Spurs Away thread

[spud_gun]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/66976232

'Darren England has been replaced as the fourth official for Sunday's Premier League game between Nottingham Forest and Brentford after his error as the video assistant referee during Liverpool's defeat at Tottenham.

England failed to overturn an incorrect decision on the pitch to disallow a Luis Diaz goal for offside as the Reds were beaten 2-1 on Saturday.

Dan Cook was assistant VAR for the game and he has been replaced as assistant referee for the game between Fulham and Chelsea on Monday.'

That'll show them

[ChesterDave]

Paid holiday. Nice work if you can get it

[Exiled_red]

Couldn’t even type yesterday I was so fuming. From the first red card decision, Hooper completely lost control of the game. He lurched from error to error with every decision. There is literally no excuse for the ‘alleged’ (which is bull****) miscommunication between ref and VAR… how can all this super technology hang on the incompetence of two individuals… that just doesn’t make sense to have single points of failure like this.

Yellow cards galore some valid, some not. The sheer incompetence and inconsistency week in week out is what really grinds my gears. How can we see VVD sent off for the exact same tackle as VDV on Gomez. Salah blown up for a foul when Spurs defender lost control of the ball in his own box, Jota booked for a Spurs player tripping himself up, Then getting a churlish second. What the **** is the refereeing quality this season, it’s worse than at any point… and PGMOL is led by such a massive whopper in Webb that all credibility and accountability is done. And the icing on the cake, players or managers can’t question or criticise decisions or they get banned or fined. I mean, what the actual **** is this **** these days…

Absolutely fuming and still livid about everything yesterday… unbelievable.

I don't think that the incidents were that similar, VVD kicks through the man to get the ball outside the penalty area, and in doing so is deemed to have denied a goalscoring opportunity. The Gomez one the Spurs player doesn't get the ball and does get Gomez, the incident is in the penalty area so if a pen is awarded it isn't a red card because of the double jeopardy rule, but also he probably wasn't denying a goalscoring opportunity because of where Gomez was on the pitch. That said IMO it was a foul and should be a penalty (a soft one almost certainly, but that's not the point). I don't think VAR looked at it did they? IMO the club should be asking why not... (potentially more evidence of VAR not doing their job properly) But IMO that was a pen and it's the referee's discretion as to whether it is a yellow or not, but no way is it a red.

We can be angry about the lack of award of a pen or VAR not looking at that, and a whole other host of decisions that were wrong/questionable, a couple of which you mention but I don't think this incident is close to the VVD one.

[BG1973]

You're wrong, the Spurs player manipulated the ball at the last second and Jones' foot then rolls over the top and it makes contact. No way there's intent and no way it's reckless and out of control.

You can see his foot is at ball height until it's moved and his momentum takes his foot over and to the side. The initial movement is to side foot it, not studs up. A yellow is fair but not a red.

https://dubz.co/c/96147c

100%.

To those why say it's a red just tell me what was Jones supposed to do. Don't go for the ball?

What about aerial collisions that result in no cards for anyone, we agree those are accidental with no intent. Should they be finding someone responsible and booking/dismissing? Or ban aerial challenges?

No because aerial challenges are part of the game, as are those on the deck.

Bull****.

[Exiled_red]

Absolutely.

Throw the ****ing book at them and send every top QC getting the game replayed.

Theres decisions going against you and then there's THIS. Its farcical. **** happens in most games, missed pens, missed reds, iffy offsides etc. This was a goal, that the VAR thought was a goal and for whatever ****ing reason was just not given on field. That categorically should not ****ing happen. Then you add everything else that sweaty little bald cunt missed/or gave against us and you cant possible convince me they don't have an agenda against us.

Im livid. Ive never been so ****ing angry after a game of football. To the point where im genuinely asking myself why bother. We're constantly on the receiving end of this incompetence, the club do nothing about it and why put myself through it any more. We've lost leagues by 1 point twice because of bogus decisions before and it feels like this is going to burn all the way to the end of the season now.

Club needs to grow some balls, lawyer up and go for the ****ing throat of these cunts.

