Hodgson - I dont know why I'm here; smint?

[PTP]

The thing is if we qualify then I think he is right that people will look back more favorably on the result.

Despite him having achieved previously undreamed of levels of tedium in an international I do think that is the wrong criticism. There has been a lot in the press about the fact that in the twitter era you need to be entertaining which I think is wrong - the aim is to win games. The problem is that Roy's tactics don't give us the opportunity to do that enough.

It is amusing to see the bleating of the journalists who were on Capello's case and often campaigned in favour of the Bodge.

i kinda agree that, on paper the result wasn't bad - 0-0 away from home, tough game in ukraine - but it was so ****ing dire it was untrue,

at least with Rafa/LFC when we went away in europe and did that - we did it well, we kept the ball, we worked hard, we looked organised and we also when the opportunity came, created chances and attacked.

there was none of that for england - it looked clueless, the only reason it was 0-0 was because Ukraine looked equally clueless and lacked a bit of quality going forward - had they had one or two half decent players to help out that lad who played left wing for them (no.10) then i reckon it would have been different

England didn't draw because of hodgson tactics, they drew because of a lack of quality by ukraine

the other worry was, and it happened all the time when he was here and i commented in the game quite early on about it - you could clearly see the set up wasn't working, something needed to change either shape/personal/way of playing because Ukraine we're slowly growing in confidence and England were retreating in to their shells - But hodgson has no ability to spot this and/or make changes to it.

[dww]

i kinda agree that, on paper the result wasn't bad - 0-0 away from home, tough game in ukraine - but it was so ****ing dire it was untrue,

at least with Rafa/LFC when we went away in europe and did that - we did it well, we kept the ball, we worked hard, we looked organised and we also when the opportunity came, created chances and attacked.

there was none of that for england - it looked clueless, the only reason it was 0-0 was because Ukraine looked equally clueless and lacked a bit of quality going forward - had they had one or two half decent players to help out that lad who played left wing for them (no.10) then i reckon it would have been different

England didn't draw because of hodgson tactics, they drew because of a lack of quality by ukraine

the other worry was, and it happened all the time when he was here and i commented in the game quite early on about it - you could clearly see the set up wasn't working, something needed to change either shape/personal/way of playing because Ukraine we're slowly growing in confidence and England were retreating in to their shells - But hodgson has no ability to spot this and/or make changes to it.

Completely agree with that - the difference between Hodson and even the likes of Hoddle is that when plan A fails then there isn't even minor tweaks that he will entertain in a game. Against the Ukraine either someone hit a great ball that released Walcott or we were never going to score.

Also it is well worth noting that Ukraine are a mediocre team. A draw is an okay but not actually good result if your aim is to top your group.

[Neil Young]

I agree eventual qualification would justify the approach to some extent but let's not fall for Hodgson's line that it's all that tough a place to get a point.

Ukraine are ranked 28th in the world - we're not talking about holding out for a goalless draw in Madrid or Berlin.

I though Daniel Taylor's article got it pretty much right.

[PTP]

i'm prob giving Ukraine a bit more credit tbh - i don't know much about them at all - other than i remember them having a reasonable side so i thought that they might be more of a challenge, especially as they were at home and wanting to win

i was surprised how **** they were

[Neil Young]

It's obviously not a bad result, especially given the circumstances in the group, but to play for it from the start shows an incredible lack of ambition.

They were a bit ****. But they were still much the better team!

[dww]

That article is pretty good. I just find the general tone of the coverage I have seen to be pretty wrong headed.

Hodgson is clearly a very limited manager, whose tactical rigidity and lack of imagination are exposed when managing either at a team tasked with winning most games in a decent league or international football.

There has been some talk in articles that Roy has progressed his methods by adopting formations other than 4-4-2. To me they miss the point entirely, his formations are always rigid and based around getting back into a rigid formation to block up space for the opposition. IMO the main reason so few players keep possession or create good attacking positions with their passing, against even mediocre opposition, for England is that none of the players are moving to receive the ball or create space. Which is actually part of Roy's masterplan.

[Shaggy]

That article is pretty good. I just find the general tone of the coverage I have seen to be pretty wrong headed.

