Priorities for H&G?? Article. Also SOS Statement.

[fred_plasticine]

Yes its just you.

no, it's not just him.

we want a new stadium and a huge transfer kitty every summer, sign world-class players only and pay them an effing fortune. fair enough.

but when we open a new club store, revise our marketing strategy in order to exploit what is potetially the biggest world-wide fanbase of any english football club people complain. how do expect them to pay for players and the stadium? no invenstor in the right mind will finance any of it out of his own pockets if there are other people who happily lend him the money. if you expect anything else then it's plain stupidity on your side.

yeah they've cocked up here and there but to use a new club store against them, trying to argue it was a sign they're only trying to lign their own pockets is ridiculous.

sos stand up and try to change a situation they don't like. fair play to them.
but the way the do it is wrong, their whole attitude stinks, the statements released are mainly patronising and poor.

[Skillz]

So everyone else thinks we shouldn't have opened a club shop?

Your taking the piss surely. What do you expect us to do, cartwheels

[Elvoz]

Are SOS the most pointless thing ever?

them and rogan taylor and his pals are a ****in embarrassment

[spy]

no, it's not just him.

we want a new stadium and a huge transfer kitty every summer, sign world-class players only and pay them an effing fortune. fair enough.

but when we open a new club store, revise our marketing strategy in order to exploit what is potetially the biggest world-wide fanbase of any english football club people complain. how do expect them to pay for players and the stadium? no invenstor in the right mind will finance any of it out of his own pockets if there are other people who happily lend him the money. if you expect anything else then it's plain stupidity on your side.

yeah they've cocked up here and there but to use a new club store against them, trying to argue it was a sign they're only trying to lign their own pockets is ridiculous.

sos stand up and try to change a situation they don't like. fair play to them.
but the way the do it is wrong, their whole attitude stinks, the statements released are mainly patronising and poor.

Thanks Fred. I think they (SOS) are in urgent need of some guidance, the lack of a meeting in months to discuss issues, means they've long-since forgotten that they're supposed to be the voice of all fans (hopefully) not just a small minority. It'll be a massive shame if the movement turns into a minority group that ends up not being recognised by the club. I'm sure Hicks will consider getting fans' views as part of his all-round PR policy if he takes over. But it won't be SOS who are asked for their views. DIC are embracing the union now, but they aren't stupid, and surely see that if the union can use such sensationalist and misleading statements against Hicks they'll do the same to DIC when the time comes (and it will) of some issue that doesn't go down well with some fans.

Your taking the piss surely. What do you expect us to do, cartwheels

Cartwheels? Only from the shopaholics, especially those of the female persuasion who see a new opportunity to drag other halves around other shops as part of a trip to the LFC shop. But from everyone else I'd expect either indifference or at least some recognition that we're moving on in the commercial sense.

We've got to close this gap somehow - our turnover: £133m / Mancs turnover: £210m. (Chelsea: £177m / Arsenal: £177m too).

I actually think some people are worried that Hicks could make a go of this, and actually be successful, and having burned their bridges to a certain extent they're beginning to winder where it might leave them.

[fred_plasticine]

Thanks Fred. I think they (SOS) are in urgent need of some guidance, the lack of a meeting in months to discuss issues, means they've long-since forgotten that they're supposed to be the voice of all fans (hopefully) not just a small minority. It'll be a massive shame if the movement turns into a minority group that ends up not being recognised by the club. I'm sure Hicks will consider getting fans' views as part of his all-round PR policy if he takes over. But it won't be SOS who are asked for their views. DIC are embracing the union now, but they aren't stupid, and surely see that if the union can use such sensationalist and misleading statements against Hicks they'll do the same to DIC when the time comes (and it will) of some issue that doesn't go down well with some fans.

that's the thing. dic are in contact with them and smothly talk about fan representatives on the board but instead of taking a step back the smarty-pants get all excited and can't see the wood for the trees anymore. dic are using them, it's a simply ploy.
i'm tired of people who say getting g&h out is top priority, let's not worry about alternatives, all that crossing-the-bridge-when-we-get-to-it attitude does my head in.

[sniff]

[QUOTE=spy;1070193] I think they (SOS) are in urgent need of some guidance, the lack of a meeting in months to discuss issues, means they've long-since forgotten that they're supposed to be the voice of all fans (hopefully) not just a small minority.


They will represent the views of their members not be the voice of all fans.

However membership is open to all fans so if you can offer guidance i'm sure they would love to have you on board. If you just want to join as numerical support, likewise.

