Carragher follows Bascombe

[kurtangle01]

You're right in that it doesn't matter.

No need for that, mate.

[Rafa Shankly]

excuse me but one or two of us was there that day carrying bodies off the pitch and still carry the scars with us today. who the **** do you think you are telling us to get down off our high horse and who the **** do you think you are telling us we are hypocritical. for starters you have no ****ing idea of the hatred that SOME people carry over the two rags. stop hiding behind this sky telly bull****. there is an unwritten code amongst many many scousers that the notw goes hand in hand with the sun(fact) the notw is not boycotted(fact) but many many scousers adhere to the unwriten code of noy buying or reading the notw. when 2 of our own bascombe and carra, in many many peoples hearts break that code there is going to be discord and anger. you need to acknowledge how many many scousers feel instead of dismissing us with your easy to throw out there words.
not that it matters but the hjc crowd are going to be discussing this at their next meeting

i think it goes without saying that im not talking about anyone who was envolved.
i have complete sympathy for everyone who was personally envolved in the tragedy but there seems to be some conflicting views from scousers on how the people of liverpool view the notw.

its either a city wide feeling that the notw is the sunday *** or a small pocket one way or the other.

id tend to lean towards the way the majority of scousers feel,i just assumed the majority do not view the notw as the sunday ***.

did not mean to make light of the situation or insult anyone who has been touched by hillsborough,my apoligies.

as for sky.
your a scouser and you know about the unwritten code,but im sure a whole lot of people who have a problem with carra and are not from liverpool dont know about it and simply choose to over look sky because over looking sky would mean missing everything it has to offer,thats hypocritical imo.

[Revo]

i think it goes without saying that im not talking about anyone who was envolved.
i have complete sympathy for everyone who was personally envolved in the tragedy but there seems to be some conflicting views from scousers on how the people of liverpool view the notw.

its either a city wide feeling that the notw is the sunday *** or a small pocket one way or the other.

id tend to lean towards the way the majority of scousers feel,i just assumed the majority do not view the notw as the sunday ***.

did not mean to make light of the situation or insult anyone who has been touched by hillsborough,my apoligies.

as for sky.
your a scouser and you know about the unwritten code,but im sure a whole lot of people who have a problem with carra and are not from liverpool dont know about it and simply choose to over look sky because over looking sky would mean missing everything it has to offer,thats hypocritical imo.

thanks for your clearance and for taking the time with your response mate. if you look at the community on rawk, carras decision has not gone down so well cos the overwhelming scouse community probably that they have. theres no right and wrong. RS4 is someone on here whom i respect the **** out of very very much. he was injured at hillsborough and he doesnt have a problem with the notw etc etc. i respect him 1000% for that but i dont agree with him but id bet my ****ing life on it that he would fully get where a lot of us are coming from, not that he would agree but he would totally get us and not be ****ing dismissive as some of the plonkers have been on here. thats the skinny mate

[royzared]

You're right in that it doesn't matter.

Really don't like what you are trying to do,it's not funny.

[Kenneth]

your one of the reasons these things get inflamed, you are ill informed and when you make the stupidest of comments about this having nothing to do with hillsborough, well what more do you want me to say. you dont have to agree with how i feel in my opinions but respect the **** how i feel.

Coming back to it, you're right and I apologise.

[Revo]

apology accepted

[royzared]

apology accepted

You deserve a couple of these

[Red_hot]

thanks for your clearance and for taking the time with your response mate. if you look at the community on rawk, carras decision has not gone down so well cos the overwhelming scouse community probably that they have. theres no right and wrong. RS4 is someone on here whom i respect the **** out of very very much. he was injured at hillsborough and he doesnt have a problem with the notw etc etc. i respect him 1000% for that but i dont agree with him but id bet my ****ing life on it that he would fully get where a lot of us are coming from, not that he would agree but he would totally get us and not be ****ing dismissive as some of the plonkers have been on here. thats the skinny mate

This post sums it up really. At the end of the day, we aren't all going to agree 100% but at least lets try to understand where each other is coming from and, as Kev says, not be dismissive of peoples feelings on what is probably the most emotive subject talked about on this forum.

Kudos to Operation for coming out and apologising also!

[Kaip]

Where's coops when you need him

[rushscored4]

thanks for your clearance and for taking the time with your response mate. if you look at the community on rawk, carras decision has not gone down so well cos the overwhelming scouse community probably that they have. theres no right and wrong. RS4 is someone on here whom i respect the **** out of very very much. he was injured at hillsborough and he doesnt have a problem with the notw etc etc. i respect him 1000% for that but i dont agree with him but id bet my ****ing life on it that he would fully get where a lot of us are coming from, not that he would agree but he would totally get us and not be ****ing dismissive as some of the plonkers have been on here. thats the skinny mate

I don't read the NOTW because it's a **** rag like most of the other tabloids and, for that matter, the broadsheets. I only read the Mirror on occasion and the Sunday Mirror maybe once a month. Despite what people might think I am from a humble working class background and I still have strong socialist principles and work ethics.

