Boxing

[Assassin]

Four or five years ago I would be nodding my head to what you said, but Pac has slowed a hell of a lot, and his pressure fighting is now in bursts rather than a series of intense waves of attacks.

Since he and Alex Ariza stopped working together there has been a massive drop off in speed, and power. His muscle mass has also changed dramatically since he stopped taking those special "smoothies".

Pac of up to 2009 or so would have eaten the current version of Khan alive, but a current Khan vs a clean current Pac is not a foregone conclusion imho.

Khan has the size, reach, and power to beat Pac. The big question about Khan against Pac would be mental not physical. Can he stay focused, and can he stick to a smart game plan? If he can do that and not show too much respect to Pac, then I think he can win.


On the other hand if he shows too much respect and stands off of Pac, then Pac would grow into the fight very quickly and be able to pick off Khan.


Right now though I would favour Khan, and cannot see that changing between now and the potential ringwalk if Khan has a proper training camp and the right fight prep.


The guy I would love to see Khan in with though is Danny Garcia as that is a fight that would answer a lot of questions about Khan and about how much he has or has not improved since they met in 2012.

Matthysse is another I would like to see in with Khan, but like Garcia I suspect he may be too "live" a fighter for Khan to want in with.

Well thought out and written fella. My instinct still goes with Paccy as I really do not rate Khan. But then again its just my thoughts

[Doc_Piptorious]

Well thought out and written fella. My instinct still goes with Paccy as I really do not rate Khan. But then again its just my thoughts

To be fair there are plenty of good arguments that could be made as to how Pac would beat Khan.


His experience in top level and high profile fights.

His experience of fight as both the underdog and as the favourite.

His experience of fighting bigger men and of coming through tough fights.

His somewhat underrated technical abilities.


But for me two things are against Pac. His age and a lack of alleged chemical enhancement.

Since the "special" health cocktails (and it was confirmed by Freddie Roach that Pac was taking whatever Ariza was giving him) stopped we have seen a pretty substantial drop in muscle mass in Pac. We have seen his energy levels drop, we have seen his power seemingly drop dramatically, and we seem to have seen his stamina drop off very quickly.

Those drop offs combined with the natural aging process are why I am of the thinking that Khan would be timing things just right to go after Pac.

Pac could well win, and it is not as though he has suddenly forgotten how to box and he has not forgotten how to fight. But, and it is a but that depends upon Khan being properly focused and being capable to pressing Pac, there has been enough shown by Pac over his past nine or ten fights to suggest that he now has enough weaknesses for Khan to take advantage off.


I'm not a fan of Khan in the slightest and have been quite critical of him in this thread, but he really should have all the tools at this point of his career to be able to beat a faded Pac (I think Pac is even more shop worn than his last loss made him look. My suspicion is that if Mayweather truly went through the gears he would have an early night whereas the allegedly enhanced Pac of circa 2006 to 2009 would have been a 50/50 shot against Maywether jr from the same period imo ).

[Gibbo]

Looks like it May well be Khan for Manny now after Postol winning

[Mike]

I really like Khan but wish he'd shut up for five minutes about Mayweather/Pacquiao. He talks about those two more than he talks about himself!

Surprised Danny Garcia isn't linked with more big fights considering his record; FWIW I think Khan would get the better of him in a rematch but can't see it ever happening.

[RichC]

I think Khan/Garcia rematch would be intriguing however I don't think Khan will want to go anywhere near him always that one clean hit from being over again.

[Doc_Piptorious]

I really like Khan but wish he'd shut up for five minutes about Mayweather/Pacquiao. He talks about those two more than he talks about himself!

Surprised Danny Garcia isn't linked with more big fights considering his record; FWIW I think Khan would get the better of him in a rematch but can't see it ever happening.

Think the risk versus reward ratio comes into play for the cash cows of the division when it comes to Garcia.

He is not glamorous enough a name to bring a massive payday, but he is good enough to bring a very real threat of a loss.

He has certainly not been shy in taking pretty much the best in the welter and light welter divisions though, and, whilst a couple of his wins have been a touch fortunate imo, he has more than proven himself as a high end performer.


There is talk of Postol moving up to fight him (Postol now being on the back of an impressive KO win over the hard hitting Matthysse), and that could be a right tough fight if it comes about.


There are so many decent to very good light welters and welters there at present that it is a shame that most of them will not get a crack at the cash cows as the money boys are just trying to chase one another whilst ignoring where possible the likes of Matthysse, Garcia, Postol, Bradley (although to be fair he and Pac are 1-1 at present), Peterson etc etc.

