Leicester City is in talks with ONeill and Eriksson - I'd swap either one for Hodgson.
-
* The above is posted in my opinion. Feel free to disagree. -
I think Sven has been announced96 Never ForgottenComment
-
I think he's better than Hodgson, wasn't sure before and didn't want Sven at all but now I'd take him.Originally posted by Fernandinho View Post* The above is posted in my opinion. Feel free to disagree.Comment
-
COMMENT: Liverpool FC needed an inspirational figure... instead they got Roy Hodgson
Oct 1 2010 By Ben Thornley, Head of Sport
AFTER the manner in which Rafa Benitez’s Anfield reign reached its conclusion this summer, Liverpool needed a manager to re-energise the club and its fans.
Instead, they got Roy Hodgson.
As bad decisions go, replacing the Spaniard with the Londoner was like swapping Javier Mascherano for Christian Poulsen. Or attempting to sign Carlton Cole as a "high quality" back-up for Fernando Torres.
Liverpool required an inspirational figure to light a fire under a club in the shadow of its toxic American owners, a motivator to realise the potential of a talented but underachieving group of players who stumbled to a poor seventh-place Premier League finish.
With so many key men known to be considering their futures and Champions League rivals Manchester City and Tottenham growing stronger by the season, a boss who could make an immediate impact should have been sought.
Not a steady hand for hire whose last big job was 11 years ago at Inter Milan – and only then in a caretaker role – and who had spent the best part of the last decade cruising towards retirement in Scandinavia.
Hodgson is a fine coach but he isn’t a Liverpool manager, and already it is apparent he is horribly out of his depth.
Indeed, when you hear the 63-year-old talk it takes a moment for it to register that he is Reds boss.
It’s not just the foreign accent of his two immediate predecessors that he lacks.
He has neither the arrogance or charisma of Gerard Houllier nor the unswerving self-assurance, pedigree and genius of Benitez – traits necessary to deal with the huge pressure that comes with the Anfield job.
There are times when Hodgson himself appears to forget he’s sitting in one of the game’s most prized hotseats.
He often seems too modest and almost embarrassed to say anything that would make him appear confident.
Certainly, some of his signings and transfer targets suggest that Hodgson still thinks he is at Craven Cottage.
Hodgson is, however, at least as defensively-minded as both Benitez and Houllier. Revealingly after last week’s humiliating home Carling Cup defeat to Northampton, Hodgson said that when his side went 2-1 down he had to "throw caution to the wind."
Liverpool were playing a struggling League Two side. At Anfield.
Caution shouldn’t come in to the equation.
Equally as unforgivable was Hodgson’s failure to defend Fernando Torres against Sir Alex Ferguson’s accusations of cheating, with the former Fulham boss more interested in preserving his friendship with the United manager than defending the reputation of a star player.
The Scot after all can only be pally with a manager he doesn’t perceive to be a threat to him – and there’s no danger of Liverpool challenging Manchester United this term.
Or even the top four.
After playing the likes of Manchester City, Manchester United and Arsenal so far this term, it has been suggested that the Reds are not as bad as the table suggests.
Liverpool, however, looked no more likely to beat Sunderland or Birmingham than they did the Red Devils or City.
It feels wrong to judge a manager so early and perhaps Hodgson does deserve more time to make his mark at Anfield, but there hasn’t even been a glimmer of hope that things will improve.
This side’s strength if nothing else has always been its resoluteness and organisation, yet despite taking an even more cautious approach than Benitez the defence appears shakier than at any time since the Roy Evans era. And for all the criticism of Benitez’s favoured zonal marking system, at least players contested set pieces.
It might be considered too un-Liverpool to axe a manager so prematurely, going down an unwanted road travelled by the likes of Newcastle.
Sometimes, though, it is braver to admit that you got it wrong in the first place.
How long to do you leave it? Until Christmas or the end of the season? Time is something the club don’t have.
Another season outside of the Champions League is likely to prompt the exits of Jose Reina and Fernando Torres.