As I've said, I don't have an issue with Bascombe going to the NOTW but I fully respect people like Coops and Kev who've got stronger opinions about the subject.

Like I've also said, IMHO there are far more important things to worry about than whether a journalist (as good as he is) is going to work for another newspaper (as **** as it is)...

[Darth Marty]

I love this club and I love all the supporters.
We deserve all accolades as despite the highs and lows we have experienced, some more than others, we are still here, lending support to this magnificent club.
Revo, good to have you back mate

[Shanks]

Where's coops when you need him

Probably slating someone or offering them out.



These are quotes that I have posted and fully agree with
Feel free to pick..


"The boycott does not belong to anybody at the club, any organisation, it belongs to you- the fans of Liverpool FC and the people of the city".

"The club don't give two ****s about the boycott, in the past they have tried to broker talks that most of us would never have wanted to take place".

"How each and every person interprets that boycott is down to you".

"At the end of the day, there is not a lot the players have to do to keep within boundaries. If they cannot respect that or worse are ignorant to the views of those that idolise them, it is difficult, at best, to understand".



"Are you suggesting that anyone who believes they are separate papers isn't a genuine Liverpool fan"?


"The logical conclusion would be to boycott all of Murdoch's empire through guilt by association but people don't want to do that. Therefore it just makes Liverpool supporters look silly because the boycott appears mindless and like a buffet (Pick and choose).

"An example - If the NOTW issued an apology on Sunday about "The Truth" headline, it wouldn't hold any weight, as it came from a different paper".

"I think all of us understand that the two are related.
The question is: does that make them the same?
With different management, different staff and different coverage of Hillsborough, I believe they are not the same, and excluded from the boycott.

"Mon-Sat schedule of the S*n, and Sunday NOTW, with cross-marketing to target the same type of readership, others, like you, believe them to be the same and included in the boycott".






In the aftermath of Hillsborough there were other news sources carrying similar stories to The S*n.
So what daily paper do you read? Only the locals?
Surprisingly one of the most offensive reports came from much closer to home, the Liverpool Daily Post.

An article written by John Williams and entitled: "I blame the yobs" warrants extensive quoting:

'So it was at Hillsborough that the yobs made enough nuisance of themselves to convince the police that so-called gates of Hell were opened… the gatecrashers wreaked their fatal havoc. At best it was unfettered zeal. At worst it was uncontrolled fanaticism and mass hysteria which literally squeezed the life out of men, women and children. This was yobbism at its most base. People without tickets who had no right to be there were crushing to death their fellow Scousers. When it comes to apportioning blame, the accusatory finger can also be pointed at Liverpool. Scouse killed Scouse for no better reason than 22 men were kicking a ball'

This was ‘One of our own’ and not some Southern hack from a tabloid rag. In spite of a barrage of complaints the author stood "by every word with no apology". In fact he went on to write a second article reaffirming the contents of the first and also referring to "those who so thoughtlessly took lives away".
This article by Williams was in stark contrast to one written in the same paper by Brian Reade only a day earlier and poignantly entitled:"DEAD BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T COUNT". Reade correctly challenged the dangers of stereotyping fans as yobs stating:
...society had been happy to live with the myth that every football fan is a potential criminal. Well, nearly 100 people have just paid the price for this woeful misconception.
This was obviously not enough to warrant a boycott of either of our local papers. Why?


Bryan Reade has always been a well respected journalist on merseyside, yet he went to work for The Daily Mirror in 1994, a year before Kelvin Mackenzie joined as one of their bosses, albeit in television rather than newspapers. Should Reade have resigned, should he have been condemned for working for the same company? ‘Guilt by association’ ?Maybe you read The Daily Mail who reported Paul Middup, spokesperson for the Police Federation, as saying:

I am sick of hearing how good the crowd were...They were arriving tanked up on drink and the situation faced by the officers trying to control them was quite simply terrifying.

The Daily Star carried the ‘Dead fans robbed by drunk thugs’ headline, do any of you read that paper?

The Times, another in the News Int stable reported: Drunkenness and hooliganism were a major factor in the Hillsborough Disaster, police said yesterday. Tony Evans who is a their Deputy Football editor is not only a Scouser but a good Red who always fights our corner and has written several books on Liverpool and the fans. Has he been condemned for working for them?