I don't like people bringing lawyers etc into sport, I don't like alot of the decisions that are made, but in the most part I can accept that they were made by referees who have a difficult job, or most of the time by following the due process, again I often don't agree with the process but can see how even some of the stupid decisions were made within the rules. I do have big issues with the decisions that PGMOL have to come out an apologise for, they are probably only about 1-2% of decisions. Especially when they prove costly or decisive in determining the main outcomes of the season. Thinking the last min pen that Everton should have had vs City, then City winning the league by a point amongst others, those can't be right (I don't have a solution, but it is a big problem). But this is beyond that type of mistake, it is them failing to follow procedure and is nothing short of negligence by the VAR officials.

[Exiled_red]

100%.

To those why say it's a red just tell me what was Jones supposed to do. Don't go for the ball?

What about aerial collisions that result in no cards for anyone, we agree those are accidental with no intent. Should they be finding someone responsible and booking/dismissing? Or ban aerial challenges?

No because aerial challenges are part of the game, as are those on the deck.

Bull****.

My issue with the Jones decision is how VAR chose to handle the calling the ref over to the monitor. Showing the still on the screen as he walks over is very manipulative, I honestly think the ref has made his mind up to change the decision before he has even got to the monitor znd seen the video because of that. IMO there is no way that wasn't deliberate, I have seen or at least paid attention to what has been displayed on the screen for other VAR decisions, perhaps because of where screens are located in other grounds or maybe because I haven't paid enough attention, but it doesn't seem right to do that.

My understanding was that the ref going over was supposed to be somewhat objective, yes the VAR official probably thinks you have got it wrong so it is likely to be overturned, but showing a still image that appears to show that you have got the decision wrong for the world to see puts the referee in a difficult position and can only make one decision from that point.

I think he looked at the video once in slow motion, but am convinced that he was just going through the motions at that point and had made his decision from the still before he got there.

I think it was harsh, as you say I don't see what he could do, I don't like or agree with the decision (neither seemingly do the former pros which is usually quite telling). But for me the process stinks too, and that for me is a bigger issue.

[Exiled_red]

[ame="https://twitter.com/paul_tomkins/status/1708165279681773750"]https://twitter.com/paul_tomkins/status/1708165279681773750[/ame]

[Fosterbloke]

What has not been mentioned also is that the initial spurs players drags jones arm & he is then slightly off balance; small margins like that affect the whole play

That's a great point, again that wouldn't be seen in that freeze frame.

[BG1973]

To the freeze frame. Yes and that's the first thing I said in this thread.

It felt rigged. Love to hear an explanation for that as well.

[Fosterbloke]

To the freeze frame. Yes and that's the first thing I said in this thread.

It felt rigged. Love to hear an explanation for that as well.

I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw him jogging towards that image.

Surely the correct thing should be to see the previous 10 seconds and let the incident play out with the VAR team explaining their decision - like a director's commentary on a movie.

The PL have billions at their disposal yet this is the standard we accept? **** that.

[Exiled_red]

To the freeze frame. Yes and that's the first thing I said in this thread.

It felt rigged. Love to hear an explanation for that as well.

As I said in my post earlier, It’s very manipulative and I honestly believe he had made the decision before he got to the monitor because of it. Also the fact that half the crowd and the TV audience can see that makes inputs the ref in a position where he has to overturn.

Is it common practice to do this? I haven't noticed it being done before...

[Exiled_red]

As people have been implying

[ame="https://twitter.com/TimD2704/status/1708246601888649230"]https://twitter.com/TimD2704/status/1708246601888649230[/ame]

[S-RED]

I said from day one, VAR is flawed until they have a completley separate group of officials, specfically trained for VAR & not current refs that cannot see a foul from 5 yards in real time on the pitch. It would have taken them 6 months to train a VAR team(s) & not rely on Simon's mate Darren to do it; Halsey called it out years ago, as did clatenburg; then this season Dean has admitted not doing something to save his mate............

Its a closed shop & deeply deeply flawed.

[Mark79]

The mainstream media highlighting this too now

[ame]https://twitter.com/timessport/status/1708444607191662925[/ame]

[RichC]

Certainly seeing this calls into question the decision making at the top to have allowed this.

Webb at the very least should be under some serious pressure to answer questions on this