Lille post-mortem

[kris90210]

I can't believe the lack of respect for how well O'Neill has done.

It reminds me of how negative the comments are when we get linked with someone like Antonio Valencia, until they make the big move, and then all of a sudden, we should have got them.

Who are you? His friggin mum? O Neill is a decent manager, but lots of people on here dont think he's the messiah. Deal with it

[Lecter]

I do read them and i'm telling you what's coming across to me. You can eff and blind all you like. To me, 10% of what you say is from a critical angle, and 90% isnt.

I genuinely dont recall reading a 'list of criticisms of Benitez' from you. If i did, i'd acknowledge it. I'm not in the habit of lying. And i'm not suggesting you are, nor that you didnt post such a list. I just dont remember reading it. It's possible that i did and forgot.

Posted yesterday



Originally Posted by Lecter
I wish you would read my posts

I could have sworn I criticised Rafa for purchasing Johnson on a previous page

I'd also add that at times his team selections and substitutions arent that great

People on here (yourself included) will probably slag me off but I think his biggest fundamental mistake this season and last was trying to be too adventurous

By that I mean he has a system that is effective and gets results but to reach that next level he obviously needs something else

Last season he bought Keane and tried to play 4-4-2 and this didnt work this goes back to Gerrard playing in central midfield (where I think he is far less effective)

Secondly this season hes tried to bring in 2 attacking fullbacks which have left us exposed badly. Insua isnt up to it fullstop and Johnson is not that great defensively

Personally I'd have spent the Johnson money, which wasnt £17 million as we wrote off Crouch money which looking at Pompeys situation is unlikely we would have received, on a wide player who exactly I dont know but I'd have looked to strengthen that position

[Shaggy]

i'm really worried about the utd game - last thing i want is to be well beaten by that shower

The prospect of going there is sickening at the moment, really sickening. At least we go into it on the back of three consecutive good wins against them. We've dished it out to them good and proper lately.

[Craig_H]

Who are you? His friggin mum? O Neill is a decent manager, but lots of people on here dont think he's the messiah. Deal with it

[ntto]

The prospect of going there is sickening at the moment, really sickening. At least we go into it on the back of three consecutive good wins against them. We've dished it out to them good and proper lately.

yea but if it's 4 or 5 nil to them which given their form isnt unlikely will ****ing kill me

[samcopyright]

For the first time ever tonight. I turned off the game after 60mins. It was too painful too watch. This isnt knee jerk stuff....its been brewing since the first game at White Lane....when we all realised we are fooked without Alonso.

Im convinced some players have are just sick of Rafas constant instructions, anaylsis and FACTS.

Heres some FACTS. We have the worlds best striker. A world beating keeper. A worldclass midfield general. And a world class captain. Yet we cant beat Lille or Wigan

FACT.......our manager cant get the best out them anymore.........time to move on.........

[Craig_H]

Posted yesterday



Originally Posted by Lecter
I wish you would read my posts

I could have sworn I criticised Rafa for purchasing Johnson on a previous page

I'd also add that at times his team selections and substitutions arent that great

People on here (yourself included) will probably slag me off but I think his biggest fundamental mistake this season and last was trying to be too adventurous

By that I mean he has a system that is effective and gets results but to reach that next level he obviously needs something else

Last season he bought Keane and tried to play 4-4-2 and this didnt work this goes back to Gerrard playing in central midfield (where I think he is far less effective)

Secondly this season hes tried to bring in 2 attacking fullbacks which have left us exposed badly. Insua isnt up to it fullstop and Johnson is not that great defensively

Personally I'd have spent the Johnson money, which wasnt £17 million as we wrote off Crouch money which looking at Pompeys situation is unlikely we would have received, on a wide player who exactly I dont know but I'd have looked to strengthen that position

Seeing it again now, i do recall reading it. I've read so much in the last few days, i dont remember it all, all the time. Apologies, i didnt recall it but on seeing it again, i now do.

My original point was that, ok while you have criticisms of rafa, every point of blame you seem to have, is addressed to the yanks. So yes, you have criticisms of benitez, and you would recognise that some of these criticisms/mistakes of his have led to our plight to some extent.

In subsequent posts though (and there's been many), you seem to consciously address the faults of the yanks in relation our problems and keep quiet about those of rafa, which your list pinpoints.

I may not be phrasing it brilliantly, but i hope you can kind of see what i'm saying.

[Craig_H]

yea but if it's 4 or 5 nil to them which given their form isnt unlikely will ****ing kill me

If we stop Rooney and/or the supply to him, they wont have enough to thrash us.

