General Football 23/24

[ChesterDave]

If the failed Super League is anything to go by, I'm pretty sure the PL will fight that one

Will they have any recourse? The PL only needs 14 clubs to agree to vote through changes. Difficult when only 6 clubs benefit but if the US owners want to vote through a closed shop it could happen

[baitman]

They really need a singing section to bump up the atmosphere

[Kenneth]

This is pretty grim

Atlético Madrid fans’ racist abuse of Vinícius Júnior overshadows Real win

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/sep/18/atletico-real-madrid-vinicius-junior-racist-abuse

[ChesterDave]

I thought the Real player diving was the worst piece of arseholery on a football pitch since the Rivaldo dive v Turkey at the World Cup and still Athleti fans manage to make it the second worst thing about the game.

[SB]

Can’t access the article so anyone care to share it please

[Saveloy]

Can’t access the article so anyone care to share it please

Atlético Madrid fans’ racist abuse of Vinícius Júnior overshadows Real win

Real Madrid went to the Metropolitano and danced, delivering their response to this derby victory over Atletico Madrid and the racism that overshadowed it. Goals from Rodrygo and Fede Valverde took Carlo Ancelotti’s team to the top of the table and maintained their 100% record this season but this was a night – a week, in fact – that will be recalled more for what happened off the pitch, with Atlético fans chanting abuse at Vinícius Júnior.

Footage filmed outside showed significant numbers of supporters chanting “Vinícius is a monkey” as they made their way into the stadium. What sounded like monkey chants could also be heard among the whistles the first time the Brazilian touched the ball. That was not repeated afterwards, and when Vinicius lost the ball attempting a late rainbow flick, they chanted “stupid, stupid.” When Madrid’s players celebrated the opening goal in a 2-1 win against their rivals, there were some objects thrown.

The abuse outside followed a video from Vinícius in which he responded to criticism of his supposedly provocative behaviour by denouncing the racism to which he feels he is subjected and which he suggested underlies the attacks.

What had initially been an almost entirely fabricated debate about his style and his habit of celebrating goals by dancing had built up all week and eventually, and with depressing inevitability, ended in this episode of racism at the stadium.

Last Sunday there had been a confrontation between Vinícius and some Mallorca players who considered him to be showboating. When he scored he had danced, as he often does. The Mallorca manger Javier Aguirre had spoken to him during the game but afterwards said that it was unimportant and congratulated Madrid on the victory.

Despite that attempt to downplay it, a debate was stirred up about him which seemed to overtake the entire buildup to this game, becoming unavoidable in the media. Football agent Pedro Bravo, a guest on a Spanish TV show Chiringuito, where hammed-up arguments are a staple, referred to Vinícius “monkeying around”, and invited him to leave the dancing to the “Sambadrome”. He subsequently apologised, saying that he used the phrase “figuratively”.

As the clip went viral, so the support for Vinícius rolled in: from Neymar, Dani Alves, and even Pelé. Atlético captain Koke was subsequently asked about the likely reaction should the Brazilian score and celebrate the goal by dancing. Koke responded by saying there would be a “lio for sure” [trouble, or a mess].

Vinícius gave a statement on the eve of the match. “They say that happiness annoys people,” he said. “Well, the happiness of a victorious black Brazilian in Europe, much more so. Weeks ago now, they started to criminalise me for dancing.” Dance, he said, is not just his, but belongs to many players, including Atlético’s Antoine Griezmann, to funk and samba artists, to reggaeton and black Americans, and “celebrate the cultural diversity of the world – and he wasn’t going to stop. Accept it, respect me, I’m not going to stop,” he said.

Real Madrid released a statement in defence of their player and against racism. In his pre-match press conference, more than half of the questions directed at Carlo Ancelotti were about Vinícius. “A lot has been said about provocation; racism is another subject which is much more important,” he said.

“We haven’t talked about racism in the dressing room because the player has responded well in his statement and that’s it.” Neymar tweeted: “Dance, Vini” and the next day asked: “Am I the only one who woke up wanting Vinícius to score tomorrow?”

