Our team our squad our club

[CJ]

Not sure this needs another thread but if it doesnt this will die on its arse and drop off the front page.

there are threads about our right side about torres about our defence and whether Roy is the right man etc etc

however for me if you look at it all the club has been in decline for over 12 months the players dont look up for it on the whole (yes there are one or two exceptions). there is no movement there is no confidence. This has happened to two managers who both say the club needs new owners inverstment etc etc.

To me the problems Torres etc are suffering all flow on from the cancer that we now see eating away at the club.

Lets not turn our anger to players and manager even though they are the easiest and most viewed parts of the club. Remember the owners are the ones to blame and lets back the team inc manager all we can until that changes.

I must admit that this post was just going to say that everything else is a symptom of the owners not sure where the back everyone else bit came from.

I dont rate some of the players or the manager tbh but they are our players and our manager and they have to do the best they can with the crap hand dealt them (from a footballing perspective that is)

[SimonNo7]

Not sure this needs another thread but if it doesnt this will die on its arse and drop off the front page.

there are threads about our right side about torres about our defence and whether Roy is the right man etc etc

however for me if you look at it all the club has been in decline for over 12 months the players dont look up for it on the whole (yes there are one or two exceptions). there is no movement there is no confidence. This has happened to two managers who both say the club needs new owners inverstment etc etc.

To me the problems Torres etc are suffering all flow on from the cancer that we now see eating away at the club.

Lets not turn our anger to players and manager even though they are the easiest and most viewed parts of the club. Remember the owners are the ones to blame and lets back the team inc manager all we can until that changes.

I must admit that this post was just going to say that everything else is a symptom of the owners not sure where the back everyone else bit came from.

I dont rate some of the players or the manager tbh but they are our players and our manager and they have to do the best they can with the crap hand dealt them (from a footballing perspective that is)

This is the biggest thing for me and I have mentioned it in a number of previous threads. We have a load of statues. Notice I didn't say a team of statues as we don't appear to be a team and haven't been for over a year.

I watch the games (admittedly on TV) and our players just don't move and create space (a reason why I was so disappointed with Aquilani being sent on loan as he was one of only a few players we have who actually seemed to know how to make space for himself or other players). They just stand there expecting the ball to do all the work which then makes it far easier for opposition teams to harrass and hurry which results in us passing backwards and then hoofing.

Whatever happened to pass and move, little triangles etc.

Until we start to move for each other and put a little bit of urgency into our play we will continue to struggle because we will be making it easier for any team to play us.

[CJ]

is that lack of movement coming from a lack of confidence

this lack of movement is why its a team problem not just one or two individuals for me.

[Rudo]

I think the players are feeling sorry for themselves.

[CJ]

maybe but for footballing reasons

somehow they are not motivated and the they should be for the money they get i understand but it clearly doesnt work like that hence some managers get more out of players than others.

something negative is clearly team wide at the moment maybe club wide

[The Birdman]

Torres making a run and offering himself as a target or running in behind as a threat (or not as is mostly the case recently) is solely down to him and his attitude.
The full backs not overlapping but supporting the play up from behind the 'wide' men is a managerial or tactical decision.


Oh also, this current crop of players isn't good enough for us to play Gerrard off Torres, he needs to play centre midfield end of story just so he can see some of the ball and have a impact

[badpiggy]

I guess there's only so long a group of players can go on at a club where so much about it has the air of being on the precipice of being ****ed. There's a lethargy and a lack of confidence about everything we do which is another huge obstacle for Roy to overcome.

In fact I don't think we can underestimate how much of an effect this is all having on players.

It's all well and good saying they're all millionaires who should be out there busting a gut but that's not the full picture for professional athletes - there has to be sense of direction and purpose. Maybe Roy being more vocal about the need for new owners is evidence of the fact that players are expressing disillusion in some way and Roy needs to appear to be 100% on their side.

While i think we are a team in transition, it's more than the usual team in transition situation because so much of where we're supposed to be getting to is undermined daily by hated lying owners etc...Who wouldn't be thinking "Why the **** did I come here?" or "What the **** am I doing here?" when it's nearly an unspoken assumption that anyone who wants to come to us right now has something wrong with them or are ****e and can't believe their luck to be at LFC.

