The paper that cannot be mentioned

[MrMichael]

Mr.Michael is gay

No, what I mean is, if someone has inadvertently quoted some transfer ****e that has appeared from there by mistake, then everyone is bein a bit daft tearing into someone for it. BUT, if anyone is tryin to play down what the scum did warrants every bit of abuse sent there way.

About as mature as it gets from me fella

What you doing out on a Monday anyway, they tagged you or something?

[Barnyard]

Mr.Michael is gay

No, what I mean is, if someone has inadvertently quoted some transfer ****e that has appeared from there by mistake, then everyone is bein a bit daft tearing into someone for it. BUT, if anyone is tryin to play down what the scum did warrants every bit of abuse sent there way.

About as mature as it gets from me fella

I posted a long stream of transfer rumours the other day and didn't realise there was a story from that rag in there. I was told (by Kaip i think) and immediately apologised and removed it. Job done.

I think this should be the approach, as its easy done by accident.

[paulcooper4]

I posted a long stream of transfer rumours the other day and didn't realise there was a story from that rag in there. I was told (by Kaip i think) and immediately apologised and removed it. Job done.

I think this should be the approach, as its easy done by accident.

If it was as innocent as that fella, just tell everyone to go **** themselves mate. I was at hillsborough myself with my brother and am not so touchy to pounce on someone for making a genuine mistake.

[Barnyard]

If it was as innocent as that fella, just tell everyone to go **** themselves mate. I was at hillsborough myself with my brother and am not so touchy to pounce on someone for making a genuine mistake.

Cheers Paul

[Pacman]

Whats the bobby here then? cant be arsed reading through a million posts!! due to being a lazy *******. Is there a few people on here who think the scum was right or something?? or have i got my wires crossed? as usual!

I haven't read all the threads fella but I think I get the gist.

Fat Tony posted the rumours section from the BBC website which included stories from the rag we don't talk about.

Someone pointed out the fact we shouldn't be quoting anything from that rag.

Fredo said we should move on as a lot of young Liverpool supporters wont be aware of the reasons behind our boycott of the rag.

Revo and a few others took expection to Fredo's comments and pointed out to Fredo that they thought he was out of order.

That thread was closed.

I personally disagree with what Fredo said however I think the matter is all done and dusted and closed and we should all leave it be. Revo (god bless him) wear's his heart on his sleeve as we all know and I hope everything is cool with him because I believe he is an honest poster who says what he thinks and what he believes but IMO doesn't mean any harm whatsoever.

Just my 2pence worth Coops.

[poorscousertommy]

If it was as innocent as that fella, just tell everyone to go **** themselves mate. I was at hillsborough myself with my brother and am not so touchy to pounce on someone for making a genuine mistake

I agree, it was not that simple with the kick off surrounding this thread though mate.

Fredo talked about his "objective views" on Hillsborough and said people should "move on".

IMO he backed into a corner and defended himself because he was stung by criticism that he received.

Toys out of pram and all that.

It was not as straight forward as the above but I cannot be bothered summarising it all!

See my original post below for my stance on it.

I have just read this thread for the first time and thought I would put my two penny's worth in.

I never saw the original thread so have not seen the most of what caused all this fuss. I have to admit though that the quote from Fredo about "moving on" would have upset me too. It was definitley insensitive.

I feel more qualified than a lot of people to speak on this subject because not only am I born an bred Scouser and a season ticket holder for the last 21 years (I have been going the game regularly since I was 5 and am 31 now) but I also lost my 19 year old cousin who used to stand next to me and my dad on the Kop at the disaster.

My opinion is that the only personal boycott should be against *** *** itself. If you started extending the boycott to everything Murdoch related where would it stop? It's the paper and that **** Mackenzie who I have a problem with.

I have no problem if the BBC transfer gossip is cut and pasted onto a forum and it contains a rumour from the despicable rag. Buying it though, is another matter entirely. I think that maybe a solution to the upset caused would be to delete the names of the source the rumour came from, therefore giving no mention of the rag on the site (do not shoot me down for this opinion but it is just that I am happy just to boycott the rag and not mention it's name).

*** ***'s comments not only tried to disgrace Liverpool fans but were also a slight on the name of every Scouser. It highlighted every stereotype ever made in relation to the City of Liverpool and also took those stereotypes onto a more dispicable level. I feel for that reason it hurts the people of Liverpool that little bit more than it does those who are based outside of it.

Based on my belief of the above, people from outside the country are never going to understand the depth of hatred due to the paper. However, if they have been fans for a long time they should know enough not to make comments on a subject that is so fragile.

I don't know Fredo (as you can telll by my post count I have not made an effort on this site until recently) but do feel that, due to the information and reaction from people who do know him (ScouserTommy for example), he should have known better. But this is the internet, people sometimes do not think before they post and some people react aggressively to things written that they don't like (the apparent vitriol that followed Fredo's ill chosen words) and some people always go on the defensive even if they are wrong (Fredo's reaction to them).

In short such a sensitive subject is going to cause all sorts of reactions. It all depends on the persons personality which causes them to react the way they do.

Did Fredo apologise for saying something which was insensitive? If so then let's put it down as a lesson learned. If not then let him apologise and move on.