And if it’s the same men brokering their moves away who negotiated the paltry sum for Mascherano, Liverpool won’t even be suitably compensated.
Even then would Hodgson – who paid £7.5m for Kevin Davies while at Blackburn – be the best man to spend the money?
Worryingly, he is already trying to reduce expectations at Liverpool by suggesting after the defeat to Northampton and the draw to Sunderland that the fans needed to lower their hopes for the forthcoming season.
Liverpool fans and their crazy ambitions of beating the Black Cats and the Cobblers at Anfield, eh?
The last time the 18 times champions of England made such a poor start to the season was during Graeme Souness’ second term in charge.
Had David Moores moved as quickly to end the former midfielder’s disastrous reign as he did to accept Tom Hicks and George Gillett’s money, then maybe Liverpool’s title drought would not now stand at 20 years and counting.
Sticking by a manager is only noble if you have the right boss. Nothing in the past nor present suggests Hodgson is.
The Souness years – from which the club has never recovered – showed what can happen if you keep faith in the wrong man.
It’s not as if there isn’t a ready-made replacement at Anfield in Kenny Dalglish, the man to whom the club should have turned in the first place.
Instead, a Liverpool board described by Benitez as knowing "nothing about football" made the mistake of going for the man of the moment, hiring Hodgson on the strength of one good season after forcing the Spaniard’s exit because of one poor campaign.
For now, though, the ownership issue is the most pressing challenge facing the club.
After all, the root cause of Liverpool's decline is a lack of investment in the squad for three years, exacerbated by a handful of poor transfer decisions by Benitez admittedly. Appointing Hodgson, however, has only accelerated the Reds' regression.
[email protected]Bob Paisley - "This club has been my life. I'd go out and sweep the street and be proud to do it for Liverpool if they asked me to."Comment
-
Is this the Ben Thornley, former Man. Utd player Lecter?Are we winning?Comment
-
Mr Hodgson,
Please read this the attached article, it sums up the feelings we have
for you as Liverpool manager.
Your lack of ambition and puzzling after match interviews have
completely undermined your standing amongst us, the fans. It is
apparent that you don't really know what is involved in managing this
club. Dumbing down expectations in order to make a draw with
Sunderland seem acceptable is completely at odds with the ambition the
manager of this club should display. Last night's display against
Utrecht was a further indictment of your lack of ability at this level
- the performances, in EVERY game, have been the worst we have ever
seen as Liverpool fans. We as fans have been represented by some
brilliant teams and players over the last 5 years - your predecessor
took us to two European Cup finals, lead us to an FA Cup win and
oversaw the dismantling of far better teams than FC Utrecht and
Northampton. To say "If you're not happy with being top of the group
(Europa League), you'll never be happy" - is bordering on insulting
us, our intelligence and our expectations of how we expect to see our
team play. I would refer you to radio phone ins, internet forums and
the following article to get a grasp of how our opinions of your
tenure are forming.
We would like you to resign and allow Kenny Dalglish to take over on
an interim basis.
Thanks
Daniel Torres
AFTER the manner in which Rafa Benitez’s Anfield reign reached its
conclusion this summer, Liverpool needed a manager to re-energise the
club and its fans.
Instead, they got Roy Hodgson.
As bad decisions go, replacing the Spaniard with the Londoner was like
swapping Javier Mascherano for Christian Poulsen. Or attempting to
sign Carlton Cole as a "high quality" back-up for Fernando Torres.
Liverpool required an inspirational figure to light a fire under a
club in the shadow of its toxic American owners, a motivator to
realise the potential of a talented but underachieving group of
players who stumbled to a poor seventh-place Premier League finish.
With so many key men known to be considering their futures and
Champions League rivals Manchester City and Tottenham growing stronger
by the season, a boss who could make an immediate impact should have
been sought.
Not a steady hand for hire whose last big job was 11 years ago at
Inter Milan – and only then in a caretaker role – and who had spent
the best part of the last decade cruising towards retirement in
Scandinavia.