[CJ]

i dont think it is soley about players having bad attitudes.

think of it like being at work do you give your all all the time? maybe your managed badly maybe you think the comapny dont value you maybe you dont know what is happening and are demotivated etc etc

if it was just one player i would say its down to bad attitudes but its most of the squad all players need motiviating in one way or another.

[danperkins]

is that lack of movement coming from a lack of confidence

this lack of movement is why its a team problem not just one or two individuals for me.

Great post and spot on, was saying exactly same thing to my dad whilst watching the game.

[DannyMan2006]

Honest Assessment of our squad.

Gkp: Reina - World Class, no problems
Gkp: Jones - Average at best, trouble if needed long term but fine filling in
Gkp: Gulacsi - Decent up and coming keeper, though nothing special
RB: Johnson - Promising player, not the finished article and not worth the fee.
CB: Carragher - Past his best and lacking in pace. Ability to organize makes him automatic starter
CB: Agger - Cultured player but needs to get tougher. Too easily shrugged of at times
CB: Skrtel - Strong and fearless but lacking a good football brain.
CB: Kyrgiakos - Fantastci in the air but a liability on the deck. Nowhere near good enough.
LB: Konchesky - Mr Average. Dependable but lacking in too many areas and to old to kick on.
LB: Aurelio - Always picking up injuries and is a liability.
RM: Kuyt - Tough and reliable but lacks skill to unlock a tight defence
RM: Maxi - Another player past his peak and one who can no longer compete at the highest level.
CM: Poulsen - Again, on the decline but unlike others is still clinging to his peak years and has enough left in the locker to do a job.
CM: Lucas - Lacking in all areas, not a particularly poor player but one who lacks the skills to fulfill the role he plays at the club.
CM: Gerrard - World class wherever you put him and big game player.
CM: Meireles - Little known but looks tidy on the ball but looked shocked at the amount of time the ball spent in the air. Needs time.
LM: Jovanovic - A battler, has pace but plays with his head down and lacks the football brain of someone like Kuyt.
AM: Cole - Has promised great things for many years without ever really delivering. It's a long shot to expect him to perfrom miracles in a club struggling but is one of the few players at the club who have the ability to unlock a defence.
AM: Babel - Has all the physichal attributes to compete but seems to be missing the mental application. Still young enough to get his head round things and whilst it is unlikely he will ever have the mind set to make it to the top he still has the ability to be a good player for the club.
ST: Torres - World class and the best striker in the world on his day. Has suffered from too many injuries and on occasion looks like he feels it's him against the world and fails to link up with team mates instead trying to win a game on his own. If a team can support him properly and he can stay injury free, the world is his oyster.
ST: N'Gog - Promising striker. Lacks the real killer instinct for goal and still lacks the strength to play the lone striker role to a high level. He is probably where I would expect him to be in terms of development.

Youngsters

Kelly - Looks capable wherever he is played and doesn't fold on the big occasion. Should go all the way.
Wilson - Coped well in Scotland with the physichal side of the game and is composed on the ball. Needs an experienced player next to him to tell him where to be for now, but has the ability to go far.
Pacheco - Size is not a problem as Messi and Zola is testament. Strength however is a must as is the ability to shrug off knocks. Needs building up before expecting too much from him but we will see soon enough if a kick will put him out the game.
Shelvey - Looks composed on the ball and has a real eye for a pass. Needs to sort out the defensive side of his game as getting a free role at a club like Liverpool means you have to be world class, something he is a long way off. Breaking into the DM positions is his best shot at present.
Darby - the Mr Average of the reserves for so long, never lets anyone down but never stands out either. Let himself down on his debut for the club and will need to do better if he ever gets another chance.
Spearing - Only thing holding him back is his size. He is a central midfield player all day long but there aren't many tiny midfield players around. A real ability is needed to make up for his short size and sadly for Jay I just don't see it. Would have been a first teamer by now if he was 6 feet.

[SimonNo7]

is that lack of movement coming from a lack of confidence

this lack of movement is why its a team problem not just one or two individuals for me.

I'm not sure but I would suggest it comes from tactics more than lack of confidence.

[Fredo]

It's not been a decline during the last 12 months, it's been one since the owners came in, i.e. 3 years.