Hodgson is clearly a very limited manager, whose tactical rigidity and lack of imagination are exposed when managing either at a team tasked with winning most games in a decent league or international football.

There has been some talk in articles that Roy has progressed his methods by adopting formations other than 4-4-2. To me they miss the point entirely, his formations are always rigid and based around getting back into a rigid formation to block up space for the opposition. IMO the main reason so few players keep possession or create good attacking positions with their passing, against even mediocre opposition, for England is that none of the players are moving to receive the ball or create space. Which is actually part of Roy's masterplan.

[Fredo]

That article is pretty good. I just find the general tone of the coverage I have seen to be pretty wrong headed.

Hodgson is clearly a very limited manager, whose tactical rigidity and lack of imagination are exposed when managing either at a team tasked with winning most games in a decent league or international football.

There has been some talk in articles that Roy has progressed his methods by adopting formations other than 4-4-2. To me they miss the point entirely, his formations are always rigid and based around getting back into a rigid formation to block up space for the opposition. IMO the main reason so few players keep possession or create good attacking positions with their passing, against even mediocre opposition, for England is that none of the players are moving to receive the ball or create space. Which is actually part of Roy's masterplan.

[Chris]

Loving this. He's completely snapped already, he's not even had a 20th of the grief Mclaren and Taylor got yet either!

So many comical lines, boasting about 4 points from 2 games v Ukraine and Moldova, saying the last two arent must wins as England could still get a play off place, he'd never heard of Jesse Lingard until this summer as he doesnt watch younguns football, he hoofed the ball against Ukraine to avoid pressure, the criticism of Gary Lineker for daring to have an opinion. Brilliant.

[PTP]

the article someone posted yesterday nailed it - hodgson's a good middle of the table, 50 points a season man - lower your expectations, won't lose many games but won't win many either.

[PTP]

Loving this. He's completely snapped already, he's not even had a 20th of the grief Mclaren and Taylor got yet either!

So many comical lines, boasting about 4 points from 2 games v Ukraine and Moldova, saying the last two arent must wins as England could still get a play off place, he'd never heard of Jesse Lingard until this summer as he doesnt watch younguns football, he hoofed the ball against Ukraine to avoid pressure, the criticism of Gary Lineker for daring to have an opinion. Brilliant.

it's mirroring what happened here, though just dragged out over a longer period because of the time between each international

he's short, snappy defensive answers are hilarious

having a pop at lineker was great haha

[Neil Young]

That article is pretty good. I just find the general tone of the coverage I have seen to be pretty wrong headed.

Hodgson is clearly a very limited manager, whose tactical rigidity and lack of imagination are exposed when managing either at a team tasked with winning most games in a decent league or international football.

There has been some talk in articles that Roy has progressed his methods by adopting formations other than 4-4-2. To me they miss the point entirely, his formations are always rigid and based around getting back into a rigid formation to block up space for the opposition. IMO the main reason so few players keep possession or create good attacking positions with their passing, against even mediocre opposition, for England is that none of the players are moving to receive the ball or create space. Which is actually part of Roy's masterplan.

I agree. To play better - i.e. try to win more games - under Hodgson would mean sacrificing the defensive scheme entirely. It's not that his teams don't do better, it's that they can't do better.

[Fredo]

It would be interesting to see what the FA will do if England does not qualify. It will show that they appointed the wrong man, even taking into consideration their 'long term' plan. Will they sack him (I imagine public uproar will be unbearable)? Or will they chug along with the line that it's a 'long term plan'?

In either case, it will be funny watching/reading/viewing.

[Chris]

it's mirroring what happened here, though just dragged out over a longer period because of the time between each international

he's short, snappy defensive answers are hilarious

having a pop at lineker was great haha

Bigtime, I still remember his Rijkaard tantrum because Rijkaard had the nerve to be linked with our club in a newspaper.

[wiw]

"It's a tight group, I can't deny that," Hodgson said. "We haven't been able to pull away but, luckily, none of the other teams have been able to pull away either.

"The fact is we've taken responsibility for two very important matches. Moldova, don't forget, lost only 2-1 in Ukraine and drew (the corresponding fixture) 0-0 in Moldova, so our 4-0 and 5-0 victories were maybe not quite as simple as some people want to make out.

Roy Hodgson in a nut shell