Sebastian Coates

[~LFCHistory~]

Starting Carragher ahead of Coates makes no sense for 2 reasons.

1. We have nothing really to play for in the league now so why not give the young lad a chance, so even if he bombs, so what ?

2. We should be building for the future not giving game time to a shot veteran on huge wages ahead of a young, talented player who was bought for 7 million.

[BootRoom]

Maybe I'm a million miles off, but perhaps we should be considering more possible reasons for this than simply favouring the aging Carra (who was afterall roundly benched in favour of Agger / Skrtel for most of the season).

• Carra was dropped eariler in the season and didn't really get on the pitch for a couple of months. Which surely rules out the "Carra's off pitch influence" argument?
  

You keep saying this but it's simply not true; Carragher lost his place in the side because he was injured vs. Stoke in League Cup, and by the time he was fit, Agger and Skrtel had formed such a good partnership that it couldn't be broken up. Before that we had Skrtel playing at right back.

Incidently, Coates played in that game vs Stoke, and he made a mistake in the first half that contributed to their first goal (although they still had a lot of work to do to get the ball in the net with Carragher 'covering' in the box), yet in the second half (when Carragher went off) he had a storming game and completely put the mistake behind him. I think you'd agree that a cup tie vs. a gritty, physical side like Stoke would provide some pointers as to the suitability to cut it in the English League.

The only game he looked shakey in was in the FA Cup vs. Oldham in which Carragher was just as bad; all the other performances haven't been ones to suggest he's somehow out of his depth, so all this talk about 'failure to acclimatise' is quite frankly baloney, in my opinion.

[baitman]

You keep saying this but it's simply not true; Carragher lost his place in the side because he was injured vs. Stoke in League Cup, and by the time he was fit, Agger and Skrtel had formed such a good partnership that it couldn't be broken up. Before that we had Skrtel playing at right back.

Incidently, Coates played in that game vs Stoke, and he made a mistake in the first half that contributed to their first goal (although they still had a lot of work to do to get the ball in the net with Carragher 'covering' in the box), yet in the second half (when Carragher went off) he had a storming game and completely put the mistake behind him. I think you'd agree that a cup tie vs. a gritty, physical side like Stoke would provide some pointers as to the suitability to cut it in the English League.

The only game he looked shakey in was in the FA Cup vs. Oldham in which Carragher was just as bad; all the other performances haven't been ones to suggest he's somehow out of his depth, so all this talk about 'failure to acclimatise' is quite frankly baloney, in my opinion.

good point. with carra behind or along side he has been found wanting, but otherwise this lad is ready

[MrMichael]

You keep saying this but it's simply not true; Carragher lost his place in the side because he was injured vs. Stoke in League Cup, and by the time he was fit, Agger and Skrtel had formed such a good partnership that it couldn't be broken up. Before that we had Skrtel playing at right back.

Incidently, Coates played in that game vs Stoke, and he made a mistake in the first half that contributed to their first goal (although they still had a lot of work to do to get the ball in the net with Carragher 'covering' in the box), yet in the second half (when Carragher went off) he had a storming game and completely put the mistake behind him. I think you'd agree that a cup tie vs. a gritty, physical side like Stoke would provide some pointers as to the suitability to cut it in the English League.

The only game he looked shakey in was in the FA Cup vs. Oldham in which Carragher was just as bad; all the other performances haven't been ones to suggest he's somehow out of his depth, so all this talk about 'failure to acclimatise' is quite frankly baloney, in my opinion.

He was still left out of the side for a sustained period when fit.

"All" the other performance don't amount to much pitch time. Look, I don't know, its of course possible I'm totally wrong and there is a Carra-centric conspiracy, but personally, for reasons I've already given including knowedge of Kenny, I just can't see that Carra is being played now for any other reason than what the management team believe is merit. Why that is their perception I don't know, but I'm not going to be convinced otherwise as it just isn't logical imo.

There has to be at least a possibility that I'm on the right lines about this doesn't there?

[BootRoom]

He was still left out of the side for a sustained period when fit.

I've aleady addressed this - it's because the Agger/Skrtel combo, in terms of the partnership and the individual performance of the players, was so dramatically superior to anything Carragher could do or contribute to, that is would have been madness for Kenny to revert back.

"All" the other performance don't amount to much pitch time. Look, I don't know, its of course possible I'm totally wrong and there is a Carra-centric conspiracy, but personally, for reasons I've already given including knowedge of Kenny, I just can't see that Carra is being played now for any other reason than what the management team believe is merit. Why that is their perception I don't know, but I'm not going to be convinced otherwise as it just isn't logical imo.