In the end, he didn’t, but he did dance. Atlético flew out of the blocks but Real Madrid rode that initial storm. Felipe had one header on to the roof of the net, Yannick Carrasco hit the side of it, and João Felix had a shot blocked. Griezmann, surprisingly included as a starter despite Atlético’s attempts to avoid triggering an obligatory purchase clause from Barcelona by not playing him, saw a shot saved by Thibaut Courtois.

But then Rodrygo scored a wonderful opening goal, turning a clever volley into the net. He celebrated by dancing at the south end of the ground, joined by teammates. They hadn’t finished yet: a sharp one-two between Luka Modric and Vinícius sent the Brazilian racing away.

He ran into the area and hit the post, the ball running loose for Valverde, steaming in, to finish. Madrid’s players danced once more. There was a long way to go but it felt as good as over until a late Mario Hermoso goal set up an unexpectedly tense finish that ended with Hermoso being sent off in stoppage time.

[SB]

Atlético Madrid fans’ racist abuse of Vinícius Júnior overshadows Real win

Real Madrid went to the Metropolitano and danced, delivering their response to this derby victory over Atletico Madrid and the racism that overshadowed it. Goals from Rodrygo and Fede Valverde took Carlo Ancelotti’s team to the top of the table and maintained their 100% record this season but this was a night – a week, in fact – that will be recalled more for what happened off the pitch, with Atlético fans chanting abuse at Vinícius Júnior.

Footage filmed outside showed significant numbers of supporters chanting “Vinícius is a monkey” as they made their way into the stadium. What sounded like monkey chants could also be heard among the whistles the first time the Brazilian touched the ball. That was not repeated afterwards, and when Vinicius lost the ball attempting a late rainbow flick, they chanted “stupid, stupid.” When Madrid’s players celebrated the opening goal in a 2-1 win against their rivals, there were some objects thrown.

The abuse outside followed a video from Vinícius in which he responded to criticism of his supposedly provocative behaviour by denouncing the racism to which he feels he is subjected and which he suggested underlies the attacks.

What had initially been an almost entirely fabricated debate about his style and his habit of celebrating goals by dancing had built up all week and eventually, and with depressing inevitability, ended in this episode of racism at the stadium.

Last Sunday there had been a confrontation between Vinícius and some Mallorca players who considered him to be showboating. When he scored he had danced, as he often does. The Mallorca manger Javier Aguirre had spoken to him during the game but afterwards said that it was unimportant and congratulated Madrid on the victory.

Despite that attempt to downplay it, a debate was stirred up about him which seemed to overtake the entire buildup to this game, becoming unavoidable in the media. Football agent Pedro Bravo, a guest on a Spanish TV show Chiringuito, where hammed-up arguments are a staple, referred to Vinícius “monkeying around”, and invited him to leave the dancing to the “Sambadrome”. He subsequently apologised, saying that he used the phrase “figuratively”.

As the clip went viral, so the support for Vinícius rolled in: from Neymar, Dani Alves, and even Pelé. Atlético captain Koke was subsequently asked about the likely reaction should the Brazilian score and celebrate the goal by dancing. Koke responded by saying there would be a “lio for sure” [trouble, or a mess].

Vinícius gave a statement on the eve of the match. “They say that happiness annoys people,” he said. “Well, the happiness of a victorious black Brazilian in Europe, much more so. Weeks ago now, they started to criminalise me for dancing.” Dance, he said, is not just his, but belongs to many players, including Atlético’s Antoine Griezmann, to funk and samba artists, to reggaeton and black Americans, and “celebrate the cultural diversity of the world – and he wasn’t going to stop. Accept it, respect me, I’m not going to stop,” he said.

Real Madrid released a statement in defence of their player and against racism. In his pre-match press conference, more than half of the questions directed at Carlo Ancelotti were about Vinícius. “A lot has been said about provocation; racism is another subject which is much more important,” he said.

“We haven’t talked about racism in the dressing room because the player has responded well in his statement and that’s it.” Neymar tweeted: “Dance, Vini” and the next day asked: “Am I the only one who woke up wanting Vinícius to score tomorrow?”

