Does Rafa deserve one last throw of the dice?

[Will]

You think a footballer's job is just the same as any other normal job, like mine or yours? ****ing hell. Even despite the differences though, managers in loads of 'normal' jobs DO indeed say or do things to motivate their staff. It's a fact of life, i've seen it happen at various times, in every single job i've had.

Why do managers bother spending time in the dressing room before the game and at half time then? Tactical instructions dont take the entire 15 minutes interval.

Why do you suppose managers get asked, after a bad result, "how do you go about getting their heads up again and getting the players positive again?"

Honestly mate, i mean no malice in this, but you really do come out with some utterly utterly clueless nonsense sometimes.

The notion that motivating his squad plays no part in a manager's role, is one of the all time classics.

Clearly not from Sky Sports

[Craig_H]

Ok, which of those would have hurt Rafa most?

I dont know, but it's not about 'hurt', it's about having a tangible impact on his job and his ability to do it.

The Klinsmann stuff will fade away and while he wouldnt forget it, he could put it to the back of his mind because nothing physically changed.

With a new player, that player is then always there every day. Not only is he there to remind the manager of what happened every day, he also limits the manager's ability to make some of the changes HE might have wanted to make. No professional manager would put up with that. No one.

You get what i mean by tangible changes?

Clearly not from Sky Sports

Just off the top of my head. Given our recent fortunes, it wasnt that difficult to come up with an example such as that.

[Guest]

You think a footballer's job is just the same as any other normal job, like mine or yours? ****ing hell. Even despite the differences though, managers in loads of 'normal' jobs DO indeed say or do things to motivate their staff. It's a fact of life, i've seen it happen at various times, in every single job i;ve had.

Why do managers bother spending time in the dressing room before the game and at half time then? Tactical instructions dont take the entire 15 minutes interval.

Why do you suppose managers get asked, after a bad result, "how do you go about getting their heads up again and getting the players positive again?"

Honestly mate, i mean no malice in this, but you really do come out with some utterly utterly clueless nonsense sometimes.

The notion that motivating his squad plays no part in a manager's role, is one of the all time classics.

It's not the most important aspect of a manager's job, if it was, they would be employing motivators as managers. You seem to think that's our most prominent problem, the one flaw that indicate that Rafa is 'negative' and all the theories you've been banging on here for months.

Well, it's not, there is far more to the job and Rafa ticks most of the boxes for determining if he's got the required qualities for the job.

[Craig_H]

It's not the most important aspect of a manager's job, if it was, they would be employing motivators as managers. You seem to think that's our most prominent problem, the one flaw that indicate that Rafa is 'negative' and all the theories you've been banging on here for months.

Well, it's not, there is far more to the job and Rafa ticks most of the boxes for determining if he's got the required qualities for the job.

I didnt say it was the 'most important' aspect though, did i? You're moving the goalposts, as usual. I asked whether motivation was any part of a manager's business, and you said no. It clearly is. And now, albeit grudgingly, you seem to be cottoning onto that.

[Will]

I dont know, but it's not about 'hurt', it's about having a tangible impact on his job and his ability to do it.

The Klinsmann stuff will fade away and while he wouldnt forget it, he could put it to the back of his mind because nothing physically changed.

With a new player, that player is then always there every day. Not only is he there to remind the manager of what happened every day, he also limits the manager's ability to make some of the changes HE might have wanted to make. No professional manager would put up with that. No one.

You get what i mean by tangible changes?



Just off the top of my head. Given our recent fortunes, it wasnt that difficult to come up with an example such as that.

No but it would be for Sly Sports i was actuely praising you on questioning, far better than Geof Shreves Tangible? i do yes. As for no manager would put up with that, Rafa would. Why? becouse i do think he can be extreamly stubborn and iv had this conservation with a few of the lads before. Not that being stubborn is a bad thing. Id like to know who you would like to see should Rafa go?

[Guest]

I didnt say it was the 'most important' aspect though, did i? You're moving the goalposts, as usual. I asked whether motivation was any part of a manager's business, and you said no. It clearly is. And now, albeit grudgingly, you seem to be cottoning onto that.

I don't think this should figure at all on the list of his priorities, he's got people to do it for him, for example Sammy Lee. It all depends on the structure he's put in place, not all managers are 'hands on' managers.

I never 'cotton' to your flawed and pedantic ideas Craig, I rather tend to react to them, so sorry if I can be seen as a little too pedantic myself.

[Craig_H]

Fredo, you have zero clue mate and there's no value in continuing a discussion with you, so i'll withdraw my participation and leave you to have your much desired last word.

[Guest]

Footballers are paid more than managers these days so in essence, I am asking myself who's really got the power?

[Craig_H]

Id like to know who you would like to see should Rafa go?

What restrictions are you putting in place, with regards to who i could choose?

[Will]

What restrictions are you putting in place, with regards to who i could choose?

me puttin restrictions in place? those two yanks done that a long ****ing time ago! Id love us to be able to choose whoever the **** we wanted. But we cant, i wonder why?. Considering the finacial mess we are in, and that we HAVE to find a £100million by July or RBS will cease control?. And the position we are in the league, id like to know. Who can do a better job than Rafa. Becouse you kno who will come calling this summer for Rafa, Real and Juventus. Whos left? Basically abit of commen sense.

[Craig_H]

I know it's not you putting restrictions in, but if i'm given a free reign, i'll likely pick someone you'll say isnt possible.

That's why i asked about restrictions.

Anyway, i'm going to bed now, i will answer this next time, when i see what the specific restrictions are considered to be.

[Will]

I know it's not you putting restrictions in, but if i'm given a free reign, i'll likely pick someone you'll say isnt possible.

That's why i asked about restrictions.

Anyway, i'm going to bed now, i will answer this next time, when i see what the specific restrictions are considered to be.

IF it came down to getting a new manager. Hiddink and Lippi who i have always admired Marcelo. Not least cos he likes a cigar or two and a championship or 10 With the financial situation we are in Mourinho is a no no. No harm asking him and approaching him granted. Lippi i would like after the world Cup with Italy he has always said i would like to manage in England one day. A freebie along with Guus. To be fair as good as Jose is his record is nowere near Lippis. I would take him anyday of the week.

[Armchairkopite]

**** this new manager talk lads thats for a different thread.

I opened this topic to discuss Rafas pros and cons and the merits of giving him another chance.

Too many on here are all ready thinking about the next in line, well if thats what you want there is a thread discussing it else where. Personally i find it disrespectful that people turn there back on the man that is still in charge.

The Liverpool way is to stick by the man in charge. The man who is passionate about the club, has the credentials to get us to the top and is working within a tricky ownership situation.

[5europeancups]

No, he should leave as soon as possible now. We are now in a situation where our qualication for 4th place depends on other teams slipping up.

as good as Rafa has made Liverpool ie end of last season, Liverpool have also been bad(all of this season).

With no real reasons to explain this remarkable reverse and incosistency you cannot possibly let the man have one more chance.

His record is patchy to say the least based on the resources he has had at his disposal.

How many youth players have come through that are quality and that you think will settle into the long term first team picture?

What has he won other than what was won with Houlliers team and Xabi Alonso / garcia?
Why did he sell Xabi Alonso?

Why did he buy so much rubbish?

Why cannot he keep his mouth shut when he should?

The guy is clearly very talented but he is not the man to take Liverpool forward.

He gave us one great night, but didnt deliver what we all wanted the most.

Personally I am gutted for him, as he is a great manager I think, but he has too many flaws.

His tenure should be ended asap now.

[5europeancups]

Footballers are paid more than managers these days so in essence, I am asking myself who's really got the power?

Harry Potter?