It has taken a while to sort out the constitutional and legal requirements, that will allow the union to function properly, but applications are finally being sent out this week i believe and new applications will be available when the backlog has cleared.

After this i'm sure members will be given the right to elect officials and vote on union matters.One man/woman , one vote. I would suppose that until the membership issue was resolved , it would largely have been a waste of time having further meetings.

Give them a chance, its not meant to a five minute wonder just to protest at the current ownership, but a union of supporters that will represent the memberships concerns on all matters related to supporting the club

[sniff]

they have not offered to support DIC in its effort to gain control of the club.

[Vermilion]

no, it's not just him.

we want a new stadium and a huge transfer kitty every summer, sign world-class players only and pay them an effing fortune. fair enough.

but when we open a new club store, revise our marketing strategy in order to exploit what is potetially the biggest world-wide fanbase of any english football club people complain. how do expect them to pay for players and the stadium? no invenstor in the right mind will finance any of it out of his own pockets if there are other people who happily lend him the money. if you expect anything else then it's plain stupidity on your side.

yeah they've cocked up here and there but to use a new club store against them, trying to argue it was a sign they're only trying to lign their own pockets is ridiculous.

sos stand up and try to change a situation they don't like. fair play to them.
but the way the do it is wrong, their whole attitude stinks, the statements released are mainly patronising and poor.

Oh hell, H&G most likely had f all to do with opening this shop, it will have been planned for ages. 'Spy's' comment about the 'HICKS bashers' getting 'desperate' was what i was commenting on, anyone who thinks that....... really isn't paying attention.

I've been through all this in the dic thread, so i'm not discussing the reasons as to why people want Hicks out, both of them actually, anyone who wants them to stay also has that pirogative, but imho the reasons for getting them out far far outweigh any for them to stay, especially ones that give them credit for things they had no likely part in.

As far as the SOS statements being patronising & poor, well at least they are genuine fans, who i do believe want what's best for LFC, compare that to Hicks's video, set up, faked, insincere crap.

[spy]

This thread starts with an article/statement from TIA/SOS that criticises the opening of the new shop and the marketing that goes along with it and with the new kit. The criticism is clearly aimed at the owners (both of them for a change).

As soon as someone says that this particular subject of criticism is a sign of desperation on the part of those attacking Hicks the original poster is all of a sudden telling us that shop probably had nothing to do with Hicks and Gillett anyway.

So if it's got nothing to do with the owners why are they getting criticised for it?

This is where my point about desperation comes from.

If a fan who rarely used the internet other than mainstream news sites saw this opening post would you convince them to join the SOS / Yanks Out cause?

An intelligent Liverpool fan, thinking back to 1989 and many times since, knows that taking the word of a newspaper is a stupid thing to do, that it's important to read any article properly. If they've decided this weekend to look at views on internet sites for the first time and they see this kind of thing they'll probably get the view that obsessed stalkers are now trying to chase Hicks out of the country for reasons they've long since forgotten.

People complain about the downgrading of the stadium from the first Texas design to the second, then complain in the same sentence that the owners didn't start building the original one within two months of takeover. So somehow the current version is wrong and shouldn't be getting built, because it's inferior, but the ancient version is OK and should have been built. Isn't that a touch hypocritical and silly?

People complain that the owners are going to leave the club in a mess financially, and they base this on information that has come from information fed to the papers by Dubai's pr guru. Accounts were published recently for LFC that showed transfer net spend of over £40 million, which somehow kills the theory that the owners didn't invest in the squad. But the answer to that is that they were wrong to do so using borrowed money. But why? When the takeover happened every single shareholder knew that was how money would be given to the club. They were too busy rubbing their hands together at the five grand windfall and the promise of all kinds of ticket perks for life.

I've not seen your posts on the other thread Redrascal so apologies if you've answered these points.

But you've got to be even-handed before you make your mind up for or against the Americans.

I still feel that at times we might be getting a better owner in DIC but that the gap between DIC and Hicks from the club's point of view is smaller than we think. The richer person isn't always the more generous person.

You can't say that anything "good" under american ownership has to be ignored because the american's probably had nothing to do with it, then say that everything "bad" under American ownership has to be blamed fully on the Americans. It smacks of disgusting double standards.

Sniff - SOS should be the voice of their members, all their members, but if they do what they were originally saying they would then they would soon become the voice of practically all fans. I know all about their issues getting themselves made official and that they have only just started to cash cheques, I know that they've put a lot of personal time into what they've done. But they've not communicated very well at all with members or potential members. I know people who were planning to join back at the beginning who have now decided it's not for them.

