Our Academy/Youth?

[burntyoungster]

Just read that Rafa has no control over the Academy.

Is this true?

i mentioned in another thread about youth systems/development that i work at the senior coaching end of a big club in ireland. it is the same of any club that the academy and the senior end of clubs, have no say whatsoever in each others business. they obviously communicate regularly, but i doubt rafa has been to anymore than 2 youth team games this season and rightly so, hes enough to do.

[REDSCOUSER]

If we keep buying young kiddas from across the world is a sign that the academy is not producing any good players. Simple as.

[burntyoungster]

If we keep buying young kiddas from across the world is a sign that the academy is not producing any good players. Simple as.

but the thing is that if we produce one player every 2 years it pays for itself(besides you could argue that finding and developing stevie g has already paid for the academy for the next 50 years). so if it pays for itself and the staff are the same as at the time of finding stevie, then should we just give up and sack everyone?

people only give a **** about the youth in football clubs when the first team aren't doing well. simple as.

[Resu]

people only give a **** about the youth in football clubs when the first team aren't doing well. simple as.

Which people are you talking about here?
Is it directors, Rafa and Co or the fans?

I don`t have a clue what the directors does.
By the look of it Rafa is trying to strengthen the youth set-up in the only way he can, by bringing in talented players. As long as he doesn`t have a say in the running of the academy it`s not much more he can do, except letting people know what he thinks is best.
As for the fans I think you`re being unfair to a lot of people. There is a genuine interest in how the kids do by many fans.

[Resu]

By the looks of it Peltier is thought of as a RB, so if he`s going to get more games he better get used to it.

As for Guthrie i thought he did OK. He was all over the LB the first half hour and if got in some good positions. He faded, as everybody did, but never gave up. Well worth the new contract IMO.

[Lecter]

It is the case. He can buy young players but thats it. Its a clause in his contract.

Chris Bascombe has mentioned it a few times in the saturday pink echo (so KT members will not know it exsists)

Heighway has huge power at the club particularly at youth level, the Academy is his domain

Whilst Rafa has no direct control over the local / homegrown youth recruitment (under 16's), hes changed a few things that have really put pressure on Heighway

He brought Herrera and then the guy from Southampton (Elias) to handpick players from all over the country to bolster the youth set up (under 18's) we've already seen Anderson, Hobbs, Antwi, Roque & a couple of others arrive to bolster that

Now he seems to be carrying on with this and improving reserve team level

All of this is putting pressure on Heighway to come up with players good enough to play for the club

Theres lots of rumours that Rafa is winning the war of attrition between the Academy & Melwood. I dont think its a personal issue like it was between Houllier & Heighway but I think Rafa believes that recruitment should be more widespread and that Academy based players shouldnt be exclusive to Liverpool (ie 1-16 year olds should be allowed to play for their schools and for other Saturday or Sunday morning leagues - which currently I dont believe they are) because exclusivity has meant kids not getting enough games to develop

[Lecter]

If we keep buying young kiddas from across the world is a sign that the academy is not producing any good players. Simple as.

Exactly and it might finally knock Heighway off the throne hes built for himself

I dont mean that Heighway is a tyrant or bad at his job, just that hes being doing things his way for a long time now with no involvement or input from the first team manager. Clearly the lack of quality players coming through is a damning endictment of the methods of recruitment and general policy at the Academy

[JRG]

Exactly and it might finally knock Heighway off the throne hes built for himself

I dont mean that Heighway is a tyrant or bad at his job, just that hes being doing things his way for a long time now with no involvement or input from the first team manager. Clearly the lack of quality players coming through is a damning endictment of the methods of recruitment and general policy at the Academy

Apparently Heighway does a good job at the academy, he is understandably jaundiced because of Houllier's attitude to the academy. Melwood and the academy need to be nore joined up, developing a common style as is the case at Arsenal

[Fierce]

Also its worth bearing in mind that in Spain in particular, the 'manager' is actually thought of as a head coach. He doesn't have all the same responsibilities and roles that a manager for an English club has

[Mumsafan]

I thought Heighway was going?

[lfc4ever]

I thought Heighway was going?

Only when the financial package suits him, so he said at a private dinner.

[Red_Polo]

Just read that Rafa has no control over the Academy.

Is this true?

Yes

Can't wait for Elias to take over the academy

[burntyoungster]

Which people are you talking about here?
Is it directors, Rafa and Co or the fans?

I don`t have a clue what the directors does.
By the look of it Rafa is trying to strengthen the youth set-up in the only way he can, by bringing in talented players. As long as he doesn`t have a say in the running of the academy it`s not much more he can do, except letting people know what he thinks is best.
As for the fans I think you`re being unfair to a lot of people. There is a genuine interest in how the kids do by many fans.

you've maybe picked me up slightly wrongly here because i'm not having a go at the fans. as you said yourself you don't have a clue about the directors and you don't really need to know because all we care about is the success of the first team, and thats my point. to give an example could you name the team that started and won the fa youth cup? anybody would struggle with that, but if you were asked to name who started and won the fa cup it wouldn't take too much hassle to get every member of the squad. the time you will take more of an interest in them is when they approach the first team.

so as i say the youth team only comes into the radar when they're winning a cup, when they have a wonder player, or when things are going wrong with the first team and other solutions need to be found from whatever playing staff is available. when you look closer at the youth team you'll realise its not exactly pulling up trees even with the fa youth cup. also clubs all over the uk put out their strongest possible sides for the youth cups in their area and that is where the pressure for results comes in, but in league games the youth team manager can have 6 or 7 of his players taken by the reserves and hes left to fill the void with even younger players. thats the right thing to do because if a 16 year old is doing well he must be fast tracked as quickly as possible toward the first team.

lip service is often paid to the youth set ups at most clubs but everything, quite rightly, is geared towards the success of the first team. liverpool have scouts in most major cities in the uk and will bring players over during the holidays(easter/xmas etc) and the decision is made by the staff at the academy as to whether they are offered anything or not. the manager has far too much to do to get envolved in any of that, so he needs to trust heighway to do his job.

[ronan]

too add to your point
youonly need to look at internet forums when a player isnt as playing as well as he might to see shouts for youth players to be given a chance
e.g anderson etc when clearly theyre not ready

on a side not burnty did you do your badges here in ireland or the uk?

[Nic83]

Fellas, this thread is ALSO about BUYING in top quality youth. Just to point that out!!