Torres

[reddragon]

Bring it on knob jockey

[peekay]

Aragones once said of Torres " Every goal he scores is different"

So tru

Torres

[JCase]

Get whay you are saying mate.

After all the disappointments in recent years: Collymore, Heskey, Diouf, Cisse, Baros and Kuyt I just didn't dare hope that we had finally bought a geniune class act.

Finally.

Yes, finally. He's a class act. Hopefully the manager plays him in all league games if he's fit. Torres makes the rest of our current strikers look very ordinary

[reddragon]

Yes, finally. He's a class act. Hopefully the manager plays him in all league games if he's fit. Torres makes the rest of our current strikers look very ordinary

no chance. Rotation Rafa Rules the Roost

[sean_lfc]

I think people are jumping to wild conclusions here.


Before today, everyone was giving Rafa a hard ****ing time about not playing Torres in the league from the start vs Portsmouth/B'ham etc. (he had his reasons: International break, slight knock, etc.).

Now Rafa has given him an 'easier' game today to play in from the start, so he can shine, possibly nip a couple of goals, give him even more confidence and everyone was giving it the whole hoo-ha 'If he ****ing dares playing Torres from the start today in a worthless league game, I'll ****ing kill Rafa and then myself'.

Then after the hattrick today, everyone's ****ing creaming themselves about Torres (to be fair, he played very well, as we all saw) saying knee-jerk things such as/or better yet proving their beforementioned 'Torres needs to play every important (ie. league) game', he needs to play every league match.

People need to stop being so extreme about their opinions and stay a bit level-headed. It's obvious after today everyone - yet again - will expect Torres to be the ****ing God of football, scoring left right and centre against tough league opposition. And when he - in the future, SHOULD Rafa play him every league game 'from the start' (as so many people are crying out for - doesn't perform against let's say Bolton or whoever the ****, then people will give it the whole 'Well, maybe Rafa should've rested Torres for this game, it's clear he couldn't cut it against 9 men sitting deep behind the ball'.

What I'm trying to say is this:

Torres is just another member of the squad. Although he has supreme talent and prolific abilities, he's not a God. The hattrick today was nice, but it's not going to happen every game, especially not in the league. So I think Rafa is doing the right thing with his rotation policy. Torres will continue to be left on the bench for a number of league games, without a doubt, Hyypia just mentioned it today in the Echo - and as we all know, Rafa doesn't 'deal' with star players.

It's lovely to see Torres doing so well today, but it won't always be like that, far from it. There are still so many games to go and burn-out and all those factors will come into play, also we're approaching autumn/winter and the sun don't shine that much.

Rafa's managed 3 seasons in the league, he is not 'incompetent', he is no fool, far from it. He's ****ing amazingly intelligent in regards to football management, in every aspect.

We only see things as they come - the tip of the iceberg - we don't see the whole day in, day out training regimes, the morale issues, the team ethics, the intricate tactical details within a game and within league management, the harmony and synchronicity of certain times/lineups for certain opposition etc. We only pretty much see what the media tell us and the 90 minutes during the week and at the weekend.

What I'm trying to get at, again, is that people should not use today's performance as a justification of their opinions prior to this game, ie. that 'Torres should start every league game as it's obvious what different class Torres is in'. This might be true, however to Rafa, he's just another member of the squad, and this needs to be recognised. He will not get preferrential treatment just 'because he's so good'. He has different attributes and gives us 'possibilities' which is what Rafa will count on against certain opposition. Against other opposition he will turn to Crouch/Voronin/Kuyt.

[Fiddy]

Maybe it's a bit late, but I don't get a lot of that post and completely disagree with most of it....

Now Rafa has given him an 'easier' game today to play in from the start, so he can shine, possibly nip a couple of goals, give him even more confidence and everyone was giving it the whole hoo-ha 'If he ****ing dares playing Torres from the start today in a worthless league game, I'll ****ing kill Rafa and then myself'.

Then after the hattrick today, everyone's ****ing creaming themselves about Torres (to be fair, he played very well, as we all saw) saying knee-jerk things such as/or better yet proving their beforementioned 'Torres needs to play every important (ie. league) game', he needs to play every league match.

I've read that 5 times now and it still doesn't make sense...so Rafa plays Torres against a lesser team and he smacks the **** out of them, but for some reason people will go mad about him playing in 'worthless' league games, when he's just proved to anyone with half a brain he should play against anyone and everyone when fit?!

People need to stop being so extreme about their opinions and stay a bit level-headed. It's obvious after today everyone - yet again - will expect Torres to be the ****ing God of football, scoring left right and centre against tough league opposition. And when he - in the future, SHOULD Rafa play him every league game 'from the start' (as so many people are crying out for - doesn't perform against let's say Bolton or whoever the ****, then people will give it the whole 'Well, maybe Rafa should've rested Torres for this game, it's clear he couldn't cut it against 9 men sitting deep behind the ball'.

I disagree, again any fan with half a brain now should be made up just to see Torres in the line-up, and we can't expect him to destroy EVERY team he plays against or not have the odd bad game

What I'm trying to say is this:

Torres is just another member of the squad.