Hodgson is a fine coach but he isn’t a Liverpool manager, and already
it is apparent he is horribly out of his depth.
Indeed, when you hear the 63-year-old talk it takes a moment for it to
register that he is Reds boss.
It’s not just the foreign accent of his two immediate predecessors
that he lacks.
He has neither the arrogance or charisma of Gerard Houllier nor the
unswerving self-assurance, pedigree and genius of Benitez – traits
necessary to deal with the huge pressure that comes with the Anfield
job.
There are times when Hodgson himself appears to forget he’s sitting in
one of the game’s most prized hotseats.
He often seems too modest and almost embarrassed to say anything that
would make him appear confident.
Certainly, some of his signings and transfer targets suggest that
Hodgson still thinks he is at Craven Cottage.
Hodgson is, however, at least as defensively-minded as both Benitez
and Houllier. Revealingly after last week’s humiliating home Carling
Cup defeat to Northampton, Hodgson said that when his side went 2-1
down he had to "throw caution to the wind."
Liverpool were playing a struggling League Two side. At Anfield.
Caution shouldn’t come in to the equation.
Equally as unforgivable was Hodgson’s failure to defend Fernando
Torres against Sir Alex Ferguson’s accusations of cheating, with the
former Fulham boss more interested in preserving his friendship with
the United manager than defending the reputation of a star player.
The Scot after all can only be pally with a manager he doesn’t
perceive to be a threat to him – and there’s no danger of Liverpool
challenging Manchester United this term.
Or even the top four.
After playing the likes of Manchester City, Manchester United and
Arsenal so far this term, it has been suggested that the Reds are not
as bad as the table suggests.
Liverpool, however, looked no more likely to beat Sunderland or
Birmingham than they did the Red Devils or City.
It feels wrong to judge a manager so early and perhaps Hodgson does
deserve more time to make his mark at Anfield, but there hasn’t even
been a glimmer of hope that things will improve.
This side’s strength if nothing else has always been its resoluteness
and organisation, yet despite taking an even more cautious approach
than Benitez the defence appears shakier than at any time since the
Roy Evans era. And for all the criticism of Benitez’s favoured zonal
marking system, at least players contested set pieces.
It might be considered too un-Liverpool to axe a manager so
prematurely, going down an unwanted road travelled by the likes of
Newcastle.
Sometimes, though, it is braver to admit that you got it wrong in the
first place.
How long to do you leave it? Until Christmas or the end of the season?
Time is something the club don’t have.
Another season outside of the Champions League is likely to prompt the
exits of Jose Reina and Fernando Torres.
And if it’s the same men brokering their moves away who negotiated the
paltry sum for Mascherano, Liverpool won’t even be suitably
compensated.
Even then would Hodgson – who paid £7.5m for Kevin Davies while at
Blackburn – be the best man to spend the money?
Worryingly, he is already trying to reduce expectations at Liverpool
by suggesting after the defeat to Northampton and the draw to
Sunderland that the fans needed to lower their hopes for the
forthcoming season.
Liverpool fans and their crazy ambitions of beating the Black Cats and
the Cobblers at Anfield, eh?
The last time the 18 times champions of England made such a poor start
to the season was during Graeme Souness’ second term in charge.
Had David Moores moved as quickly to end the former midfielder’s
disastrous reign as he did to accept Tom Hicks and George Gillett’s
money, then maybe Liverpool’s title drought would not now stand at 20
years and counting.
Sticking by a manager is only noble if you have the right boss.
Nothing in the past nor present suggests Hodgson is.
The Souness years – from which the club has never recovered – showed
what can happen if you keep faith in the wrong man.
It’s not as if there isn’t a ready-made replacement at Anfield in
Kenny Dalglish, the man to whom the club should have turned in the
first place.
Instead, a Liverpool board described by Benitez as knowing "nothing
about football" made the mistake of going for the man of the moment,
hiring Hodgson on the strength of one good season after forcing the
Spaniard’s exit because of one poor campaign.
