For once and for all...

[Red Chilli]

Did we really need another thread on this?

Time to turn our attentions to supporting Rafa and the lads against ****ty ****in Boro. We need a win.

That's unless he starts with Kuyt.....

I reckon Dirk will get our equaliser on Saturday in a scrappy 1-1 draw

[Harv]

Excellent post DJ. Basically what your saying is it is harder to win the Premiership than La LIga. Exactly why we should afford Rafa the necessary time.

eggzakery

Rafa has done alright so far.

[carheex]

This is what he is basically saying.

Or Gordon Strachan - he won the league the season before last with 91 points...

[CAD]

What an absolute wank of a thread. Nice work guys

[thesilverfoxlfc]

CAD TURN ON xbox live i have a request to be your friend waiting

[bazza76]

I see your "away" for the last few hours, whats that about??

Just had the machine on and wasnt playing

[CAD]

CAD TURN ON xbox live i have a request to be your friend waiting

Sound

But I got the PS3

[Neil Young]

Which League is harder to Win? The premiership because you need more points or La Liga because the standard is higher.

The flaw in DJS's lovingly crafted argument.

It depends how you want to see it.

[REDSCOUSER]

I was being sarcastic mate.

DJS's point was that in Italy or spain you need less points to win the league than you do in England, so I said why not a manager from Scotland, you need 90 odd points there to win the title.

went right over me head mate..woooooooshhhhhhhhhhh

[Red Chilli]

went right over me head mate..woooooooshhhhhhhhhhh

Probably still hung over from your B'Day

[vonk]

DJS has nailed his flag firmly to the mast. His post is only relevant to the extent that it suits his anti-Rafa, pro-Mourinho agenda

So if you don't like his opinion don't post or start your own thread. His post is relevant as you and many others have taken time out of their day to read it. Any post is relevant if it stirs debate my friend.

[Darkon]

By your logic however, any premiership manager could go on and win any other league in Europe by default - which leaves the question about where managers from England goes? If you reverse your logic, then there should be an abundance of offers for managers who at some point got more than 77 points!

Basically your saying Mourinho, Wenger, Ferguson would always win the spanish and Italian league, which I would very much doubt. IMO you have to look at other factors in explaining the total point tally, perhaps that the general standard is higher in La Liga, the teams below the top-4 is generally more of a challenge. Same could perhaps be said about the Italian legaue (woulden't know though as I don't follow it itensively.)

[bigfooty]

I think the point that the Premiership requires a different approach to win it is a completely valid one that Rafa hasn't really come to terms with.

If you look at his second title success, where Barca and Real were at least a little closer, he lost at home to Osasuna, Albacete and Racing (teams that finished 13th, 14th and 16th respectively in the league) and drew with Vallodolid and Celta (finished 18th and 19th).

Now compare that to our league and it would be the equivalent of losing to Reading, Bolton and Birmingham at home, whilst drawing with Sunderland and Fulham. Those kind of results kill you in the Premiership, yet in Spain he was able to endure those and still win the title by 5 points, largely because of extremely strong away form and getting good results against the big teams - beating Barca twice, taking 4 points off Madrid and sharing the spoils with Depor.

The main reason I believe is because the Premiership is overall defensively stronger than in Spain, particularly at the higher levels. Teams like Utd, Chelsea and even Arsenal are a lot more resilient than their Spanish counterparts. We saw this against Barca ourselves last season when they defended like clowns for our goals. The key to Rafa's success over there was his own defensive qualities, making his team very difficult to beat by being extremely solid - particularly away from home.

[Dalglish]

[calvoboy]

I posted this on the other thread, but since so many people use the Valencia example, i'll give it its own thread so that people can either agree or disagree and explain why they disagree...hopefully without abuse

Interesting stuff - I disagree with you, but think it is another difference between La Liga and the Premiership that may explain Rafa's problems in the Premiership.

Rafa winning La Liga shows that he knows how to finish top of the pile in a competitive league. So it is relevant to his managerial chances in England. The points comparison though is, well, pointless. You can't compare stats across leagues.

I think that one of the reasons the winning points tally is lower in La Liga is because right down to the bottom of that league you get very well organised, technically good teams, with players who are very tactically aware. Because of this, as a manager, you have to plan to neutralise the opposition first even when they are near the bottom. I think that this experience leads Rafa to overestimate some of the opposition in the Premiership, and lower league teams in the cup, when all you need to do against some of these sides is pick your best 11 and go and attack. How often do you see him bugger about with the formation to play the likes of Derby, Reading and Birmingham? Attack them with our talent, and best formation, and they would crumble. But no, instead they see the team sheet with one man up front with two defensive midfielders and think "we're in with a chance here lads".

I would advise Rafa to keep doing what we are doing against the Middle to Top sides, but let's just go at the teams near the bottom for a change. Then our points tally would improve.