No, he really isn't. If Rafa had a list of 'untouchables', he'd be well on there, along with Stevie, Carra, Reina and possibly Finnan. Someone who, if fit, should always be in the team.

Although he has supreme talent and prolific abilities, he's not a God. The hattrick today was nice, but it's not going to happen every game, especially not in the league.

Stating the obvious really isn't that?! Unless you know of any strikers that do score hattricks every game...overall mate I think you need to calm down with your attempts to calm people down. Torres has looked special right from day one - what LFC fan wouldn't get excited about that and wouldn't want to see him playing every game?! And if someone wants to go a bit OTT about Torres, I won't hold it against them, because given some of the dross we've had to endure up front over the last few years, they ****in deserve someone who gets us all out of our seats everytime he's near the ball!

[sean_lfc]

Originally Posted by sean_lfc View Post

Maybe it's a bit late, but I don't get a lot of that post and completely disagree with most of it....

Quote:
Now Rafa has given him an 'easier' game today to play in from the start, so he can shine, possibly nip a couple of goals, give him even more confidence and everyone was giving it the whole hoo-ha 'If he ****ing dares playing Torres from the start today in a worthless league game, I'll ****ing kill Rafa and then myself'.

Then after the hattrick today, everyone's ****ing creaming themselves about Torres (to be fair, he played very well, as we all saw) saying knee-jerk things such as/or better yet proving their beforementioned 'Torres needs to play every important (ie. league) game', he needs to play every league match.


I've read that 5 times now and it still doesn't make sense...so Rafa plays Torres against a lesser team and he smacks the **** out of them, but for some reason people will go mad about him playing in 'worthless' league games, when he's just proved to anyone with half a brain he should play against anyone and everyone when fit?!


Right, I'll try and explain this reasonably. First of all, I will say, and you should agree with me, because one couldn't avoid it, that since the B'ham game everyone was going on about 'Torres needs to play in every league game, he's that good'. Fair enough, but as you know, and as Hyypia ****ing said so, and pretty much everyone 'with half a brain' knows, Rafa will continue to rotate, whether it's the "right or the wrong" thing to do (and this is PURELY subjective, as pretty much most fans don't have the footballing knowledge Rafa has (otherwise they'd be in Rafa's position would they not?)). You will NOT change Rafa's stance on this matter, without a ****ing doubt?! I mean, Rafa's rotation policy is not going to change, get over it? Just for the record, it is open for interpretation whether Rafa is rotating at the right times, but I will give him the benefit of the doubt, as he knows just that little bit more about football (over the course of a whole damn season in 4 different competitions) than I do and he has a much clearer and hands-on insight as to the whole exterior reality that is going on at our club (players' fitness/morale/opposition tactics, etc.) than I do.
Furthermore, people went mad about him playing in 'worthless' league cup games BEFORE today's result, the hattrick and so forth. BEFORE


Quote:
People need to stop being so extreme about their opinions and stay a bit level-headed. It's obvious after today everyone - yet again - will expect Torres to be the ****ing God of football, scoring left right and centre against tough league opposition. And when he - in the future, SHOULD Rafa play him every league game 'from the start' (as so many people are crying out for - doesn't perform against let's say Bolton or whoever the ****, then people will give it the whole 'Well, maybe Rafa should've rested Torres for this game, it's clear he couldn't cut it against 9 men sitting deep behind the ball'.

I disagree, again any fan with half a brain now should be made up just to see Torres in the line-up, and we can't expect him to destroy EVERY team he plays against or not have the odd bad game

That's what I was saying no in a different paragraph 'It was lovely to see Torres playing well' or something to that effect. I'm just thinking ahead here, towards the reaction this board will get WHEN things don't go the way they expect them to go NOW that Torres had such a great game, it will be all this two-faced, fickle, hypocritical bull****, when people will find one way or another to have another go at Rafa, you know it will happen. It's been happening after EVERY ****ING GAME where we don't win by lots of goals

Quote:
What I'm trying to say is this:

Torres is just another member of the squad.


No, he really isn't. If Rafa had a list of 'untouchables', he'd be well on there, along with Stevie, Carra, Reina and possibly Finnan. Someone who, if fit, should always be in the team.

How do you know this? I mean, it actually points in the opposite direction, what Rafa does and what he actually believes in are two different things. I would say, if Rafa had an even better squad, and I believe this to be his ultimate goal, he would have no list of "untouchables" whatsoever. He has said so himself, he doesn't deal with star-players? He sees everyone equal. Just because it doesn't seem to be like that on the pitch (ie. with Finnan/Reina etc.) doesn't mean that his philosophy isn't like that. ie. no one is 'untouchable'. You also mention 'someone who is fit, should always be in the team: Do you mean, they should play every game, regardless of how 'important' it is? Hah, of course you will now say 'Yea but no but yea but of course on some occasions, these untouchables are actually touchable? What's going on?