Television news also made great play of comments made by the Police Federation:
Sheffield police officers claimed tonight that drunkenness amongst Liverpool fans was at least partly responsible for the disaster at Hillsborough…According to the Police Federation a large number of Liverpool fans arrived at the ground late after drinking heavily and police couldn't control them.
Do we boycott The BBC/ITV etc and all of their subsidiary stations and condemn those that associate themselves with them.?
Do we stop watching their stations?


By 6pm on the evening of April15th Radio 4 stated: Many reports speak of people without tickets having pushed their way in. So the scene had been set and the conspiracy had begun - Liverpool fans, angry at having no tickets had forced their way into the ground with disastrous consequences. : It's clear that many hundreds of Liverpool fans travelled to Hillsborough even though they didn't have tickets for the game. Shortly before the match started it appears that these fans were able to get into the ground through a gate at the Leppings Lane end. One report says the gate was kicked down... So do we boycott BBC radio at all?
Given the smear campaign by the police, would we dare to stop using their services or condemn one of our children for becoming a copper or doesn't ‘Guilt by association’ count in that instance?


So if the boycott is solely with The S*n can the outcry recently with Carragher and Bascombe and the News of the World be given credibility even though they didn't carry any vile headlines. Headlines and comments that have been carried far more openly with other media outlets which don't have any boycott or stigma attached to them?


If the boycott and widespread condemnation of anything associated with Mackenzie is to be continued why doesn't this extend to Rupert Murdoch who owned the S*n at the time? What about the other companies owned by him. Do we boycott them too?


Take a look at a selection of some of those companies and ask yourself how far do we extend the boycott, if we do at all. Can we be bothered.?

Apparently not.

News of the World, The S*n, Sunday Times, The Times,Times Literary Supplement, 20th Century Fox (Television/Film and home entertainment),Searchlight pictures,National Geographic Channel, FX, Fox Movie Channel, Sky television, Harper Collins publishers, My Space.com, American Idol and Rotten Tomatoes.com.

These are just a few of the more well known arms of the massive company that Murdoch heads. Do we use any of these?

‘Guilt by association’ or not?





For the record,
I lost a mate at Hillsborough but I occasionally buy the NOTW.

[Robster007]

Not this again?
NOTW is not the S*n, there is no boycott of the NOTW....surely, of all people, Carragher would know the level of feeling on writing for the NOTW, and obviously he sees no wrong in it.
Some people will make a big deal of this though.

Exactly.

Unbelievable really.

Of all the players in our squad.

Regardless of whether it's part of the 'official' boycot or not, it's an extremely grey area that is sure to upset and anger a fair chunk of our support. It's not like he needs the cash or anything.

The NOTW is The Sunday Sun.

Poor, really poor Carra.

Have you heard yourself?

Shut up.

[Revo]

Probably slating someone or offering them out.



These are quotes that I have posted and fully agree with
Feel free to pick..


"The boycott does not belong to anybody at the club, any organisation, it belongs to you- the fans of Liverpool FC and the people of the city".

"The club don't give two ****s about the boycott, in the past they have tried to broker talks that most of us would never have wanted to take place".

"How each and every person interprets that boycott is down to you".

"At the end of the day, there is not a lot the players have to do to keep within boundaries. If they cannot respect that or worse are ignorant to the views of those that idolise them, it is difficult, at best, to understand".



"Are you suggesting that anyone who believes they are separate papers isn't a genuine Liverpool fan"?


"The logical conclusion would be to boycott all of Murdoch's empire through guilt by association but people don't want to do that. Therefore it just makes Liverpool supporters look silly because the boycott appears mindless and like a buffet (Pick and choose).

"An example - If the NOTW issued an apology on Sunday about "The Truth" headline, it wouldn't hold any weight, as it came from a different paper".

"I think all of us understand that the two are related.
The question is: does that make them the same?
With different management, different staff and different coverage of Hillsborough, I believe they are not the same, and excluded from the boycott.

"Mon-Sat schedule of the S*n, and Sunday NOTW, with cross-marketing to target the same type of readership, others, like you, believe them to be the same and included in the boycott".






In the aftermath of Hillsborough there were other news sources carrying similar stories to The S*n.
So what daily paper do you read? Only the locals?
Surprisingly one of the most offensive reports came from much closer to home, the Liverpool Daily Post.

