First choice midfield...

[Shaggy]

The 'so far' bit is where I've lost you. He's barely played, yet still produced in four games more than Lucas has done the entire season. I'd rather have someone good who tries and fails sometimes than someone who knows he can't do it and runs around a lot to make himself look not as terrible as he is.

That's rubbish.

Direct assists is not and never has been part of the job description for a CM in a Benitez side. You can count on one hand the number of assists Alonso made in a season. Lucas keeps the ball well, something Aquilani hasn't shown in the slightest. In games when Lucas has replaced the always ailing Alberto we have instantly improved, his continuity passing proving much more beneficial than Aquilani spraying it wildly out of play or directly to the opposition.

[Matt]

Been thinking about this some more and I think Dave as usual is right in that the midfield chosen should be looked at in the context of the whole side.

For example, a midfield of Mascherano, Lucas, Kuyt + one other paired with a back four of (as it has recently been) Carragher, Agger, Zorba, Insua is certainly solid but lacks plenty in imagination and guile and puts the emphasis on one or two players creating chances. When one of those players isn't Torres and when Gerrard is off form it's no wonder we struggle.

Lucas and Mascherano can be a strong pairing but only when supported by a bit more attacking nous elsewhere throughout the team i.e as Dave says, the fullbacks.

[squaddie]

That's rubbish.

Direct assists is not and never has been part of the job description for a CM in a Benitez side. You can count on one hand the number of assists Alonso made in a season. Lucas keeps the ball well, something Aquilani hasn't shown in the slightest. In games when Lucas has replaced the always ailing Alberto we have instantly improved, his continuity passing proving much more beneficial than Aquilani spraying it wildly out of play or directly to the opposition.

[Shaggy]

Tell you what if Aquilani had played the ball Lucas played to Torres against Blackburn some people on here would be pumping man milk all over the shop. As it is, it's just ignored.

[Matt]

Tell you what if Aquilani had played the ball Lucas played to Torres against Blackburn some people on here would be pumping man milk all over the shop. As it is, it's just ignored.

I thought we'd established that he'd definitely scuffed it

[JohnDoe]

That's rubbish.

Direct assists is not and never has been part of the job description for a CM in a Benitez side. You can count on one hand the number of assists Alonso made in a season. Lucas keeps the ball well, something Aquilani hasn't shown in the slightest. In games when Lucas has replaced the ailing Alberto we have instantly improved, his continuity passing proving much more beneficial than Aquilani spraying it wildly out of play or directly to the opposition.

Not according to Benitez in the start of the season when he tried to justify signing Aquilani.

Lucas can't pass. He knows he can't pass, so he only passes it sideways or backwards to an open man. That's what he does, all the time, there are exceptions but they're rare (like that pass to Torres. I'm still waiting for other examples). He doesn't lose the ball because he doesn't try anything that he's going to fail at, one of which is actually playing football.

Would you like us to play a striker who doesn't miss any chances to score because he doesn't get into scoring positions? I know I wouldn't. Lucas is doing exactly what I'd do if I got a run in the team at CM.

I'm a **** footballer, so I'd only do what I can: Pass sideways, run around a bit, pass backwards, get bypassed by entire the team who just hoofs it forward because there is no craft in midfield, make a forward run when we're in the final third, appear to get into a position to do something, but never actually get the ball and do something with it. I know I'd get found out if I ever have the misfortune of receiving it.

Also, when the team doesn't have the ball, I'd run around a lot and harass the other team because the only chance I'd ever have of looking good is if I somehow intercept the ball or tackle, because that doesn't take a lot of ability to do. I'd also commit a lot of silly fouls in my half when I feel I'm getting turned by someone.

I know that because I've seen games again just so I can follow him and Masch around and try to understand what they do when we have the ball and form a careful opinion of them. Lucas is a pretender horribly out of his depth.

And on the other hand, you've got Aquilani. Play Aquilani.

[Matt]

I like Lucas anyway. I admire his character and it's part of the underdog mentality that badly makes me want him to succeed.

[Shaggy]

Not according to Benitez in the start of the season when he tried to justify signing Aquilani.

Lucas can't pass. He knows he can't pass, so he only passes it sideways or backwards to an open man. That's what he does, all the time, there are exceptions but they're rare (like that pass to Torres. I'm still waiting for other examples). He doesn't lose the ball because he doesn't try anything that he's going to fail at, one of which is actually playing football.

Would you like us to play a striker who doesn't miss any chances to score because he doesn't get into scoring positions? I know I wouldn't. Lucas is doing exactly what I'd do if I got a run in the team at CM.

