What is Rafa on about ?

[Red Chilli]

so you want ferguson as our manager then?

No mate, you're getting confused. The discussion was heading in the direction of "what do you expect Rafa to do? Bollock the players and tell them they're playing ****" as if that's a ridiculous thing to do.
I was just pointing out that there is a precedent set by the longest serving most successful manager in Premiership history. There is no reason why Rafa shouldn't publically chastise the players.

[alunevans]

If a player plays well enough he will keep his spot, he might get rested for the odd game but the spot will still be his. The problem is no one is playing well enough to justify any starting positions at the moment.

For at least a third of the team thats not been true for ages. I think we need to breed a fierce territoriality over each players place in the team. I don't buy this rotation stuff, especially when our squad is piss poor anyway.

Lets select a first eleven for week in week out, then let them prove that they have the right to keep their shirt. If they prove not worthy then let someone else claim it.

Everything now is so bloody comfortable. There are some regulars who are in the team week in week out even when stonkingly out of form, and the rest pass their place in the team around week by week thereby giving it little value, and those players know that fighting for your place is not something expected of them.

The result is the half hearted complacency that we saw in the first half against Blackburn and the second half in particular at Old Trafford.

Lets hold up the shirt and give it some value, and let people fight to have it. And once you've got it its yours til it is proven that someone else at the club has more right to have it than you.

Then when that happens you can either fight like billyo to get that precious thing back, or you can move on to another club.

It seems obvious to me why everyone seems so comfortable. The place in the team is happily shared or granted come what may. Its lost its value as a result, and the players have lost their need to FIGHT for it!

[paulcooper4]

I was just pointing out that there is a precedent set by the longest serving most successful manager in Premiership history.

[Red Chilli]

Not in a good mood today then?

Chill out mate, the game's over now

[CharlieMansonsSquint]

To be fair, what's he gonna do? Come out in the press and say "Actually, we were just **** today" ... come on..

He should've done.

[G]

Why should any of them give 100% if they are getting ****ing dropped next match. [/B]

This is a key point.Players need to know they'll be rewarded for good performances.Nobody can tell me that professional athletes get tired playing football for a maximum 270 minutes each week.In march or April some might be tired but not now.

I'm ****ing sick of rotation.

[Parm]

because we pay them up to 100k a week thats ****in why, he's not gonna come out on tv and bollock them is he.

got to keep the bollockings in house.

[Morph]

For at least a third of the team thats not been true for ages. I think we need to breed a fierce territoriality over each players place in the team. I don't buy this rotation stuff, especially when our squad is piss poor anyway.

Lets select a first eleven for week in week out, then let them prove that they have the right to keep their shirt. If they prove not worthy then let someone else claim it.

Thats contradicting yourself right there:

Players practically guaranteed a game:

Reina
Finnan
Carra
Hyypia
Riise
Gerrard
Sissoko
Alonso
Kuyt

For my way of thinking theres only 2 positions up for discussion, ones bewteen Crouch and Bellamy and rafa looks set on Bellamy, and the other is left wing with Gonzalez looking like he might be getting close to a starting place.

So say that's our 11 which it most likely will be, with a bench of Dudek, Garcia, Pennant, Aurelio, Agger then I don't really see your point.

[kurtangle01]

houllier would have been hung, drawn and quarterd by all of us if he had made comments like that after the game when we have been **** all season so why should rafa be any different?

he's ****ed up as much as anyone ths season with his constant tinkering and spending £8million on average players like pennant. it's nomistake that we were at our best last season when rafa had a settled core of 8 players who played every week and made only 1 or 2 changes each week.

fans are right to have a go.

[alunevans]

Thats contradicting yourself right there:

Players practically guaranteed a game:

Reina
Finnan
Carra
Hyypia
Riise
Gerrard
Sissoko
Alonso
Kuyt

For my way of thinking theres only 2 positions up for, ones bewteen Crouch and Bellamy and rafa looks set on Bellamy, and the other is left wing with Gonzalez looking like he might be getting close to a starting place.

So say that's our 11 which it most likely will be, with a bench of Dudek, Garcia, Pennant, Aurelio, Agger then I don't really see your point.

Agger and Hyypia and Carra rotated plenty until Agger got injured.