If anything, this thread may have helped educate some newer Liverpool fans on the subject and hopefully stop them from making the same mistake in future.

All the above is based on my opinion only and obviously I probably do not reflect the thoughts of everyone who lost family and where also there. I just thought I would offer a different view point to this discussion in the same way that someone like RS4 does so.

A long read but I hope it was worth it. As many of my friends will tell you, it is a subject I will often avoid speaking about so this is a rare post indeed!

[disco]

I got lost when the original opinion was clouded by people bringing racism and xenophobia into it. My opinion is that the disaster stands on its own as an issue and the media backlash was built on decades of tribal disputes over employment, sporting success and class divides. To simply say that the paper was being 'racist' against Scousers is to miss the point entirely. The cultural history of England is far too complex to simply allocate a rather recently redefined ism as the sole cause of media descrimination.

I thought racism was mentioned because people on this site are (rightly) very offended by referrals to the newspaper and everyone is sensitive to this, however these same people don't see anything wrong with comments on other subjects that are offensive (e.g. racism/quasi-racism).

In other words, people should be consistent - if they're offended by something they should realise that there are things they say that are very offensive to other people.

Helios - is that right?!

[Dhav]

Out of interest, what did Fredo mean by "we should move on"? Was he suggesting the boycott should end? I too am not arsed to read the whole thread.

[paulcooper4]

I haven't read all the threads fella but I think I get the gist.

Fat Tony posted the rumours section from the BBC website which included stories from the rag we don't talk about.

Someone pointed out the fact we shouldn't be quoting anything from that rag.

Fredo said we should move on as a lot of young Liverpool supporters wont be aware of the reasons behind our boycott of the rag.

Revo and a few others took expection to Fredo's comments and pointed out to Fredo that they thought he was out of order.

That thread was closed.

I personally disagree with what Fredo said however I think the matter is all done and dusted and closed and we should all leave it be. Revo (god bless him) wear's his heart on his sleeve as we all know and I hope everything is cool with him because I believe he is an honest poster who says what he thinks and what he believes but IMO doesn't mean any harm whatsoever.

Just my 2pence worth Coops.

[paulcooper4]

I agree, it was not that simple with the kick off surrounding this thread though mate.

Fredo talked about his "objective views" on Hillsborough and said people should "move on".

IMO he backed into a corner and defended himself because he was stung by criticism that he received.

Toys out of pram and all that.

It was not as straight forward as the above but I cannot be bothered summarising it all!

See my original post below for my stance on it.

agree with your post fella. Pretty much a similar situation to me

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

I thought racism was mentioned because people on this site are (rightly) very offended by referrals to the newspaper and everyone is sensitive to this, however these same people don't see anything wrong with comments on other subjects that are offensive (e.g. racism/quasi-racism).

In other words, people should be consistent - if they're offended by something they should realise that there are things they say that are very offensive to other people.

Helios - is that right?!

Cheers for clearing that up Disco. I got a little confused after the whole ongoing debate. Sure, the double standards of your average human are clear to see and a football crowd is no different. But I found Helios' comment a little rash as it deflected the argument and brought in another parameter. My comment was aimed at the assumption that media bias against Liverpool was some form of racism.

[disco]

Cheers for clearing that up Disco. I got a little confused after the whole ongoing debate. Sure, the double standards of your average human are clear to see and a football crowd is no different. But I found Helios' comment a little rash as it deflected the argument and brought in another parameter. My comment was aimed at the assumption that media bias against Liverpool was some form of racism.

Yes, I think Helios's comment is an aside, but still a very relevant one albeit a distraction from the main argument.

[poorscousertommy]

agree with your post fella. Pretty much a similar situation to me

Cheers mate

[Guest]

Out of interest, what did Fredo mean by "we should move on"? Was he suggesting the boycott should end? I too am not arsed to read the whole thread.

Ok, from the horses mouth and it will be my final word on it.

I made a mistake in trying to be too smart on a sensitive issue. I wanted a debate and I got a real bashing and rightly so. I've talked to revo at length on that and as far as we're concerned, there's no issue whatsoever anymore. I know nothing about Hillsborough (as I wasn't there and know only know of what I've read), but I'm not hiding from it.

I don't expect people to respect me from what I've said if I've hurt their feelings, but I've gone at length into saying I didn't mean any harm, even if my words were stupid to say the least.

We're all a family, in supporting this club, during the good and bad times, and I'm with all fellow reds like me in agreeing with them on this issue about that rag.

I'm finished with it now fellas.

[Dhav]

Ok, from the horses mouth and it will be my final word on it.

I made a mistake in trying to be too smart on a sensitive issue. I wanted a debate and I got a real bashing and rightly so. I've talked to revo at length on that and as far as we're concerned, there's no issue whatsoever anymore. I know nothing about Hillsborough (as I wasn't there and know only know of what I've read), but I'm not hiding from it.

I don't expect people to respect me from what I've said if I've hurt their feelings, but I've gone at length into saying I didn't mean any harm, even if my words were stupid to say the least.

We're all a family, in supporting this club, during the good and bad times, and I'm with all fellow reds like me in agreeing with them on this issue about that rag.

I'm finished with it now fellas.

Ok mate, sounds like you made a bit of a school-boy error.