An article written by John Williams and entitled: "I blame the yobs" warrants extensive quoting:

'So it was at Hillsborough that the yobs made enough nuisance of themselves to convince the police that so-called gates of Hell were opened… the gatecrashers wreaked their fatal havoc. At best it was unfettered zeal. At worst it was uncontrolled fanaticism and mass hysteria which literally squeezed the life out of men, women and children. This was yobbism at its most base. People without tickets who had no right to be there were crushing to death their fellow Scousers. When it comes to apportioning blame, the accusatory finger can also be pointed at Liverpool. Scouse killed Scouse for no better reason than 22 men were kicking a ball'

This was ‘One of our own’ and not some Southern hack from a tabloid rag. In spite of a barrage of complaints the author stood "by every word with no apology". In fact he went on to write a second article reaffirming the contents of the first and also referring to "those who so thoughtlessly took lives away".
This article by Williams was in stark contrast to one written in the same paper by Brian Reade only a day earlier and poignantly entitled:"DEAD BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T COUNT". Reade correctly challenged the dangers of stereotyping fans as yobs stating:
...society had been happy to live with the myth that every football fan is a potential criminal. Well, nearly 100 people have just paid the price for this woeful misconception.
This was obviously not enough to warrant a boycott of either of our local papers. Why?


Bryan Reade has always been a well respected journalist on merseyside, yet he went to work for The Daily Mirror in 1994, a year before Kelvin Mackenzie joined as one of their bosses, albeit in television rather than newspapers. Should Reade have resigned, should he have been condemned for working for the same company? ‘Guilt by association’ ?Maybe you read The Daily Mail who reported Paul Middup, spokesperson for the Police Federation, as saying:

I am sick of hearing how good the crowd were...They were arriving tanked up on drink and the situation faced by the officers trying to control them was quite simply terrifying.

The Daily Star carried the ‘Dead fans robbed by drunk thugs’ headline, do any of you read that paper?

The Times, another in the News Int stable reported: Drunkenness and hooliganism were a major factor in the Hillsborough Disaster, police said yesterday. Tony Evans who is a their Deputy Football editor is not only a Scouser but a good Red who always fights our corner and has written several books on Liverpool and the fans. Has he been condemned for working for them?

Television news also made great play of comments made by the Police Federation:
Sheffield police officers claimed tonight that drunkenness amongst Liverpool fans was at least partly responsible for the disaster at Hillsborough…According to the Police Federation a large number of Liverpool fans arrived at the ground late after drinking heavily and police couldn't control them.
Do we boycott The BBC/ITV etc and all of their subsidiary stations and condemn those that associate themselves with them.?
Do we stop watching their stations?


By 6pm on the evening of April15th Radio 4 stated: Many reports speak of people without tickets having pushed their way in. So the scene had been set and the conspiracy had begun - Liverpool fans, angry at having no tickets had forced their way into the ground with disastrous consequences. : It's clear that many hundreds of Liverpool fans travelled to Hillsborough even though they didn't have tickets for the game. Shortly before the match started it appears that these fans were able to get into the ground through a gate at the Leppings Lane end. One report says the gate was kicked down... So do we boycott BBC radio at all?
Given the smear campaign by the police, would we dare to stop using their services or condemn one of our children for becoming a copper or doesn't ‘Guilt by association’ count in that instance?


So if the boycott is solely with The S*n can the outcry recently with Carragher and Bascombe and the News of the World be given credibility even though they didn't carry any vile headlines. Headlines and comments that have been carried far more openly with other media outlets which don't have any boycott or stigma attached to them?


If the boycott and widespread condemnation of anything associated with Mackenzie is to be continued why doesn't this extend to Rupert Murdoch who owned the S*n at the time? What about the other companies owned by him. Do we boycott them too?


Take a look at a selection of some of those companies and ask yourself how far do we extend the boycott, if we do at all. Can we be bothered.?

Apparently not.

News of the World, The S*n, Sunday Times, The Times,Times Literary Supplement, 20th Century Fox (Television/Film and home entertainment),Searchlight pictures,National Geographic Channel, FX, Fox Movie Channel, Sky television, Harper Collins publishers, My Space.com, American Idol and Rotten Tomatoes.com.

These are just a few of the more well known arms of the massive company that Murdoch heads. Do we use any of these?

‘Guilt by association’ or not?





For the record,
I lost a mate at Hillsborough but I occasionally buy the NOTW.

what a well written articulated post that is and im sorry for the loss of your mate back then but id go back to one of the quotes

"How each and every person interprets that boycott is down to you".

couldnt be any simpler really, some of us are pissed at recent developments some of you are not. it doesnt make anyone of us lesser reds no matter how big the divide is in this particuliar issue

[Red_Polo]

what a well written articulated post that is and im sorry for the loss of your mate back then but id go back to one of the quotes

"How each and every person interprets that boycott is down to you".

couldnt be any simpler really, some of us are pissed at recent developments some of you are not. it doesnt make anyone of us lesser reds no matter how big the divide is in this particuliar issue

Sums it up for me, we have far too much in common to allow this to divide us

Have you heard yourself?

Shut up.

If that's your attitude you're probably best off taking your own advice.