All talk appeases the banks but...

[Guest]

Stuart has a point. if the americans want to play it safe, they could rake in money with a top 4 place, no problem, but our club is all about winning.

At the same time, I adhere completely to what DJS is saying. If the club isn't competing for the best players, if we aren't taking risks in the transfer market the way it should be, then people will be pissed off soon, and even business people should take that into account.

[stuartb]

It doesnt really matter what the bankers say in that respect mate, if we're not a CL side and perceived to either be in a title challenge, or on the cusp of one, the people will simply stop coming through the turnstiles. The only thing that'll keep sellout crowds is success on the pitch, no matter what the bankers say, or what G&H's business strategies are.

DJs - I dont have any evidence to suggest anything other than what you think would occur but personally id like to believe that we would still fill a big stadium regardless of relative success - but theres obviously a success level where we wouldnt maintain strong attendance. Im not sure what that is but Id like to think that our fans would support us through the wind and the rain. I would if I lived in the UK, had faith in the vision and could get to the games

[StevieG08]

I think G&H as with all other foreign investors* are gambling on being allowed to sell independant tv rights at some point in the future. Obviously not here in the UK but in S.America and Asia in particular. Also internet feeds etc. would be thrown into this. G&H are banking on exploiting our already huge fanbase and making a killing out of it, nothing wrong with this as long as they maintain the squad. Obviously a new, bigger stadium will allow them to also increase their revenue input. To be successful in these areas, i.e sell tv rights and fill the stadium etc. the team needs to be challenging at the top end of the prem and in europe every season IMO.



*This statement does not include russian mafia members looking to launder money.

[StevieG08]

DJs - I dont have any evidence to suggest anything other than what you think would occur but personally id like to believe that we would still fill a big stadium regardless of relative success - but theres obviously a success level where we wouldnt maintain strong attendance. Im not sure what that is but Id like to think that our fans would support us through the wind and the rain. I would if I lived in the UK, had faith in the vision and could get to the games

If we stopped being competetive we would struggle to fill the current stadium, let alone a 68k stadium IMO.

[Guest]

I would if I lived in the UK, had faith in the vision and could get to the games

Which vision stuart ? Competing for 3rd or 4th, having a relative stint at the top 2, then losing it in the end ? This club is built on success, and we need to win in the transfer market these days in order to build a platform which will see us successful on the pitch.

Yes, the hardcore supporters will still come in I assume, but is that what sport is made of ? Goalposts will soon change once again, as soon as the Lakshmi Mittal's come in and take over small clubs such as Birmingham. Success is not reserved to a minority anymore.

As I said, I understand from a business perspective, that by going sensible about spending etc ... and raking in TV revenue alongside gates receipts etc ... could be very profitable, but at the end of the day, they're completely missing the point if they think they can do that.

[Craig_H]

DJs - I dont have any evidence to suggest anything other than what you think would occur but personally id like to believe that we would still fill a big stadium regardless of relative success - but theres obviously a success level where we wouldnt maintain strong attendance. Im not sure what that is but Id like to think that our fans would support us through the wind and the rain. I would if I lived in the UK, had faith in the vision and could get to the games

Our fans will support us, eg the hard core. But there arent as many of those as some people assume. Certainly in the dreary times under GH sellouts werent happening as often as they do now. It's easy to forget that, but as i've said, Istanbul was a bit of a saviour for the club in more ways than one and if we returned to the days of UEFA Cup football and the dreary dull afternoons at Anfield that happened during GH's time, there's no way in hell we'd sell out every game like we do now. Not a cat in hell's chance. We didnt then, so why would we now? And that's 45,000 we're talking about not being filled, let alone 60k+...

[Craig_H]

If we stopped being competetive we would struggle to fill the current stadium, let alone a 68k stadium IMO.

Exactly.

This was reality only a few years back. People must have short memories.