I'm a **** footballer, so I'd only do what I can: Pass sideways, run around a bit, pass backwards, get bypassed by entire the team who just hoofs it forward because there is no craft in midfield, make a forward run when we're in the final third, appear to get into a position to do something, but never actually get the ball and do something with it. I know I'd get found out if I ever have the misfortune of receiving it.

Also, when the team doesn't have the ball, I'd run around a lot and harass the other team because the only chance I'd ever have of looking good is if I somehow intercept the ball or tackle, because that doesn't take a lot of ability to do. I'd also commit a lot of silly fouls in my half when I feel I'm getting turned by someone.

I know that because I've seen games again just so I can follow him and Masch around and try to understand what they do when we have the ball and form a careful opinion of them. Lucas is a pretender horribly out of his depth.

Incredibly harsh.

So...Lucas can't fool you but he's fooling Benitez and he's fooling Dunga too. Perhaps you should have a word.

[Matt]

Lucas played a huge part in the move that killed off Utd earlier in the season. Considering how **** a season it's been, that's probably one of the top 3 moments from this campaign.

[JohnDoe]

Incredibly harsh.

So...Lucas can't fool you but he's fooling Benitez and he's fooling Dunga too. Perhaps you should have a word.

Rafa plays him because he's scared of not having two defensive midfielders sitting deep and protecting our vulnerable defence and he has an obsession with hard working players.

If Lucas gets picked in the world cup, I'd laugh by bollocks off. It's never going to happen.

[Imy]

Been thinking about this some more and I think Dave as usual is right in that the midfield chosen should be looked at in the context of the whole side.

For example, a midfield of Mascherano, Lucas, Kuyt + one other paired with a back four of (as it has recently been) Carragher, Agger, Zorba, Insua is certainly solid but lacks plenty in imagination and guile and puts the emphasis on one or two players creating chances. When one of those players isn't Torres and when Gerrard is off form it's no wonder we struggle.

Lucas and Mascherano can be a strong pairing but only when supported by a bit more attacking nous elsewhere throughout the team i.e as Dave says, the fullbacks.

Lucas has done ok the weakness is the poor attacking players in front/wide of him

[Imy]

Rafa plays him because he's scared of not having two defensive midfielders sitting deep and protecting our vulnerable defence and he has an obsession with hard working players.

If Lucas gets picked in the world cup, I'd laugh by bollocks off. It's never going to happen.

Would you then say if the defence is not good enough to look after itself changes should be made there?

[JohnDoe]

Lucas played a huge part in the move that killed off Utd earlier in the season. Considering how **** a season it's been, that's probably one of the top 3 moments from this campaign.

Yes, when the mancs went gung ho and had barely any defenders. I'm not saying he can't be given credit for that but a top team needs players who are top quality and Lucas is horribly inadequate 9 times out of ten and a few incidents aren't going to change the general rule.

[Reece]

Not according to Benitez in the start of the season when he tried to justify signing Aquilani.

Lucas can't pass. He knows he can't pass, so he only passes it sideways or backwards to an open man. That's what he does, all the time, there are exceptions but they're rare (like that pass to Torres. I'm still waiting for other examples). He doesn't lose the ball because he doesn't try anything that he's going to fail at, one of which is actually playing football.

Would you like us to play a striker who doesn't miss any chances to score because he doesn't get into scoring positions? I know I wouldn't. Lucas is doing exactly what I'd do if I got a run in the team at CM.

I'm a **** footballer, so I'd only do what I can: Pass sideways, run around a bit, pass backwards, get bypassed by entire the team who just hoofs it forward because there is no craft in midfield, make a forward run when we're in the final third, appear to get into a position to do something, but never actually get the ball and do something with it. I know I'd get found out if I ever have the misfortune of receiving it.

Also, when the team doesn't have the ball, I'd run around a lot and harass the other team because the only chance I'd ever have of looking good is if I somehow intercept the ball or tackle, because that doesn't take a lot of ability to do. I'd also commit a lot of silly fouls in my half when I feel I'm getting turned by someone.

I know that because I've seen games again just so I can follow him and Masch around and try to understand what they do when we have the ball and form a careful opinion of them. Lucas is a pretender horribly out of his depth.

And on the other hand, you've got Aquilani. Play Aquilani.

You clearly can't stand Lucas, but that aside this is just utter hyperbole.

[JohnDoe]

Would you then say if the defence is not good enough to look after itself changes should be made there?

Yes. Definitely. Our defence is very weak and doesn't suit a top side that dominates possession and requires them to sit high up the pitch.