's just bad luck. If teams approached matches differently because they thought City had won the league, that's on them IMO.

A horse race is a single event with 12 competitors. Pl winner is a result of 380 individual events(matches)

It’s not really comparable

[baitman]

Fair enough perspective - would love a couple of titles to come to us out of this, BTW, just think it is unlikely, as it will open the potential for extensive litigation against the PL

Unfortunately this is most likely, the league will try and come up with a solution that is easier for them to manage any potential fall out.

[SB]

Without that it's a pretty pointless process