Rafa Benitez appreciation

[MrMichael]

I signed... just hope they don't read it too closely. Jesus.

Sorry, just realised I posted this in the angry mob thread by accident.

Mind the flaming torch! Coming through....

Does anyone else think that all the abuse being aimed at the owners might be somewhat counter-productive?

I'm 100% behind showing our support for Rafa, but some of the, well, xenophobic and ill-educated comments aimed in their direction leaves a bit of a bad taste imo. A week ago, before what has essentially been a media driven spat, fans seemed happy enough with them, just were wanting to see more from them to show they would continue living up to what they said.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if they became "unsure" about Rafa during the period a month or so ago when it seemed like the tide of fan opinion, certainly on boards like this, and phone in shows etc, was distinctly turning against Rafa. I see the more fickle element of our fanbase as potentially being as responsible for this whole "crisis" as anyone. So now, we let them know just what level of support Rafa has, and the results keep coming, everything could maybe sort itself out. If all they get is complete abuse now from the fans, it could create a them-and-us situation where they decide to try facing us down the way they have Rafa. This is a very different sporting world these guys come from, and if they start to feel Rafa has manipulated the situation to get the fans onside, and brought them a lot of the grief unfairly (seeing as none of us actually know everything that has been said behind closed doors), it could well work against what we actually want.

Just a thought like......

[kurtangle01]

Does anyone else think that all the abuse being aimed at the owners might be somewhat counter-productive?

I'm 100% behind showing our support for Rafa, but some of the, well, xenophobic and ill-educated comments aimed in their direction leaves a bit of a bad taste imo. A week ago, before what has essentially been a media driven spat, fans seemed happy enough with them, just were wanting to see more from them to show they would continue living up to what they said.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if they became "unsure" about Rafa during the period a month or so ago when it seemed like the tide of fan opinion, certainly on boards like this, and phone in shows etc, was distinctly turning against Rafa. I see the more fickle element of our fanbase as potentially being as responsible for this whole "crisis" as anyone. So now, we let them know just what level of support Rafa has, and the results keep coming, everything could maybe sort itself out. If all they get is complete abuse now from the fans, it could create a them-and-us situation where they decide to try facing us down the way they have Rafa. This is a very different sporting world these guys come from, and if they start to feel Rafa has manipulated the situation to get the fans onside, and brought them a lot of the grief unfairly (seeing as none of us actually know everything that has been said behind closed doors), it could well work against what we actually want.

Just a thought like......

Nah, that's far to balanced an opinion.

Sack the yanks.

[paulcooper4]

Does anyone else think that all the abuse being aimed at the owners might be somewhat counter-productive?

I'm 100% behind showing our support for Rafa, but some of the, well, xenophobic and ill-educated comments aimed in their direction leaves a bit of a bad taste imo. A week ago, before what has essentially been a media driven spat, fans seemed happy enough with them, just were wanting to see more from them to show they would continue living up to what they said.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if they became "unsure" about Rafa during the period a month or so ago when it seemed like the tide of fan opinion, certainly on boards like this, and phone in shows etc, was distinctly turning against Rafa. I see the more fickle element of our fanbase as potentially being as responsible for this whole "crisis" as anyone. So now, we let them know just what level of support Rafa has, and the results keep coming, everything could maybe sort itself out. If all they get is complete abuse now from the fans, it could create a them-and-us situation where they decide to try facing us down the way they have Rafa. This is a very different sporting world these guys come from, and if they start to feel Rafa has manipulated the situation to get the fans onside, and brought them a lot of the grief unfairly (seeing as none of us actually know everything that has been said behind closed doors), it could well work against what we actually want.

Just a thought like......

Mate, I started going off the yanks when I heard they were hawking our club around banks trying to get a £500 million loan stuck onto the club AFTER THEY PROMISED THEY WOULDNT.

This latest load of bollocks with Rafa is just the final straw. Go back and look at all there empty gestures...sorry, promises and tell me how many they have actually delivered on.

This is not being "fickle"

[tomasjj]

I think the owners and Parry are just waiting for an excuse to sack him.
Out of the CL might be it, if not, they will get their chance later.

[kurtangle01]

Mate, I started going off the yanks when I heard they were hawking our club around banks trying to get a £500 million loan stuck onto the club AFTER THEY PROMISED THEY WOULDNT.