We've seen Gonzales, Riise, Aurelio and Gerrard at left midfield this season. If Warnock had been fit he may have started there too. I can't remember if Garcia has. Some of that has been due to injury to Riise, but a lot of it has been through choice. Riise is back and I still personally have no idea who our left midfielder is.

Truth is, we don't have one. We have several who share it like nice little children.

And I've not got a bloody clue who our front two is from game to game.

The right side tends to be Gerrard yes but he's been rotated all round the pitch and off it. We've had Gerrard, Pennant, Garcia on the right so far.

The left side I can't predict before a game. Up front I can't predict. Right side is more predictable but not totally so. And when Agger was fit, it was a guessing game who the two centre backs were.

So thats 5 or 6 places that seem to be swapped around when everybody is fit in the name of 'rotation'.

Thats my point.

[kurtangle01]

Agger and Hyypia and Carra rotated plenty until Agger got injured.

We've seen Gonzales, Riise, Aurelio and Gerrard at left midfield this season. If Warnock had been fit he may have started there too. I can't remember if Garcia has. Some of that has been due to injury to Riise, but a lot of it has been through choice. Riise is back and I still personally have no idea who our left midfielder is.

Truth is, we don't have one. We have several who share it like nice little children.

And I've not got a bloody clue who our front two is from game to game.

The right side tends to be Gerrard yes but he's been rotated all round the pitch and off it. We've had Gerrard, Pennant, Garcia on the right so far.

The left side I can't predict before a game. Up front I can't predict. Right side is more predictable but not totally so. And when Agger was fit, it was a guessing game who the two centre backs were.

So thats 5 or 6 places that seem to be swapped around when everybody is fit in the name of 'rotation'.

Thats my point.

and they're good points.

[G]

houllier would have been hung, drawn and quarterd by all of us if he had made comments like that after the game when we have been **** all season so why should rafa be any different?

he's ****ed up as much as anyone ths season with his constant tinkering and spending £8million on average players like pennant. it's nomistake that we were at our best last season when rafa had a settled core of 8 players who played every week and made only 1 or 2 changes each week.

fans are right to have a go.

spot on.I'm very Disillusioned with Rafa this season

[Morph]

Agger and Hyypia and Carra rotated plenty until Agger got injured.

We've seen Gonzales, Riise, Aurelio and Gerrard at left midfield this season. If Warnock had been fit he may have started there too. I can't remember if Garcia has. Some of that has been due to injury to Riise, but a lot of it has been through choice. Riise is back and I still personally have no idea who our left midfielder is.

Truth is, we don't have one. We have several who share it like nice little children.

And I've not got a bloody clue who our front two is from game to game.

The right side tends to be Gerrard yes but he's been rotated all round the pitch and off it. We've had Gerrard, Pennant, Garcia on the right so far.

The left side I can't predict before a game. Up front I can't predict. Right side is more predictable but not totally so. And when Agger was fit, it was a guessing game who the two centre backs were.

So thats 5 or 6 places that seem to be swapped around when everybody is fit in the name of 'rotation'.

Thats my point.

Right up front is Kuyt and one other, that hasn't changed appart from when he was injured

Right wing is Stevie G, but when you buy a right winger in Pennant you have to give him a chance and so he challenged Gerrard but it seems he isn't good enough - thats what you want isn't it?

Left mid is a problem, but I've already commented on that as a problem, but like I said Gonzalez might be coming into it now, we don't know what problems he's had settling in, but to start against Man U Rafa must have some confidence in him.

Central defence is the only spot thats been 'rotated' if you like, between Carra Hyypia and Agger, but the obvious intention is to move Hyypia out of the team and Agger in, and thats been hampered by Aggers injury.

So I make that 4 positions, all of which I think are justifiable.

Your turn

[alunevans]

I'll just repeat what I said earlier then when you said people DO have their shirt if good enough and only 2 places were up for grabs.

"For at least a third of the team thats not been true for ages."

4 is at least a third of the team.

[CharlieMansonsSquint]

houllier would have been hung, drawn and quarterd by all of us if he had made comments like that after the game when we have been **** all season so why should rafa be any different?

he's ****ed up as much as anyone ths season with his constant tinkering and spending £8million on average players like pennant. it's nomistake that we were at our best last season when rafa had a settled core of 8 players who played every week and made only 1 or 2 changes each week.

fans are right to have a go.

****ing A that's right.