For now, though, the ownership issue is the most pressing challenge
facing the club.
After all, the root cause of Liverpool's decline is a lack of
investment in the squad for three years, exacerbated by a handful of
poor transfer decisions by Benitez admittedly. Appointing Hodgson,
however, has only accelerated the Reds' regression.
[email protected]Comment
-
A good read,Its Paul tomkins though so I'd make a cuppa before starting
This season, Liverpool have allowed opponents 92 shots at their goal in their first six league games, in contrast to just 46 in the corresponding fixtures last season. In 2009/10, 72 crosses were delivered into Liverpool’s box in those same games; this year, it’s 126. Nine goals have been conceded this time, to four last year.
(And bear in mind, these were not necessarily Liverpool’s better games last season.)
Only one Premier League team has delivered fewer crosses of their own. Liverpool are not having as much of the ball, and any passing that does take place is in deeper areas. No-one hits the byline, or gets even close. Torres looks bewildered.
Now, as with any piece on the team these days, the off-field issues are vitally important to remember. They are the bigger issues. The sit-in last week, and the direct action this week, are all vital in fighting for the long-term future of the club.
But the actual football is still something that people want to talk about. (The healthier the Reds are on the pitch at the time this horrible saga is resolved, the less time it will take to restore the team to a position to challenge for honours.)
Wingless
“We don’t play with wingers” said Roy Hodgson, and he’d know. But with only one attacking full-back – who himself seems unsure of overlapping as confidently as in the past – it makes for very one-dimensional football; especially with two holding midfielders sometimes deployed (the point of which is to allow full-backs to become quasi-wingers).
At home to Sunderland last season, Liverpool fielded eight players who could be considered ‘attacking’ (at least in relation to where they were deployed on the pitch). There were three progressive players in defence, three in midfield and two in attack. This meant fluidity could be achieved by interchanging positions. Sunderland were well-and-truly battered.
(The only player who was not exceptionally attack-minded for his position in which he played on the pitch was Maxi, but he’s still a one-in-three goalscorer throughout his career, and a clever player.)
This was Benítez’s usual tactic at home to teams who were not part of the elite: Gerrard in midfield, Kuyt off Torres, and players like Benayoun and Riera on the wings if not Babel and Maxi.
Look at Roy’s team for the same fixture, and it’s easy to see why Sunderland were the better side; from being hammered, they were now the more aggressive attackers, all in the space of six months. (I know it’s not entirely fair to compare two games when the circumstances will always be different, but it’s indicative of a more general trend.)
From eight ‘comfortable’ attacking players, it was down to just five.
By choosing Skrtel over Agger for such games, Hodgson was instantly removing one of his best technical players. Skrtel is fine enough on the ball; but he’s no Agger.
Konchesky is a decent all-rounder, but Insua was one of the top assist-makers from full-back in the Premier League last season. You could question his defending, but going forward he could deliver quality (watch the Wolves game at Anfield), and was often looking to beat his man with a dribble or one-two. So from three really comfortable possession players at the back, it’s now down to just Johnson.
The loss of Mascherano obviously makes things harder for Roy; but so far, Poulsen doesn’t look in the same league, let alone a half-decent replacement. At 30, he’s not got time on his side, either. He’s decent, but a plodder.
But Meireles – who many expected to replace Mascherano – is an interesting one. He’s certainly not a purely negative player out on the right flank – he has ability on the ball – but he’s not used to attacking in such a role. He looks a good player, and potentially a very good one, but not one whose play suggests right midfield is somewhere he’s natural and comfortable. (I may be proved wrong on this, as I can only go on what I’ve seen so far.)
The way the team is set up exacerbates these issues. In the past, the high-pressing would enable Gerrard, Torres and Kuyt to swarm around midfielders and defenders, forcing mistakes and taking their chances in ‘breakaways’ that take place close to the opposition goal. It can be tiring for players (hence rotation), but it gives a bit of oomph to the play. Teams as good as Real Madrid were left shellshocked.