This latest load of bollocks with Rafa is just the final straw. Go back and look at all there empty gestures...sorry, promises and tell me how many they have actually delivered on.

This is not being "fickle"

[Helios Creed]

Does anyone else think that all the abuse being aimed at the owners might be somewhat counter-productive?

I'm 100% behind showing our support for Rafa, but some of the, well, xenophobic and ill-educated comments aimed in their direction leaves a bit of a bad taste imo. A week ago, before what has essentially been a media driven spat, fans seemed happy enough with them, just were wanting to see more from them to show they would continue living up to what they said.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if they became "unsure" about Rafa during the period a month or so ago when it seemed like the tide of fan opinion, certainly on boards like this, and phone in shows etc, was distinctly turning against Rafa. I see the more fickle element of our fanbase as potentially being as responsible for this whole "crisis" as anyone. So now, we let them know just what level of support Rafa has, and the results keep coming, everything could maybe sort itself out. If all they get is complete abuse now from the fans, it could create a them-and-us situation where they decide to try facing us down the way they have Rafa. This is a very different sporting world these guys come from, and if they start to feel Rafa has manipulated the situation to get the fans onside, and brought them a lot of the grief unfairly (seeing as none of us actually know everything that has been said behind closed doors), it could well work against what we actually want.

Just a thought like......

Exactly - Rafa seems to be trying to re-build bridges - an ill-considered fan protest could actually undo that...

[tommyg]

Rafa Benitez

[kurtangle01]

I think the owners and Parry are just waiting for an excuse to sack him.
Out of the CL might be it, if not, they will get their chance later.

That shows just how short sighted they are then.

[Darth Marty]

I love Rafa as much as anyone, but I have to agree that at this present time, apart from being arses, the yanks have actually done nothing wrong.
Should this blow over, and it will, Rafa will have shown his teeth and the yanks will understand that Liverpool is far more than just a business.
For me this is a win win, Rafa stays, yanks know not to **** with us.
Thank you very much and goodnight.

[Manofthebog]

Exactly - Rafa seems to be trying to re-build bridges - an ill-considered fan protest could actually undo that...

Actually it's a show of support for the manager.

Devil is in the detail, my friend.

[MrMichael]

Mate, I started going off the yanks when I heard they were hawking our club around banks trying to get a £500 million loan stuck onto the club AFTER THEY PROMISED THEY WOULDNT.

This latest load of bollocks with Rafa is just the final straw. Go back and look at all there empty gestures...sorry, promises and tell me how many they have actually delivered on.

This is not being "fickle"

As one of the few posters on here who can honestly say their support of Rafa has been unwavering Coops, no, you aren't being fickle at all. I'm talking about the people who were starting to seriously grumble about Rafa not long ago, threads on here like "we'll never win the title with Rafa" were rather commonplace, you know it as well as I do. Rafa's position with a large portion of the fans was becoming somewhat tenuous.... those fans were wrong, but that is how they felt, and they were getting more and more vocal. Just do a search on here for threads started after the Birmingham game, or the Marseilles tie, or after Rafa subbed Gerard in the derby. What I'm asking is how much the over-reactionary behaviour of some fans in that regard may have effected the owner's view of Rafa's position, and for people to just have a little think about how future behaviour might also.

They've delivered plans for a stadium that are significantly enhanced from the state they were in before the takeover. They've delivered our record signing. If you think anyone was going to take us over and not finance the deal in a way that doesn't look great, well, they weren't. This is business, big business. Arsenal went into loads of debt to get their stadium built. Now they are in a position to rake it in. ManU took on enormous amounts of debt. Look at their spending levels. If you'd rather we were just the plaything of a Russian oligarch, fair enough, but anyone who thinks DIC, or Shiniwatra, or anyone else for that matter, would simply have thrown their own money at the club like it was water, is deluded. And before anyone comes at me with "well, look how much Shiniwatra has spent at Citeh" - do you actually know where that money has come from?

Frankly, emotiveness aside, we will have no idea whether the change in ownership will have been a good thing or a bad thing until we see where we are at in a year or two. They haven't even been in charge for 12 months yet.

[Helios Creed]

Actually it's a show of support for the manager.