Two of them have already beaten Khan but would wager that the casual boxing fan would not recognise their names at all.

What I do like about that crop and a few others slightly below them like Provodnikov, Rios, Chaves and the likes is that for the most part those names are pretty quick to go in against one another and it looks like Thurman is cut from the same cloth as well.

They may not all be world beaters, and many are good fighters rather than potentially top class, but nowt wrong with their hearts when it comes to seeking out and taking on the toughest challenges available to them.

[Doc_Piptorious]

I think Khan/Garcia rematch would be intriguing however I don't think Khan will want to go anywhere near him always that one clean hit from being over again.

Yep would have to agree. Garcia is not a concussive hitter but he can be very accurate and he is certainly a better all rounder now than he was when he knocked Khan out 3 years ago. He is also far more durable than Khan and well able to go punch for punch with bigger hitters than himself and come out the winner. His fight against Matthysse being an example of how he can mix it with a bigger puncher than himself.


Another guy I would have liked to have seen Khan go after is Peterson as he handed Khan a loss as well albeit nowhere near as clear cut a loss as the KO loss to Garcia.

Peterson has only three losses to his name (one of them being Garcia who seems to pop up on a lot of records as the giver of an L) and all were against pretty good fighters so would like to see Khan go back for some revenge but doubt if it will ever happen.

[Mike]

Agree with you there Jaco, often thought the reason Garcia doesn't get any big fights must be down to his lack of appeal. Didn't he have a fight in Cuba or something like that not too long ago? He was mentioning something on Twitter, and it looked like he was just trying to reach out and appeal to more people. He's too good a fighter not to be followed, but if you consider Rigondeux's fan base he's not doing so bad in comparison!

[Tee]

Let's not forget Peterson failed a drugs test after the Khan fight so that result shouldn't count. Garcia would be the ideal fight and I hope he sees sense to take it, assuming it's on offer.

[RichC]

Yup, not sure how the Peterson result was allowed to stand really, he failed a drugs test therefore at worst it should have surely been a no contest.

I hope Khan fancies getting back in with Garcia

[Doc_Piptorious]

Yup, not sure how the Peterson result was allowed to stand really, he failed a drugs test therefore at worst it should have surely been a no contest.

I hope Khan fancies getting back in with Garcia

The failing of the drug test came before the planned rematch not straight after the bout in which he beat Khan.

[RichC]

Ah ok that makes sense then.

[Doc_Piptorious]

Agree with you there Jaco, often thought the reason Garcia doesn't get any big fights must be down to his lack of appeal. Didn't he have a fight in Cuba or something like that not too long ago? He was mentioning something on Twitter, and it looked like he was just trying to reach out and appeal to more people. He's too good a fighter not to be followed, but if you consider Rigondeux's fan base he's not doing so bad in comparison!

The one thing it is not down to is ability.


Will be interesting to see who fights him and who does not from here on in now that he is going to stay at welterweight.

He has made it quite clear in his interviews that he wants Khan again, and that he wants Bradley, Pac. Mayweather, and Thurman. Not a bad list to be calling out and if Garcia's time at light welter is anything to go by I am pretty sure he would be quick to sign on against any of them.

Thought Garcia was very clever in how he tested the waters for a move up in weight. He had the two catchweight fights against decent opponents (Salka and Peterson), and then had his first fight at welter against a lower level but game fighter in Malignaggi.

Even if Khan continues to avoid Garcia, I would love to see Garcia go against Bradley and/or Thurman.


In particular Garcia vs Thurman would be a must watch for me.


Actually whilst on the topic of fighters whose profile lags far behind their talent, Thurman and Bradley would have to be up there as well when compared to the sort of media attention Khan gets.

[Doc_Piptorious]

Ah ok that makes sense then.

A pretty strong arguement was made at the time for how Peterson was receiving medical treatment and that the use of synthetic testosterone was part of this (think it was something to do with a form of muscular dystrophy).


What kind of backs this arguement is that since then Peterson has passed all tests and his in ring performances have not tailed off dramatically in the way that Pac's did when he stopped getting his "special" drinks.


Peterson has lost fights since that drug test but losses against a big hitter like Matthysse and also to Garcia are no disgrace and not exactly shock losses.

[Gibbo]

Was it TRT he was on Jaco?

Coming off that after fighters have been on it can cause a huge dip in performance. Can also make them more chinny too.

MMA has a few - TRT Belfort for example is a different animal to non TRT.