Even Fulham under Mark Hughes are now pressing higher up (according to Danny Murphy) and playing better football (as mentioned by Diomansy Kamara and a couple of others). Kudos must go to Hughes’ predecessor for setting up that platform, but it was one built on low-scoring matches and a lot of drawn games. (Much like Roy’s time at Blackburn and Inter Milan.)
Roy prefers the more Houllieresque (Allen Wade) approach of men behind the ball in two banks of four, sitting off from the opposition. In theory, you keep your shape and are hard to break down – although any kind of cross into our box right now seems akin to a fox lobbed into a chicken pen.
In terms of Liverpool’s play, this either leads to direct balls to the striker/s, or possession in deeper areas: where the passing may look pretty, but where it’s easier to indulge in, due to the fact that opposition aren’t too worried. When the defence isn’t ‘hoofing’, there’s been some nice football on the deck; but unfortunately, it’s not been going anywhere (bar one really nice move versus Utrecht).
An absolute lack of clinical passing in the final third has rendered the Reds largely impotent. Joe Cole and Steven Gerrard should be able to deliver on this front, but for some reason it’s not happening.
Torres cuts a lonely figure; there’s just no quality service into him. Granted he’s not at his sharpest, but it usually only takes a couple of rusty games to get back amongst the goals in a Liverpool shirt.
Sitting Off
By sitting off teams, the Reds are allowing the opposition defences to gang up on him; without hassling them in return, they are in their comfort zones.
And by sitting off, we are inviting teams to come and have a go at us. We are playing like the away team at home. Looking at the Guardian chalkboards, our performance last Saturday looked more like the one put in at the Stadium of Light against the same opponents than the one at Anfield.
In some ways it’s impossible to believe that we would be set up in exactly the same fashion as Fulham were, whose primary aim was to avoid defeat. But right now, it appears that way.
All my doubts about Roy – expressed at the outset – remain; I expected to see one or two – and hopefully three or four – erased by now. (Or at least partially addressed.)
He’s a good man, but by this stage of the tenures of every previous Liverpool manager I can recall we’d had at least something to latch onto. The players currently look no happier than last season, and now far more clueless to boot. Yes, it may take three to six months to get the side playing exactly how he wants, but at least some signs of progression are normally par for the course.
I retain the fear that he is a good manager at clubs where expectations are lower (in itself a difficult task in many ways), but one without the progressive ideas to take a big club forward. They are very different types of job, requiring different skill-sets. It seems that he was appointed because he was the kind of man the suits would get along with, with no thought to the tactical side of the game taken into consideration.
He was also appointed to go down the ‘safer’ English route. I said it in the summer, but would Arsenal have done the same had Arsene Wenger failed to qualify for the Champions League a few seasons back (when only a stomach upset denied Spurs)? If Wenger retired now, it would be unthinkable for them to appoint someone like Hodgson. The club just isn’t set up that way.
Things like Pepe Reina being asked to change his goalkeeping ‘to a more English style’ concern me. Why change what is so clearly not broken? (And of course, it’s not like Spanish goalkeepers – with Spanish coaching – are the best in the world right now… Oops.)
It’s now up to Roy to go on and prove that he has what it takes. I’ll happily start doling out the credit, if it’s due. I really thought we’d turned a corner five minutes into the Sunderland game, with a disallowed goal followed quickly by a legitimate one (in the ref’s eyes). We were seeing both good football and good fortune. I was looking forward to feeling positive again. But it quickly evanesced.
There should be no calls for Roy’s head – I find that unacceptable at this stage – but equally, he has to show that he’s up to what is a really difficult job (even without the ownership farce), and face up to criticism such as this. He has to get his team playing better. That’s his job. Some poor performances are to be expected in times of uncertainty, but not week after week.
I will continue to stave off all claims that he should be replaced forthwith, but in reply, he needs to give us something to work with. In return for time and patience, we need an idea of where we are going. There may no longer be a good enough collection of players to dream of the top four (let alone top two), but there is enough quality and experience to be in the top six (which is why last season was a case of under-achievement). This run of ‘easier’ games is his chance to show that he can get things right sooner rather than later.