[bradsdad]

i think he has lost the dressing room yet we cant afford to let him go so its a disaster cos if this is correct then it will be players who get pissed off and go

[Lecter]

Seeing it again now, i do recall reading it. I've read so much in the last few days, i dont remember it all, all the time. Apologies, i didnt recall it but on seeing it again, i now do.

My original point was that, ok while you have criticisms of rafa, every point of blame you seem to have, is addressed to the yanks. So yes, you have criticisms of benitez, and you would recognise that some of these criticisms/mistakes of his have led to our plight to some extent.

In subsequent posts though (and there's been many), you seem to consciously address the faults of the yanks in relation our problems and keep quiet about those of rafa, which your list pinpoints.

I may not be phrasing it brilliantly, but i hope you can kind of see what i'm saying.

I'll admit my biggest fundamental gripe is with the owners

I think any manager we have will be hampered by them and I genuinely fear for our club more for that reason than for any decisions Benitez is or isnt making at the moment

To me replacing Rafa is a short term solution to our long term problems

It still doesnt solve the debt issue, its still doesnt resolve the lack of investment in the playing staff - in fact it could be argued quite easily that sacking Rafa could increase our financial problems greatly

Dont get me wrong I dont see us doing a Leeds or Portsmouth next year but I do genuinely fear the road we are headed down under their stewardship

Oh and for the record I think in football terms Benitez's position is almost untenable BUT the reality of our financial situation means it highly unlikely we will be having a new manager unless he decides to walk (which I believe is unlikely also)

[darkstar]

Under no circumstances is it acceptable to have a player, never mind the so-called captain, who can't be bothered, no circumstances at all. If he can't be bothered he can **** off as far as I'm concerned. Totally unacceptable.

[Craig_H]

I'll admit my biggest fundamental gripe is with the owners

I think any manager we have will be hampered by them and I genuinely fear for our club more for that reason than for any decisions Benitez is or isnt making at the moment

To me replacing Rafa is a short term solution to our long term problems

It still doesnt solve the debt issue, its still doesnt resolve the lack of investment in the playing staff - in fact it could be argued quite easily that sacking Rafa could increase our financial problems greatly

Dont get me wrong I dont see us doing a Leeds or Portsmouth next year but I do genuinely fear the road we are headed down under their stewardship

I dont dispute any of that lot. My only train of thought re Benitez is that whilst his hands are tied to a point, the level of achievement he's bringing us now is disproportionate to the squad we have.

All the owners ****e would still be here and would still hamper another coach, but all things considered, i think even with that issue, rafa should have us doing far better than we are, and i think another manager (obviously assuming it's the right one, whoever one might think that is) would do better.

Win the league? No.

Challenge for it? Possibly. Perhaps not, but i wouldnt call it instantly dismissable as a possibility.

Get in the top four consistently? (or at least til City go completely insane with their megabucks for a sustained period, as chelsea did). Definitely.

To put it more bluntly, whether we get into the top 4 this season has a direct impact on how quickly City will take their place as the number one footballing force in england.

If we did make top 4, that'd slow City's project down, as the lack of CL football will hamper their level of star-acquisition. In turn, it'd keep us the more attractive prospect.

If they get top 4, they then have everything they need to launch an assault on the title for next season, and others beyond it. The money to afford top players and the prize of CL football to lure them.

So it's imperative that we get it, not only for us directly, but to put an obstacle in front of the inevitable, as far as City's rise is concerned.

Simply, i think if we fail to do it, we'll have failed with a squad that's certainly 4th best in the league, if not 3rd IMO. That is a failure on the manager.

[Shanks]

I can't make my mind up who needs to go first.

Rafa or G&H.

I look at what a great job D. Moyes is doing and I remember that the buck must stop with the manager.

How many times as fans have we cried out for changes to be made for tactical decisions and questioned "Why is he still on the pitch" when we felt the wrong sub has been made..

Surely Rafa must see the same game.

The whole lack of attacking options is the biggest issue for me.

Maxi Rodriguez being a good example..

Here we have a great attacker/midfielder whos talent has been wasted,
as he is left to defend and pick up on any scraps that are fed to him.

[little dave hedgehog]

so, craig...

are you saying that we should ditch benitez?

is that what you're on about?

i'm unclear.

[darkstar]

Posted yesterday

Personally I'd have spent the Johnson money, which wasnt £17 million as we wrote off Crouch money which looking at Pompeys situation is unlikely we would have received, on a wide player who exactly I dont know but I'd have looked to strengthen that position

I agree totally. This squad has neither pace or width to open up defenses.