Devil is in the detail, my friend.

not if it undoes what he's done, even if well intended.

anyway like I said, show of support good, anti yank protest bad. As you say, it's in the detail.

[Dhav]

As one of the few posters on here who can honestly say their support of Rafa has been unwavering Coops, no, you aren't being fickle at all. I'm talking about the people who were starting to seriously grumble about Rafa not long ago, threads on here like "we'll never win the title with Rafa" were rather commonplace, you know it as well as I do. Rafa's position with a large portion of the fans was becoming somewhat tenuous.... those fans were wrong, but that is how they felt, and they were getting more and more vocal. Just do a search on here for threads started after the Birmingham game, or the Marseilles tie, or after Rafa subbed Gerard in the derby. What I'm asking is how much the over-reactionary behaviour of some fans in that regard may have effected the owner's view of Rafa's position, and for people to just have a little think about how future behaviour might also.

They've delivered plans for a stadium that are significantly enhanced from the state they were in before the takeover. They've delivered our record signing. If you think anyone was going to take us over and not finance the deal in a way that doesn't look great, well, they weren't. This is business, big business. Arsenal went into loads of debt to get their stadium built. Now they are in a position to rake it in. ManU took on enormous amounts of debt. Look at their spending levels. If you'd rather we were just the plaything of a Russian oligarch, fair enough, but anyone who thinks DIC, or Shiniwatra, or anyone else for that matter, would simply have thrown their own money at the club like it was water, is deluded. And before anyone comes at me with "well, look how much Shiniwatra has spent at Citeh" - do you actually know where that money has come from?

Frankly, emotiveness aside, we will have no idea whether the change in ownership will have been a good thing or a bad thing until we see where we are at in a year or two. They haven't even been in charge for 12 months yet.

Regardless, it seems clear that certain promises they have made are not being kept. The way they are laying down ultimatums in public to a revered and respected manager seems to me that they are already betraying the ethos of the club (which they promised they would be respectful of) and treating it like their play thing.

[bertie]

Yep. These two ****ing clowns think they can come in and throw us a load of hollow promises, sack the best manager we've had in many a year and put the club £500m in debt and we'll just accept it?

It's about time they started putting the clubs interest first or ****ed off back to where ever they came from.

****ing well said lads! I'm rightly pissed off with this prick Hicks mouthing off to us about our manager when he just rode into the club like some cowboy. Its OUR club...not his.

[dww]

As one of the few posters on here who can honestly say their support of Rafa has been unwavering Coops, no, you aren't being fickle at all. I'm talking about the people who were starting to seriously grumble about Rafa not long ago, threads on here like "we'll never win the title with Rafa" were rather commonplace, you know it as well as I do. Rafa's position with a large portion of the fans was becoming somewhat tenuous.... those fans were wrong, but that is how they felt, and they were getting more and more vocal. Just do a search on here for threads started after the Birmingham game, or the Marseilles tie, or after Rafa subbed Gerard in the derby. What I'm asking is how much the over-reactionary behaviour of some fans in that regard may have effected the owner's view of Rafa's position, and for people to just have a little think about how future behaviour might also.

They've delivered plans for a stadium that are significantly enhanced from the state they were in before the takeover. They've delivered our record signing. If you think anyone was going to take us over and not finance the deal in a way that doesn't look great, well, they weren't. This is business, big business. Arsenal went into loads of debt to get their stadium built. Now they are in a position to rake it in. ManU took on enormous amounts of debt. Look at their spending levels. If you'd rather we were just the plaything of a Russian oligarch, fair enough, but anyone who thinks DIC, or Shiniwatra, or anyone else for that matter, would simply have thrown their own money at the club like it was water, is deluded. And before anyone comes at me with "well, look how much Shiniwatra has spent at Citeh" - do you actually know where that money has come from?

Frankly, emotiveness aside, we will have no idea whether the change in ownership will have been a good thing or a bad thing until we see where we are at in a year or two. They haven't even been in charge for 12 months yet.

I's agree with a lot of that. I think it is key how G&H respond to the current problems. If they decide to learn more about the football markets and improve manager-owner communications and deal brokering in future then it is happy days. If they fail to see that they are at least in part to blame for the furore then it will be a problem long term.

Still I would love to see a positive pro-Rafa reaction at Anfield from both team and supporters. I really hope it doesn't become an anti-American thing though.