But to date there seems very little connection between Roy and the fans, and that’s strange. Even those who’d have taken Harold Shipman and his box of needles over Rafa seem unable to ‘bond’ with the new man. Yet no one thinks he’s a bad bloke in the slightest; avuncular Roy. Strange. It just feels more like an arranged marriage right now, than one of love.
Finally, the following is from a Fulham season ticket holder, and was written in the summer. I thought it was worthy of a wider audience, given how it matches up with what we’ve seen so far.
On substitutions:
He’ll make few substitutions, those he does will come late in the game and be mechanical. For example at Fulham he’ll take off Danny Murphy on 75 mins, every game. His philosophy is essentially one of Plan A, Plan A, Plan A. He’s worked on a plan with his team (no really, he has) and he’ll see it through on the basis that it is just a question of keep on working at it and it will work eventually. He is not short on believing in his convictions.
On selections:
He believes in having a first 11. He will work out who it is and then stick with it, week in week out. Others will play in the Europa League and the cups [now labeled his Liverpool ‘B team’]. Don’t expect to see him at the Academy too often, just not his thing.
On formation / tactics:
He’ll get his team to sit back in two banks of four, very narrow and basically say to the opposition, “go on play through us”. It had some success against teams like Arsenal. When you win the ball back, first option will be a ball to the striker and let him hold it up. Wide midfielders will often play on the side opposite their best foot to cut in (like Damien Duff at Fulham) and the fullbacks will have to provide any width. You’ll find it frustrating to watch as they won’t press, and as a fan it is very hard to get into the game when there is limited energy in attack or defence.
At Fulham the fans get into it because their expectations are lower and they have more games against what they see as better teams, and anything from the games is a victory of some sorts they can support. I think you’ll find it tougher to hang on to that at Anfield.
Comment
-
Are we winning?Comment
-
-
DunnoOriginally posted by NigelLG View PostBob Paisley - "This club has been my life. I'd go out and sweep the street and be proud to do it for Liverpool if they asked me to."Comment
-
How I laughed when Sven threw his hat into the ring but with hindsight, he'd do a much better job. If you removed the names and just compared CVs, Sven pisses all over Hodgson. How did we end up with such a mediocre manager? It must have been Hicks sadistic way of gaining revenge for the trouble we have caused.Originally posted by The_weatherman View PostComment
-
Pretty much sums up how we've been playing all season. The worrying thing is that everybody who's mentioned his methods says he fervently believes in them and will stick to them stubbornly. Things aren't going to get any better any time soon.Originally posted by PoolG View Post
I think he's decide on our best XI and im not liking the look of it.
Can't believe i'm saying this but if we don't get rid of him soon we'll be in a 'Himalayas' worth of **** rather than just the current mountain of it.
SACK him now and quick.'Religion is killing each other over who has the best imaginary friend'Comment
-
Originally posted by Ben_Itez View Post
almost wanting us to lose tomorrow. A win puts us into mid table mediocrity.....where we wills tay under hodgson all season.
We need to lose the next 2/3 games and he will be gone._____________________________________
Weak willed, Wank or do they have a masterplan?
Think we have the answer..Slot!!
Comment
-
****in hell. Evidence, both past and present, is seriously mounting up against Roy. That bit about how mad it would seem if Arsenal appointed him really hits home. And what the **** is that about Pepe being asked to be a more "English" type keeper!
I think I'm going mad at the moment. I wanted Rafa to go. Now I think I want him back sort of and I'm beginning to think I want another LFC manager sacked 6 games into the season! Horrible times.Felching ≠ GerbillingComment
-
I know Tomkins mentioned it in his article, but where the hell has that come from about Pepe being asked to change his style to a more English keeper? If it's true it's appalling, but where has it come from??Thanks very much for being ‘This Mornings’ Farmer’Comment
Comment