There has to be at least a possibility that I'm on the right lines about this doesn't there?

On the one hand you're arguing that Coates hasn't 'acclimatised' as rapidly as the coaching staff would have liked, yet on the other you are arguing that he hasn't had much pitch time - so that begs the question: how is he supposed to 'acclimatie' if he is starved of playing time? Or even: how do we know that his acclimatisation is slow if he hasn't been allowed much playing time?

[Fan65]

I also think he unsettles the rest of the defence nowadays. Can't be easy listening to his constant shrieking of instructions when you're aware of how many times his own mistakes are directly leading to conceding.

How disrespectful of a great player

The constant slating our players & Kenny get on here is appalling

Fair criticism & debate is sensible & justified but comments like this are just pathetic and serve no purpose.

Carra has been a rock in our defence for some very hard years, okay his age is catching up on him now as I'm sure he knows better than anyone (even Craig) and yet he still does a good job as the stand in, give him and Kenny credit, it's not his fault we can't convert our chances at the other end.

Coates may be his immediate replacement but have a look at Wisdom in the ressie's he looks like a star of the future, maybe sooner rather than later

[Mattshark]

Sorry mate, but Carra has been very poor this season (although he did nothing wrong v Villa) he has cost us goals a lot more regulary this season.

[Fan65]

Sorry mate, but Carra has been very poor this season (although he did nothing wrong v Villa) he has cost us goals a lot more regulary this season.

He hasn't been that bad, yes his legs are letting him down but he's not suddenly become sole liability in defence.

If Kenny and his coaching team deem him a better choice to cover Agger than anyone else available then so be it. Playing an inexperienced Coates in an under performing team with low confidence may well be the way but maybe not at the moment, experience may be preferred.

Worthy of discussion yes but not at the expense of slating a player for the fact he's ageing. Carra's spirit and drive for this club is something that's missing from some of our players, Playing for Liverpool means everything to Carra , some players hide during games not Carra ever, he may be in the twilight but he will always give his best 100%

[Mattshark]

He hasn't been that bad, yes his legs are letting him down but he's not suddenly become sole liability in defence.

If Kenny and his coaching team deem him a better choice to cover Agger than anyone else available then so be it. Playing an inexperienced Coates in an under performing team with low confidence may well be the way but maybe not at the moment, experience may be preferred.

Worthy of discussion yes but not at the expense of slating a player for the fact he's ageing. Carra's spirit and drive for this club is something that's missing from some of our players, Playing for Liverpool means everything to Carra , some players hide during games not Carra ever, he may be in the twilight but he will always give his best 100%

I dunno mate, he has made a lot more errors imo, he isn't good enough in general imo any more.

I think some of the annyomosity towards him has come from his potentially xenophobic comments and the rumours about his role in Rafa's exit.

[Exiled_red]

He hasn't been that bad, yes his legs are letting him down but he's not suddenly become sole liability in defence.

If Kenny and his coaching team deem him a better choice to cover Agger than anyone else available then so be it. Playing an inexperienced Coates in an under performing team with low confidence may well be the way but maybe not at the moment, experience may be preferred.

Worthy of discussion yes but not at the expense of slating a player for the fact he's ageing. Carra's spirit and drive for this club is something that's missing from some of our players, Playing for Liverpool means everything to Carra , some players hide during games not Carra ever, he may be in the twilight but he will always give his best 100%

It's not so much his own performances or the mistakes he makes that are the problem. For me the problem is that bringing him in completely changes the tactics as well as the make up of the back four. Things like playing a deeper line mean that either the gap between the defence and midfield is bigger or that the whole team plays deeper. These IMO are significant factors in the recent run of poor results.

[Lecter]

Carra is finished. Valid enough reason not to play him.

[Roboklopp]

FFS, I was hardly slating Carra, but I'm not gonna be blind to the fact his performances have been woefully inadequate- both individually & in terms of changing the team dynamic. It's a sad fact but he has been on the decline for 2 seasons now & dramatically so. Samii was a huge player for us, but he quickly dropped to 4th choice to give Skrtel chance to develop even when we had things still to play for- and to be fair, he was far less of liabilty than Carra is now.

[BootRoom]

Barely put a foot wrong in a pressure situation when down to 10 men for the majority of the game and without the cover of a specialised, top class defensive midfielder. He 'acclimatised' pretty well.

[Shaggy]

I really like the look of him. Looks comfortable, good on the ball, mops up quite nicely, obviously strong in the air. One tremendous tackle/block in the 2nd half.

[McDermotX]

Done ok, but would need to watch it again.
Made one great reverse challenge in the box in the second half.