Georginio Wijnaldum

[Assassin]

Not sure that is true considering he was one of the nominated players for the Balon D'Or so the wider footballing world appreciate him. Unfortunately, the underappreciatios stems from his own fans who get frustrated that he doesn't play like he does with the Netherlands failing to understand that he is carrying out Klopp's instructions perfectly.

You're correct with the above. I forgot to mention within our fan base in my post

[baitman]

He has his poor moments where he has drifted in and out of games.
He is on a high and long may it continue, but dont let that convince you he has also had plenty of poor games.
You need some balance, cant just wear those rose tinted specs.

[Maxiedge]

Lecter still doesn’t rate him

[Assassin]

He has his poor moments where he has drifted in and out of games.
He is on a high and long may it continue, but dont let that convince you he has also had plenty of poor games.
You need some balance, cant just wear those rose tinted specs.

All players have "poor moments" regardless. Even Messi has some shockers. How's your picks in your "talent scouting thread" doing? It should be renamed the "poor moments" thread

[baitman]

All players have "poor moments" regardless. Even Messi has some shockers. How's your picks in your "talent scouting thread" doing? It should be renamed the "poor moments" thread

Brilliant

[Angryred]

Love him, absolutely superb even when he's ****!

[memzey]

He’s been very good, great at times, for over a year now but please, let’s not whitewash the past. For much of his first season and a half he was fairly anonymous and his play often lacked meaningful impact. Acknowledging his past deficiencies does not prevent us from acknowledging his current value.

[dom9]

Save for a few bits of occasionally dodgy finishing, he's been nigh on perfect for the last 3 years.

Before that? I neither remember nor care tbh.

[RedReet]

He’s been very good, great at times, for over a year now but please, let’s not whitewash the past. For much of his first season and a half he was fairly anonymous and his play often lacked meaningful impact. Acknowledging his past deficiencies does not prevent us from acknowledging his current value.

So what's he doing different now for you, bar the fact the rest of the side are performing better?

[memzey]

That’s a good question and akin to one I was asking myself earlier; has Gini’s redemption been due to a change in his own game or has our pattern of play evolved into one that allows him to better evidence his quality? I think it might be a bit of both. Either way he is definitely a better contributor to our team now than he was during his first 18 months or so with us, especially with regard to his performances away from home during that time.

[baitman]

That’s a good question and akin to one I was asking myself earlier; has Gini’s redemption been due to a change in his own game or has our pattern of play evolved into one that allows him to better evidence his quality? I think it might be a bit of both. Either way he is definitely a better contributor to our team now than he was during his first 18 months or so with us, especially with regard to his performances away from home during that time.

[Corndog]

He’s been very good, great at times, for over a year now but please, let’s not whitewash the past. For much of his first season and a half he was fairly anonymous and his play often lacked meaningful impact. Acknowledging his past deficiencies does not prevent us from acknowledging his current value.

I really mean no offence when I say this but that's utter rubbish.

It all depends on how you evaluate success but in his first season at LFC he had a return of 6 goals and 11 assists. The best of all his seasons albeit likely because in years after this he was given a less attacking role.

See the numbers for yourself here:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/georgi...s=&trainer_id=

[Mark79]

Gini’s been a top performer for us since he arrived. I know he has those off games where he doesn’t seem to touch the ball, but to suggest he’s only really started contributing in the past 18 months is massively inaccurate.

[Kenneth]

True, he's been inconsistent at times. Newcastle fans used to say that he only turned up in home games, and I think I recall something in a similar vein said on here about him in his first season.

[memzey]

I really mean no offence when I say this but that's utter rubbish.

It all depends on how you evaluate success but in his first season at LFC he had a return of 6 goals and 11 assists. The best of all his seasons albeit likely because in years after this he was given a less attacking role.

See the numbers for yourself here:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/georgi...s=&trainer_id=

No offence taken at all. Thank you for contributing to the debate.

The numbers you quote don’t tell the whole story in my opinion. I’d say it’s misleading to imply that they do. If that were the case then your position would be that Gini is playing worse now than he was in earlier seasons, which I’m assuming is not what you are trying to say at all. I couldn’t get that site to work for me but instinctively I’d suggest that the shape and nature of his contributions have changed over the course of his time with us, with an increased demonstration of how he supports our forward play from a deeper position and most noticeably, his contributions when we don’t have the ball being much, much better than before.

As this thread has progressed I feel like my thinking on Gini’s improvement is coming together somewhat (a real benefit of robust, honest debate). His game for us has evolved by being less of the player he was at Newcastle and still is, to some extent, for the Netherlands. That player is indeed, best measured by counting the assists and goals (wasn’t he Newcastle’s highest scorer before we bought him?) whereas our current Gini brings a much more nuanced and well rounded set of benefits to our midfield, which make him so important to our pattern of play.

As a connected point; I’m not entirely sure what the best metrics to measure his performances are at the moment nor whether they are even readily available. This might be why it has taken a while to pin down the type of midfielder he is. Do they count passes leading to assists or chances being created? Pressing movements/actions? Recoveries of possession? To my mind these are some of the things that he is doing well now but did not do so well in the past. Either way he is certainly worth his place in this table topping team but was less of a central contributor to the teams that finished outside of the top two in Klopp’s first and second seasons (to my mind at least).