Fans gone mad?

[Red_Polo]

I'm guilty of this.

A lot of people are frustrated.

Still, lets be honest here, the personal duels here are nothing like on Rawk. What a dive forum full of ****houses.

At least we haven't gotten to the stage where someone starts a thread, using constructive criticism but a generally unpopular opinion, then the "**** off and support whatever team" comments start and thread gets locked or deleted.

Well I'm sure we're all guilty of it at times, because yeah it is frustrating. Like I said on another thread recently, it's both when criticising and defending players or the manager that people need to bear this in mind. That way we don't end up in the situation where certain opinions on our football are not acceptable. I would hate the forum to get like that.

Yeah, I hear you but you are a ****

****house

[einar]

It doesnt really matter what the reasons are, unless it's beyond solution - which it isnt IMO.

Ok, Torres, Xabi and Agger are big players for us, and no one can deny it.

But even without those three, either we have good enough other players to still be superior to most opponents and therefore generally beat them. Or we dont have good enough other players.

If we do, then the manager isnt using them properly, as results suggest.

If we dont then, after over 3 years in charge, who else do you blame BUT the man who's been signing them?

Every team goes up and down in form. While it is true that the manager is responsible, it is not always his fault.

[Redlife]

I'm in the... uhhh... things-are-ok camp.



We're not playing well. CL form is poor. We have injuries to vital players. And yet we're still unbeaten in the league. It's an interesting situation.



If results start actually turning against us - from all the negativity you'd think we were dead and buried in the league :whatever: - and keep doing so, then I'll become concerned. Until then, I'll remain calm. It's not to.

[Crazy-Horse]

Was it less than 2 years ago that Rafa was being pilloried in the media, and by some fans for persisting with one Peter Crouch, when he hadn't scored in how many matches?

And now the same groups are screaming because he won't play Crouch and persists with Kuyt.

Sometimes I wonder...

Walk On!

[The Glove]

So have we. We just didnt spend the funds as wisely as we could've done.

Arsenal havent had anything LIKE the funds Chelsea and United did. How is that one explained?

Because....

How do you explain that one? Eh.... the fact that Wenger, for the most part, has bought young players cheap and nurtured them over time. He's had long enough to do it afterall.

Rafa's trying to do the same and we might just see a few of them make the grade.

And Arsenal have won 1 FA Cup in the last 3 years. We have done better than then but Arsene has had time on his side. There was talk of crisis at Arsenal. Dont hear that now do we? Thats what giving time to the manager brings.

Was it less than 2 years ago that Rafa was being pilloried in the media, and by some fans for persisting with one Peter Crouch, when he hadn't scored in how many matches?

And now the same groups are screaming because he won't play Crouch and persists with Kuyt.

Sometimes I wonder...

Walk On!

[fred_plasticine]

But people say we are playing crap without taking into account the reasons for it. If you examine the reasons you will realize that they are significant and TEMPORARY.

You've heard it all before but certain among here refuse to acknowledge.

Xabi out.
Torres out.
Agger out.
SG out of form due to engerland.

I could go on.

Prove to me you can appreciate that our form is realistic and temporary.

Would you expect our form to be as good with those 3 players out? Yes or No?

i agree to a certain extent. if you look at the players that have been available we should have played much better because that is what would expect when you look at a cm pairing of gerrard and mascher, players like benayoun, crouch, voronin or kuyt.
the cause for concern from my point of view is the sudden loss of form that almost all of our big players have suffered from. the injury list, while a massive problem, cannot be taken into account when it comes to individual form. at the moment the team lack not only confidence but a game plan it seems. there's no real drive or determination (apart from the arse game), somtimes they're even unable to string more than 2 passes together for a lenghty period.
there are too many individual mistakes being made be it in defence, midfield or attack - if that's not cause for concern than i don't know what is...

[Tinkerbitch]

Was it less than 2 years ago that Rafa was being pilloried in the media, and by some fans for persisting with one Peter Crouch, when he hadn't scored in how many matches?

And now the same groups are screaming because he won't play Crouch and persists with Kuyt.

Sometimes I wonder...

Walk On!

[AFII]

This could be our starting XI when everyone is fit..........

--------------Reina
Finnan----Carra---Agger----Aurelio
---------Masch-----Xabi---------
-----Babel-----Gerrard----Kewell--
--------------Torres-------------

Subs: Itandje, Arbeloa, Lucas, Benayoun, Crouch.

Excellent starting XI and bench for a lot less than Man U or Chelsea have spent.

You can add that Rafa has brought in some excellent youngsters and the future is looking very, very good.

[Tinkerbitch]

By the same token though, hands up who gets paid £4m a year...

I dont think Rafa should be sacked, but he DOES need to admit that certain ideas arent working, and adjust them slightly.

As for dissecting after the game, i dont disagree with that point generally...but i said prior to KO at blackburn that Crouch should've started ahead of Kuyt, so that one doesnt apply to me in this particular case

I know you're not suggesting sacking Rafa, and at the moment I don't think we pay him enough when I see threads saying sack Rafa and the general sh*t he's taking off all and sundry in the media.The rest of this post isn't directed at you just general comments

The question I keep asking is who else is going to do a better job? Who is the mythical manager that can put everything right- by which the majority of fans mean win us number nineteen? I suggested in another thread that the only person who might make a better manager was Hiddink who's not going to leave cosyville to come to Anfield.

Every single manager has his faults and gets it wrong- Wenger didn't win the CL because IMO he couldn't adapt his tactics, Ferguson has bought Tevez and then has to bring on Saha because it doesn't work brilliantly playing Tevez and Rooney together. (If I wasn't trying to hold down a full time job, I would provide more examples). Football isn't a game of push that button and you automatically get that result. We all have our own opinions which we have every right to discuss and debate but we have to take a longer term view of success and support a brilliant manager whose main fault for some seems to be that he is human.

We are supporters,our job and contribution is to support. Most of us like to bask in the reflected glory of players saying the supporters are part of the club and the level of support swayed a game and now it's time to do the hard work and support when things aren't brilliant. LFC is for life, not just champions league finals.

[Craig_H]

I dont disagree with much of what you've said.

I also dont understand what part of me being unhappy with poor results suggests that i DO disagree.

[carheex]

This could be our starting XI when everyone is fit..........

--------------Reina
Finnan----Carra---Agger----Aurelio
---------Masch-----Xabi---------
-----Babel-----Gerrard----Kewell--
--------------Torres-------------

Subs: Itandje, Arbeloa, Lucas, Benayoun, Crouch.

Excellent starting XI and bench for a lot less than Man U or Chelsea have spent.

You can add that Rafa has brought in some excellent youngsters and the future is looking very, very good.

You're right, we've spent a lot less than Man U or Chelsea - we've also won a lot less league titles recently than them aswell.
And the youngsters can only be classed as excellent when they've done well in the first team.
Furthermore, I disagree that our formation will switch to a 4-2-3-1 with Babel on the right wing.
And i'd prefer Arbeloa at left back to aurelio.

All that aside, good post AFII!

[Farside]

But people say we are playing crap without taking into account the reasons for it. If you examine the reasons you will realize that they are significant and TEMPORARY.

You've heard it all before but certain among here refuse to acknowledge.

Xabi out.
Torres out.
Agger out.
SG out of form due to engerland.

I could go on.

Prove to me you can appreciate that our form is realistic and temporary.

Would you expect our form to be as good with those 3 players out? Yes or No?

It is not just about the players though. It is about the managers team selection and tactics. If these players were fit they would only be rotated anyway.