Liverpool v Stoke - Post match anguish thread

[Mattshark]

4 shots on goal is hardly enough to win the game on average is it? I don't know what the average shots on goal is in a game but I'm sure it's more than that.

I understand we are missing Torres, Gerrard & Beny but are they the only 3 attacking players we have in the squad after 5 years to rebuild it?

What two bob away game would you consider to be a dead cert? Portsmouth? Reading? I don't consider any to be a dead cert even when we are playing well but you have to at least give yourself a chance by putting someone on the pitch that can give a bit of creativity.

We lacked choices to do that though. Maxi has had a couple of days with the squad so starting him wasn't an option, Aquilani is still looking for match fitness and played 120 mins on Wednesday, Reira is just back from injury, Gerrard, Torress, Yossi and Johnson are all out so that there is 7 attack minded players unavailable from the start if you are being realistic.

[topscorer]

Fit enough to be on the bench and not played much this season. Maybe at least one of Riera & Aquliano should have started with a view to taking them off early.

I don't want to criticize Ngog because he did well at the beginning of the season when he covered for Torres and is still young but he has not been good the last few games he's been in. Maybe we should have started with Pacheco up front for this one.

Sometimes you have to take a chance and he's looked keen and clever in the couple of cameo appearances he's had. Which brings me back to the original point about dropping people to the bench if they make mistakes or are not looking good.

With such a defensive line up it wouldn't have been a risk to put Pacheco on from the start instead of Ngog in my opinion, he might have even surprised us. Maybe a 4-4-2 with the undroppable Kuyt who's been playing so badly this season (and I like Kuyt and think he's been under appreciated in previous seasons but not this season).

[Mattshark]

Fit enough to be on the bench and not played much this season. Maybe at least one of Riera & Aquliano should have started with a view to taking them off early.

I don't want to criticize Ngog because he did well at the beginning of the season when he covered for Torres and is still young but he has not been good the last few games he's been in. Maybe we should have started with Pacheco up front for this one.

Sometimes you have to take a chance and he's looked keen and clever in the couple of cameo appearances he's had. Which brings me back to the original point about dropping people to the bench if they make mistakes or are not looking good.

With such a defensive line up it wouldn't have been a risk to put Pacheco on from the start instead of Ngog in my opinion, he might have even surprised us. Maybe a 4-4-2 with the undroppable Kuyt who's been playing so badly this season (and I like Kuyt and think he's been under appreciated in previous seasons but not this season).

Pacheco would have been slaughtered in that game, as a sub if we had a 2 goal lead yes, otherwise, nooooooooooo way.

Reira, first game back from injury and Aquilani was not fit enough to start. Playing the last 15 off the bench is much easier than playing the first 60.

I think the team we put out was pretty much our only viable option.

[topscorer]

I don't understand how you think he would have got slaughtered. We only had 2 shots on goal in 95 minutes anyway. Small, fast and hungry he might have been just what we needed to launch counter attacks with, we played so deep.

I still think one of the creative players needed to start and 15 minutes at the end isn't enough.

I agree we didn't have many other options but that doesn't give us much hope for the rest of the season really does it?

And if our young kids aren't good enough to give a chance in an injury crisis like this against mid table teams then that doesn't give us much hope either.

We are over half way through one of the worse seasons in years and I think Rafa has persisted with the same under performing players and tactics for too long. We need to try something fresh to try and turn the season around.

[Reece]

I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, and I know it doesn't really matter now, but the corner that Stoke scored from.... it should have been a goal kick right? I'm sure it was one of their players who kicked it out.

[pondus]

Don't know if it's been mentioned anywhere, but I read on liverpool.no that Rafa has reported Lee Mason to the FA, and asked them to take a closer look on his refereeing in the Liverpool games this season. The right way to do things, instead of slagging him off in the post match interview.

[Shaggy]

Don't know if it's been mentioned anywhere, but I read on liverpool.no that Rafa has reported Lee Mason to the FA, and asked them to take a closer look on his refereeing in the Liverpool games this season. The right way to do things, instead of slagging him off in the post match interview.

Aye saw that in some newspaper article over here (broadsheet, online)...Mason's refereering of our games this year has been truly sub-standard.

[gerbin11]

Perhaps, if we'd been given two clear cut penalties, we'd have had more shots on goal and won?

It's easy to say you're tired of excuses, but if the ref robs us, there's little we can do.

Remember this is Stoke away we're talking about, not some two-bob away game that everyone wins. And remember who we were missing. Gerrard, Torres, Benayoun and Johnson all out - the four of those provide a major part of our attacking capabilities.

It's worth taking all things into account in this case.

Well said. I have to be honest, I have, in the past had issues with a lot of your posts but I congratulate you on your current balanced views.

[gerbin11]

Fit enough to be on the bench and not played much this season. Maybe at least one of Riera & Aquliano should have started with a view to taking them off early.

.

Look what happened the last time we started Riera on his comeback from injury he didn't even last the first half. Aquilano was absolutely shattered at the end of the Reading game. 120 minutes only three days earlier. Are you honestly wondering wht he didn't start?

[Kenneth]

Well said. I have to be honest, I have, in the past had issues with a lot of your posts but I congratulate you on your current balanced views.

Fair play, he's really trying. :Patscraigonhead:

[Craig_H]

4 shots on goal is hardly enough to win the game on average is it? I don't know what the average shots on goal is in a game but I'm sure it's more than that.

I understand we are missing Torres, Gerrard & Beny but are they the only 3 attacking players we have in the squad after 5 years to rebuild it?

What two bob away game would you consider to be a dead cert? Portsmouth? Reading? I don't consider any to be a dead cert even when we are playing well but you have to at least give yourself a chance by putting someone on the pitch that can give a bit of creativity.

It wasnt an 'average' game though, Stoke took 75 mins to get a shot on target.

[Craig_H]

Well said. I have to be honest, I have, in the past had issues with a lot of your posts but I congratulate you on your current balanced views.

Thanks for the congratulations and i'm delighted that my views, when in agreement with yours, are then considered 'balanced'

[Mattshark]

I don't understand how you think he would have got slaughtered. We only had 2 shots on goal in 95 minutes anyway. Small, fast and hungry he might have been just what we needed to launch counter attacks with, we played so deep.

I still think one of the creative players needed to start and 15 minutes at the end isn't enough.

I agree we didn't have many other options but that doesn't give us much hope for the rest of the season really does it?

And if our young kids aren't good enough to give a chance in an injury crisis like this against mid table teams then that doesn't give us much hope either.

We are over half way through one of the worse seasons in years and I think Rafa has persisted with the same under performing players and tactics for too long. We need to try something fresh to try and turn the season around.

Against Stoke, he would be kicked from pillar to post, for his stage of development and only having played about 20 minutes of first teams football, that would not help in the slightest.

I think it is a seriously naive call on your part, Aquilani was knackered and would be ineffective if started and Reira hasn't even been on the pitch for a month.

Don't be silly, Stoke is always a physical game, you blood kids in when you are winning if possible, not throw them into a game where they are more likely to just get injured at worst on constantly out muscled at best.

[topscorer]

Maybe I am naive and maybe Stoke was a unique game but it comes on the back of half a season of mostly very poor displays and I'm extremely frustrated that we have a lot of injuries, our star players are under performing and we having a lot of bad luck but you need to create some luck and you cannot just keep doing the same thing if it isn't working.

At what point do you try something different?

When the Mancs had a bad run last season they played that kid Welbeck that we had never heard of and how many times did he save them at the death?

[Craig_H]

I dont recall welbeck saving them on any occasion.