The Rugby Thread

[Cormack74]

To be fair Nev that was England's 3rd warm up game and there was a bit more intensity in their head to heads v Wales than in your mob's gentle opener against the Italians.

Also how many Irishmen thrive in 30 degree heat

So I don't think you need to press the panic button just yet.

From England's point of view, it shows what's possible with a fit Manu. All other things being equal, how far we progress in the WC is going to be closely linked to his fitness (or otherwise) IMO.

[Zapater]

To be fair Nev that was England's 3rd warm up game and there was a bit more intensity in their head to heads v Wales than in your mob's gentle opener against the Italians.

Also how many Irishmen thrive in 30 degree heat

So I don't think you need to press the panic button just yet.

From England's point of view, it shows what's possible with a fit Manu. All other things being equal, how far we progress in the WC is going to be closely linked to his fitness (or otherwise) IMO.

I was getting concerned for a few of them on the pitch. Several looked like their heads were going to explode. None of that trademark intensity of recent years.

[Irishnev]

I was getting concerned for a few of them on the pitch. Several looked like their heads were going to explode. None of that trademark intensity of recent years.

It’s not going to be cold in Japan come Sept - a number of our senior players are struggling

Best is 37 ffs - he needs binning
CJ looks way off
It hurts to say this but even POM is playing poorly
Massive reliance of Sexton and Murray who aren’t in great form
No creativity in the back line

We should get out of the pool - probably as winners but Scotland, Japan and Samoa will fancy their chances. NZ or ZA will wipe the floor with us

[Cormack74]

Bit of a B team put out by Wales, but still good to get an away win after last week Nev

[ChesterDave]

Apparently Wales down to 4th but a draw next week even if England win by 15+ points will see England drop to 4th and Wales move ahead of them. These rugby Rankings are madder than the FIFA ones!

[Zapater]

As with cricket, the rankings, they make no sense whatsoever, never have. Everyone's making a big deal out of the Wales, NZ and England... The Boks just won the Rugby Championship and went from 4th to 5th somehow. No one says anything, but god forbid NZ fall off top spot, there's a mutiny haha.

Pretty bleak about the Aphiwe Dyantyi doping scandal. 4 year suspension unless he can prove something drastic. Great player, but his career is almost done now. Oh well, he was injured for the WC anyway and there are other good wings in the country.

Damian Willemse, a very promising young fly half who can play at fullback too seems to be going to Saracens on a short term deal, I think it'll be a really good move for him and he'll return to the Stormers a stronger player. Think they'll love his expansive game and his stepping.

[Buzzo]

This try from Jake Polledri

Dream try for a flanker.

[ame]https://twitter.com/ymurugby/status/1167744026122104832[/ame]

[Irishnev]

Bit of a B team put out by Wales, but still good to get an away win after last week Nev

Bit of a B team put out by Ireland also - I think England will win the WC btw

[Cormack74]

This try from Jake Polledri

Dream try for a flanker.

https://twitter.com/ymurugby/status/1167744026122104832

Polledri is handy. I don't want to sound like some entitled English **** but really why on earth would he go and play for Italy when he would have walked into the England team if he'd waited a couple of seasons.

[Cormack74]

Bit of a B team put out by Ireland also - I think England will win the WC btw

Irony?

I'm equally sure they won't

[Irishnev]

Irony?

I'm equally sure they won't

NO - if they keep their main players fit they’ll overpower any team

[Buzzo]

NO - if they keep their main players fit they’ll overpower any team

I know what you are doing Nev

I'd have England to win against everyone but the All Blacks and South Africa.

If it came to a final I suspect both would have too much for England and the issues that have plagued them over the last few years will come home to roost (namely throwing away leading positions due to a lack of ability to manage in game).

I think if England progress, Eddie Jones will inadvertently eventually torpedo the entire campaign.

[Cormack74]

NO - if they keep their main players fit they’ll overpower any team

I know what you are doing Nev

I'd have England to win against everyone but the All Blacks and South Africa.