We looked forward to a promising era after Benitez's first and second year in charge, winning the European Cup and the FA Cup, going to another European Cup Final. Then the new owners came in and we started our steady decline despite a promising first summer with them in charge which resulted in a flurry of transfer activity (Torres, Babel, Riera etc).

Figures show you that we've made a profit on average since they've been here. I can understand our more senior players cutting a desolate figure after years of false promises. Can't blame them for that, Alonso and Mascherano have gone and I think for the sake of their careers, they've done the right thing. They could see a sinking ship maybe.

I would say that we're very close to not being a great club anymore. Our history carries us, that is all.

[DannyMan2006]

It's not been a decline during the last 12 months, it's been one since the owners came in, i.e. 3 years.

We looked forward to a promising era after Benitez's first and second year in charge, winning the European Cup and the FA Cup, going to another European Cup Final. Then the new owners came in and we started our steady decline despite a promising first summer with them in charge which resulted in a flurry of transfer activity (Torres, Babel, Riera etc).

Figures show you that we've made a profit on average since they've been here. I can understand our more senior players cutting a desolate figure with after years of false promises.

I would say that we're very close to not being a great club anymore. Our past history carries us, that is all.

Without a doubt. That said, with all the history comes great responsibility and great pressure. Probably too much pressure and expectation if truth be told.

We're a club on the decline that still expects to compete with the best. Only wealthy owners can save us now.

[Exiled_red]

Without wanting to depress anyone the club has been on the down turn for the past 20 years, from the start of the premiership era it was clear that we needed to make changes in the way we operated or we'd be left behind, the new stadium has been needed for about 15 years, and left us struggling to compete financially against firstly Man Utd, then the likes of Chelsea, and now the likes of Man City and Spurs etc. Our lack of financial muscle has cost us in recent years as other sides are spending more and more at a time when we are being sucked dry by our owners.

The team has often seemingly been just one piece away from being contenders, we have come close on a couple of occasions but ultimately feel short. I now no longer feel that we're just one piece away from competing for the title, at the moment I feel we are the furthest we've been away from a title challenge since the Souness era. The squad of a couple of years ago (when we came second) was just a little bit away, but since then we have lost important players and replaced them with people who aren't of the same quality and aren't capable of doing the same job.

In previous years I'd have said I'm happy with the quality of the first 11 but we need to improve the players who come in and replace them when we have injuries or suspensions, at present I'm not even happy with the first 11 We're in a mess, we need to adapt our style of play and add creativity IMO because the performances this season and last season have been lacking in that department. I feel we need to add creativity from wide areas, we don't use the whole width of the pitch, we are very narrow, lack movement and don't get men in the box, as a result we struggle going forward, and constantly rely on Gerrard and Torres to get us out of trouble!

[RichC]

Not sure this needs another thread but if it doesnt this will die on its arse and drop off the front page.

there are threads about our right side about torres about our defence and whether Roy is the right man etc etc

however for me if you look at it all the club has been in decline for over 12 months the players dont look up for it on the whole (yes there are one or two exceptions). there is no movement there is no confidence. This has happened to two managers who both say the club needs new owners inverstment etc etc.

To me the problems Torres etc are suffering all flow on from the cancer that we now see eating away at the club.

Lets not turn our anger to players and manager even though they are the easiest and most viewed parts of the club. Remember the owners are the ones to blame and lets back the team inc manager all we can until that changes.

I must admit that this post was just going to say that everything else is a symptom of the owners not sure where the back everyone else bit came from.

I dont rate some of the players or the manager tbh but they are our players and our manager and they have to do the best they can with the crap hand dealt them (from a footballing perspective that is)

Without a doubt. That said, with all the history comes great responsibility and great pressure. Probably too much pressure and expectation if truth be told.

We're a club on the decline that still expects to compete with the best. Only wealthy owners can save us now.

I don't think we need owners in the same mould as Abramovic or the Man City lot - we need responsible owners who'll do the right thing for the club.

Erradicate the debt, build the stadium we need - LFC is a great opportunity for someone to come in and in the mid to long term make some very good cash from it (this is what football has become now) but on the pretence it's run properly - as a marketable brand it's a world leader and the income we have and can generate should essentially mean we we'd be able to operate pretty much self sufficently.

This sadly is all based on responsible owners coming in and getting H&G out of the club