Their website needed to be kept up to date, and there really is no excuse for it not being kept up to date because they have plenty of helpers who would do it for them. Just a weekly item with a date on it saying what was happening. I'm sure any LFC website would have offered them a forum to discuss issues on.

Instead they arranged secret meetings with Dubai and according to some probably exaggerated rumours also with Parry. Yet at the meeting last time, back in the winter I think, they promised they wouldn't have any secret meetings. They agreed, after discussions with the thousand people at the meeting, that they shouldn't close the door on talking to any of the Dubia, Gillett, Hicks, Parry etc people, but that they should minute every meeting. It's just one example where they've acted against the wishes of their members. It wouldn't have been difficult to call more meetings in the time between the last meeting and the end of the season, and I don't mean the piss-up where people had to pay another tenner to attend.

If a fan has no cheque book and can't physically seek out someone from SOS at a match then how can he join? Well thankfully they've got this more or less sorted now, but a lot of people have already given up on it all. This might sound patronising, but some of their statements and stunts have smacked of students protesting against McDonalds, their root cause might be worthwhile, but their methods and their exaggeration of the issues takes away most of their credibility.

Hopefully, and I mean this 100%, they will get back to their original approach when they finally start listening to members again.

[sniff]

I totally agree that there should have been a few lines of updates on the website every week or so. It's something that could easily have been done. Even a few lines saying that things were moving slowly would have been better than nothing.

It remains to be seen whether the DIC meetings were minuted or not. It was hardly a secret meeting though as a statement was put out saying they had met for talks, and a very brief outline regarding what was discussed. I'm not sure whether it would be right to put the minuted meeting on various websites. Its a difficult one.


I would also agree that certain statements have not always been well written in my opinion , but these are issues that can be improved on. At the moment the criticism is enough to kill this thing before its even got going.

[El Jefecito]

Yes its just you.

See my prior post, he's not on his own when it comes to questioning SOS and their approach which hurts LFC more than it does Hicks.

[El Jefecito]

I totally agree that there should have been a few lines of updates on the website every week or so. It's something that could easily have been done. Even a few lines saying that things were moving slowly would have been better than nothing.

It remains to be seen whether the DIC meetings were minuted or not. It was hardly a secret meeting though as a statement was put out saying they had met for talks, and a very brief outline regarding what was discussed. I'm not sure whether it would be right to put the minuted meeting on various websites. Its a difficult one.


I would also agree that certain statements have not always been well written in my opinion , but these are issues that can be improved on. At the moment the criticism is enough to kill this thing before its even got going.

This is a dog eat dog world, to survive they need to appeal to a majority of fans. Let's face it they need to work in such a way to avoid the criticism. All of the criticism I've seen has been well founded.

And again hurting LFC to hurt Hicks is insane, a majority will never get behind that.

[spy]

I totally agree that there should have been a few lines of updates on the website every week or so. It's something that could easily have been done. Even a few lines saying that things were moving slowly would have been better than nothing.

It remains to be seen whether the DIC meetings were minuted or not. It was hardly a secret meeting though as a statement was put out saying they had met for talks, and a very brief outline regarding what was discussed. I'm not sure whether it would be right to put the minuted meeting on various websites. Its a difficult one.


I would also agree that certain statements have not always been well written in my opinion , but these are issues that can be improved on. At the moment the criticism is enough to kill this thing before its even got going.

I agree that it's important to keep the criticism low-key - but they do seem to be ignoring it. It's not - from me anyway - meant to be anything more than advice, and I wouldn't post this on forums that are more mainstream, like the BBC's awful 666 site for example.

[fred_plasticine]

This is a dog eat dog world, to survive they need to appeal to a majority of fans. Let's face it they need to work in such a way to avoid the criticism. All of the criticism I've seen has been well founded.

And again hurting LFC to hurt Hicks is insane, a majority will never get behind that.

[wavydavy]

From what I've seen of the members of SOS they're mainly of an age, like myself, of the supporter who simply wouldn't and never will wear a replica shirt. I'm in my early 40s and neither myself or the vast majority of my match going friends would be seen dead in a replica ****.
I think this may go part of the way to explaining SOS's stance where the new shop is concerned. Bye the bye, I was in the new shop with my ten year old, who likes that kind of thing, today and you can't fail to be impressed by it. I look back a couple of years when I couldn't get the CL kit for my lad for XMAS!! That was a ****ing joke. Incidentally they've pre printed a lot of names on a lot of shirts there and you don't need to be a genius to see who's staying and who's going.