In the end, he didn’t, but he did dance. Atlético flew out of the blocks but Real Madrid rode that initial storm. Felipe had one header on to the roof of the net, Yannick Carrasco hit the side of it, and João Felix had a shot blocked. Griezmann, surprisingly included as a starter despite Atlético’s attempts to avoid triggering an obligatory purchase clause from Barcelona by not playing him, saw a shot saved by Thibaut Courtois.

But then Rodrygo scored a wonderful opening goal, turning a clever volley into the net. He celebrated by dancing at the south end of the ground, joined by teammates. They hadn’t finished yet: a sharp one-two between Luka Modric and Vinícius sent the Brazilian racing away.

He ran into the area and hit the post, the ball running loose for Valverde, steaming in, to finish. Madrid’s players danced once more. There was a long way to go but it felt as good as over until a late Mario Hermoso goal set up an unexpectedly tense finish that ended with Hermoso being sent off in stoppage time.

Cheers Sav. They really are a bunch of Neanderthals aren’t they.

[Doc_Piptorious]

Cheers Sav. They really are a bunch of Neanderthals aren’t they.

Vinicius has been impressive the past week to ten days leading up to the match as well.

The stuff during the game is only the tip of the iceberg it seems with regards to what he was putting up with.

Fair play to him for making a stand. Nuts that in 2022 that a black man gets racist abuse for standing up for himself and calling out the abuse, some of it racist, that he was already receiving.

Racism and homophobia really seems to be on the rise again in a lot of the suposedly civilised countries, or maybe the same levels were always there just that now certain types feel more emboldened for one reason or another to be openly racist/homophobic.

Same with sexism and threat to women (and yes threat to men also). At times it appears that there is a sizeable minority of the younger generation starting to embrace the archaic and ignorant views that we may have thought were dying out with the passing of some of the older generations.

[SB]

Such a sad indictment on society in general. Those sitting around the abusers & who say nothing are just as bad as those calling out.

All that it takes for evil to succeed is for good people to do nothing

Anon

[Corndog]

Fan behaviour in England getting worse apparently.

Some pretty sad comments from Dier and Hendo.

Is it a societal thing or sport related? Probably a little of both.

[ChesterDave]

Is it a societal thing or sport related? Probably a little of both.

Society, and when being a dick to people you don't know was accepted as 'banter'. I grew up understanding banter to be a bit of needle between people that know each other but that seems to be in the rear-view mirror now.

[Corndog]

Society, and when being a dick to people you don't know was accepted as 'banter'. I grew up understanding banter to be a bit of needle between people that know each other but that seems to be in the rear-view mirror now.

I agree with that, even in the time since I was a kid until now, how people interact and what is acceptable has changed.

However it also seems to me that this sort of thing is much less likely to happen at other sporting events.

Football absolutely has a problem where otherwise normal people say and do things that they wouldn't normally say or do when they walk into a stadium.

It's really odd for example to see grown men gesturing to masturbate onto a player but that's something you see quite frequently on TV coverage of premier league games.

Stepping back even further, it's actually a joke players are branded words like a 'disgrace' because they didn't play well. It's just sport, but somehow it has become inflated in its over importance to our society.

Most people would never call their colleague a disgrace to their face in an office if they messed up a presentation or things didn't go to plan. You might give them feedback in other words but even the language we use for sport is strangely melodramatic. Over time, I think it's become even more dramatic.

There should be room for chanting that is good natured humour and witty though.

[shanks69]

Possiblity that the san siro will be knocked down in a few years

https://www.thesportsman.com/articles/san-siro-to-be-demolished-to-make-way-for-new-ground-ahead-of-2027-28-season

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

[Deano]

Way past its date, its a ****ing ****hole

[Cormack74]

Possiblity that the san siro will be knocked down in a few years

https://www.thesportsman.com/articles/san-siro-to-be-demolished-to-make-way-for-new-ground-ahead-of-2027-28-season

I thought that had been on the cards for a while TBH.