[Craig_H]

I think G&H as with all other foreign investors* are gambling on being allowed to sell independant tv rights at some point in the future. Obviously not here in the UK but in S.America and Asia in particular. Also internet feeds etc. would be thrown into this. G&H are banking on exploiting our already huge fanbase and making a killing out of it, nothing wrong with this as long as they maintain the squad. Obviously a new, bigger stadium will allow them to also increase their revenue input. To be successful in these areas, i.e sell tv rights and fill the stadium etc. the team needs to be challenging at the top end of the prem and in europe every season IMO.



*This statement does not include russian mafia members looking to launder money.

Nail on the fecking head. Independent TV rights are a goldmine and they're the sole reason the majority of these foreign investors have come into the Premiership IMO, the glazers have saddled MUFC with debt, not for a laugh, but because they're counting on being able to sell independent TV rights and if that is allowed to happen, it'll make their initial outlay for United seem like loose change.

Clubs with huge fanbases can rely on these, especially overseas. It's no coincidence that those with such fanbases happen to be successful clubs. United's dominance in the 90s has ensured a huge fanbase in Asia, ours in the 70s and 80s still holds some sway now (but it was weakening until Istanbul) and it's no surprise that Chelsea's increased merchandising revenues have coincided with a period of major success for them.

Become an also-ran and the 'huge worldwide fanbase' will suddenly decrease in an alarming fashion.

I agree with every word you've said in your post mate.

[StevieG08]

Exactly.

This was reality only a few years back. People must have short memories.

Morning DJS, i'm now in a position where it's a 5 hour each way drive to Anfield and if i stay the night to avoid the mad journey home i'm looking at shelling out 200quid or so. I support the club as much as i can but there would be people who wouldn't go if we were playing **** football and losing at home against mid-table opposition. This is the fact of modern football i'm afraid.

[stuartb]

Which vision stuart ? Competing for 3rd or 4th, having a relative stint at the top 2, then losing it in the end ? This club is built on success, and we need to win in the transfer market these days in order to build a platform which will see us successful on the pitch.

Yes, the hardcore supporters will still come in I assume, but is that what sport is made of ? Goalposts will soon change once again, as soon as the Lakshmi Mittal's come in and take over small clubs such as Birmingham. Success is not reserved to a minority anymore.

As I said, I understand from a business perspective, that by going sensible about spending etc ... and raking in TV revenue alongside gates receipts etc ... could be very profitable, but at the end of the day, they're completely missing the point if they think they can do that.

Completely agree that they are missing the point if they think thats the case but thats probably the whole point/question in a nutbag. I guess time will tell if they are missing the point or not - we all hope they arent

[Craig_H]

Completely agree that they are missing the point if they think thats the case but thats probably the whole point/question in a nutbag. I guess time will tell if they are missing the point or not - we all hope they arent

I hope they are.

If UEFA Cup football and no realistic title challenge ends up being enough for them to make a return on their investment (which i very much doubt), then there's no incentive for them to bring top players in.

If a couple of years without challenging is what it takes for them to realise that they HAVE to bring in class players, then it's a sacrifice i'm willing to make. We've waited 17 years, another 2 or 3 wont make that much difference.

[Guest]

Ok lads, I'm off for the week end.

See you tomorrow.

[Craig_H]

Ok lads, I'm off for the week end.

See you tomorrow.

[Phil Eel]

Good post stuart. I have my reservations also but I guess we'll just have to wait and see. The Bent's and Benayoun's of this world doesn't fill me with confidence at all, but if Rafa's happy, so am I.

The future holds all the answers. Seen somewhere here that pre-season training starts in 3 weeks (could someone confirm?), so it will be soon that we'll start to see concrete evidence of their spending.

4th July I hear they are back in - coincidentally !

[The Preacher]

the opportunity to acquire a business asset and global brand such as liverpool football club does not come along frequently. to walk into a business acquisition such as this and instantly realise what has to be done to improve the net worth of the business asset in terms of the increase and diversification of the various revenue streams whilst exploiting other existing marketing opportunities is a dream for any prospective acquirer.

its much harder to walk into a new business and find out what's going wrong as opposed to it being obvious how to to improve your multi million investment from day 1.

this is a business investment for the americans and as liverpool fans we will have to come to realise that.