If it came to a final I suspect both would have too much for England and the issues that have plagued them over the last few years will come home to roost (namely throwing away leading positions due to a lack of ability to manage in game).

I think if England progress, Eddie Jones will inadvertently eventually torpedo the entire campaign.

Ok fair enough I'll take you at your word Nev

Do I think England have the players and potential to win the WC? Yes absolutely.

But as Buzzo said their game management needs to go up a notch - or a couple of notches. Actually I don't think it's necessarily game management, it seems more like complacency.

Anyway there's that issue but the bigger one for me is rampant indiscipline. And I think they've given themselves a problem over the past couple of years because they were so bad at giving away penalties for a while that when I watched a couple of games more recently (where generally their discipline was better) they lost the 50:50 calls because they seemed to have created a perception amongst referees that had them viewed as perennial transgressors.

One other thing - pretty much everyone wants to beat England more than any other team - either because they're oppressed Celts or traditional Antipodean rivals, Gallic types holding grudges or because England are "arrogant" etc etc

If key players like BV and MT stay fit then anything's possible but don't forget we didn't even make it out of the group last time with a seemingly more settled side - although the Burgess thing didn't help.

Actually I'd disagree with Buzzo about a final being too much. I'm doubtful we'd get there but in 2003 we won it in the Aussies back yard and in 2007 we performed brilliantly v the Saffers and were on the end of a couple of bad calls in a tight game even though they had hammered us in the pool.

And it's not as if the All Blacks haven't bottled WC games a few times when the going gets tough.

Yes of course I hope England do well but actually I think the teams are evenly matched and it's going to be a brilliant tournament so whatever the outcome of their matches I'm just hoping to enjoy the thing in its' entirety.

[Zapater]

Realistically the WC belongs to the All Blacks and it's their tournament to lose. Everyone else is horribly flawed. If Ireland play to potential they'll be second favourites but they've gone a bit off the boil. I'd give Wales, England and SA about even chances. All can beat any team on their day and have really good game breakers but can lose to anyone too. Don't expect Australia to win despite having a good squad on paper as always, semis would be good for them. France are also good on paper and could be a wildcard, they have been pretty awful lately, but they often rise to the occasion.

Not losing to Japan this WC would represent an improvement

One other thing - pretty much everyone wants to beat England more than any other team - either because they're oppressed Celts or traditional Antipodean rivals, Gallic types holding grudges or because England are "arrogant" etc etc

I wish this were still true in the colonies, but I don't think it is as prevalent to the current generations. I think this would be the breakdown of perceived biggest rivals

New Zealand: Australia and South Africa (particularly the former)
Australia: New Zealand
South Africa: Australia, although New Zealand for the younger generations - the older Afrikaans and black people definitely have a distaste for England although generally it's becoming irrelevant considering the Boer War ended around 120 years ago.

Aside from stealing our players, the latter point you bring up is probably why I hate England in every sport - the arrogance and entitlement. I'm not sure if it has anything to do with the players themselves. It's just that each time England win even one game they're world beaters in the media and we hear about it for the next 10 years. It becomes very tiring, very quickly. I acknowledge that they're vilified too, but I can't handle it either way.

[Buzzo]

You forgot to mention Scotland mate

The shear fear of us obviously to much to contemplate. On our day a match for anyone, that day tends to not happen away from Murrayfield which is a bit of an issue.

We had a great tournament 4 years ago so we shall see. I think we will be underestimated.

The squad has just been announced and there have been some big calls. Hard to believe Huw Jones hasn’t made it, though weaknesses in his defence and a drop off in his form have done for him. He’s class though so I hope he responds in the future. Duncan Taylor could be a huge game changer for us and it is great to see him back and I expect he and Sam Johnson to be our starting Centres.

Our starting centres 4 years ago (Matt Scott and Mark Bennett) are now at Edinburgh and we’re bever on consideration so amazing to see the strength and depth we now possess.