Quote:
Although he has supreme talent and prolific abilities, he's not a God. The hattrick today was nice, but it's not going to happen every game, especially not in the league.

Stating the obvious really isn't that?! Unless you know of any strikers that do score hattricks every game...overall mate I think you need to calm down with your attempts to calm people down. Torres has looked special right from day one - what LFC fan wouldn't get excited about that and wouldn't want to see him playing every game?! And if someone wants to go a bit OTT about Torres, I won't hold it against them, because given some of the dross we've had to endure up front over the last few years, they ****in deserve someone who gets us all out of our seats everytime he's near the
ball!

Of course everyone would want to see Torres play every game, he's beautiful to watch when he's on song. But Rafa is still managing a whole team, it's not just about Torres and his wanting to please the fans with Torres playing every game. If Rafa were listening to us lot, **** me we'd never win anything. I'm just here trying to get into Rafa's head and not letting my half of a brain cloud my view over the ultimate benefits of when to play Torres and when not. He's only human himself, and Rafa is the man who's managing him, not me. So I try to take Rafa's perspective into consideration when I answer fans' statements such as your own 'Torres should play every game, EVERYONE can see that (what you mean is, every fan can see that, but Rafa is the man who's pulling the strings and he knows a bit more than I do. I'm the one who's pretty calm here, it's everyone else who's going off their rocket thinking they have justification of forming their opinions on Rafa based on their observation and not looking through Rafa's eyes (as well as their own). It's much easier to try and figure out why Rafa comes out with the choices he does than to blatantly refuse to accept that there is any reasoning behind Rafa's decisions and just calling them 'wrong' and 'incompetent' (I'm not saying you said this, but many people have and I'm incorporating many fans into this, not just you or some other schmuck lol)

[Guest]

He must play in every game. I mean every game, no rotation should be allowed when we have only one decent striker.

[Guest]

I've read that 5 times now and it still doesn't make sense...so Rafa plays Torres against a lesser team and he smacks the **** out of them, but for some reason people will go mad about him playing in 'worthless' league games, when he's just proved to anyone with half a brain he should play against anyone and everyone when fit?!

I don't think you have a brain yourself.

[Harv]

He must play in every game. I mean every game, no rotation should be allowed when we have only one decent striker.

we have three decent strikers, and one world class striker.

If we play Torres in every game he will be ****ed by Feb

Crouch and Kuyt are good enough to beat the likes of Birmingham. We finished 3rd with them last season after all.

People are really being a tad dramatic over our recent results. Torres was reseted for the Pompey game because he had a slight knock, and had played 2 games for Spain (likewise Gerrard). Torres looked very lethargic against Porto, and it was obvious he wasn't 100%.

There is no point in having a good squad if you dont use it to your advantage.

[Assassin]

Apart from his hat trick, I was very impressed how Torres handled the brut force defending of Duberry and Bikey

[Guest]

we have three decent strikers, and one world class striker.

If we play Torres in every game he will be ****ed by Feb

Crouch and Kuyt are good enough to beat the likes of Birmingham. We finished 3rd with them last season after all.

People are really being a tad dramatic over our recent results. Torres was reseted for the Pompey game because he had a slight knock, and had played 2 games for Spain (likewise Gerrard). Torres looked very lethargic against Porto, and it was obvious he wasn't 100%.

There is no point in having a good squad if you dont use it to your advantage.

That's exactly my point mate. I was a tad bit sarcastic with that post in reply to the moaners in this thread.

[Harv]

That's exactly my point mate. I was a tad bit sarcastic with that post in reply to the moaners in this thread.

i never detect your sarcasm

[bonzai]

I must admit that when we paid £20 million for him I thought it was a ludicrous amount of money, I still do even now. But the boy is starting to re-pay it now. Tonight, is the first time in a LONG LONG time that I've felt like this about a Liverpool F.C. striker, he played brilliantly tonight he really did.

I admit I didn't know an awful lot about Fernando Torres before we signed him, I've never really watched him play on Spanish Football highlights and have only seen glimpses of him playing for the Spanish team from time to time but tonight I take my hat off to him. He was very good.

Not just tonight though, since he's played his first game for us he has been excellent, his hardworking attitude has won over Liverpool fans and also a lot of neutral fans aswell, he doesn't cheat, dive or whinge which is weird for a foreign player. You can just tell by the way he plays and the way he acts that he's a genuine sort of guy. I've really got a good feeling about Torres you know, I don't want to get carried away but he looks like he could be the one that brings the glory days back to Anfield. He's restored a sense of passion and belief in Liverpool fans.

You could see the joy on the faces of the Liverpool fans at the game tonight, as much as I hate saying it but he's inspiring us the way Ronaldo inspired Utd last season, and that can only be good! We've got a new hero who's going to be here for a while, we've taken him to our hearts and I feel he's done the same.

Really impressed I must say. Good on you Fernando Torres, let's hope you bring back the good times.

Great post, welcome mate!

[ningnangnong]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x32dvb_reading-24-liverpool-league-cup-tor_sport

That's to the goals if you don't want to download the files posted earlier.