Hodgson - I dont know why I'm here; smint?

[PTP]

Not the case from my POV but international tournaments do get swamped by "the Ingerlund brigade", totally swamped. And maybe it's snobbish but all the people who don't give a **** about football suddenly walking around in England tops, filling the pubs with their painted faces etc. Grim.

I just prefer to enjoy the football of the other nations without the England charade, the endless bull**** on TV, and without their football stinking the place out. There is no way in my eyes tournaments are better for England's presence - it's markedly worse in my view.

i'm the same with other sports - i hate it when wimbledon's and people jump on it, i'm the same with golf having been a big golf and then i want to go the open and it's ****ing rammed with day trippers.

and yeah with the world cup a lot of people do go ott, personally i just ignore it - as i've said tho - we are quite lucky were we are, we don't get too much of it - there's a bit, not not so much to call it grim or stop me wanting to go the pub

[Shaggy]

I understand people not liking that whole side of it, but again, do you not think that happens in every other country? Cos I do. People seem to use it as a stick to beat England/England fans with though.

It's not doing it that's the problem, it's the way they do it. I was in Spain for their World Cup win and the atmosphere is completely different. It wasn't full of skinheaded, blind drunk, right wing hooligans for a start. We - I say 'we', I've got nothing to do with it - are boorish and obnoxious. In Spain the atmosphere was wonderful and cultured. Not here it ain't.

[Shaggy]

yeah i agree with most of this - i hate all those dickheads, people who take the three weeks off work and then move into their shed with a TV and their best mate and a world cup wall chart -

maybe I am are bit lucky where I live - we don't have many Inglurders' jumping on the band wagon - you get the odd few, but it doesn't take over the town, and our local is good for watching footy in - it's a massive pub, loads of tele's and although it gets busy and people get pissed in the 14 years i've been going there and seen big Liverpool and England matches it's always been a good atmosphere and enjoyable.

As i say maybe i am bit of hypocrite, but i don't care - i have no real passion for england, i'll be a hell of lot more upset if liverpool draw against swansea than i would be if england didn't qualify for the world cup - but if you see past all the bull****, avoid the media hype and ignore the gob****e stereotypical england fans, then yeah i get behind them - purely because even tho i love football and would watch every game regardless, it's more fun when you are 'supporting' someone.

Also - personally I would like to see England win a world cup in my lifetime and despite what you all say....there is no ****ing way if England were 3-0 in the final you'd just be sat at home not arsed and turn over to Coronation St at full time and just carry on as if nothing had happened

the feel good factor and celebrations would be great - i really don't give a **** about athletics, but i got a buzz watching the olympics, i'm not a big fan of tennis or andy murray, but i got behind him and enjoyed seeing him win.

I can't pretend the feelgood factor would be quite good, should England win it. But that's never going to happen and the good bits would be outweighed by all the sickening hyperbole.

[dom9]

I understand people not liking that whole side of it, but again, do you not think that happens in every other country? Cos I do. People seem to use it as a stick to beat England/England fans with though.

I do too, and it gets on my nerves also.

My parents are a good case in point. They would watch and fanatically cheer on the ten pin bowling if there was a Croatian playing it. That gets on my nerves, and it's my own family, supporting a different country to England.

If a premier league team are playing, my dad will support whichever one has a Croatian player playing.

I just really don't like nationalism. And that gets on my parents nerves too.

[PTP]

I only see England qualifying for a summer tournament as an excuse to drink in the daytime.

I detest Hodgson though, so I'm happy for him to spectacularly fail if it only means I lose an excuse to go on an all-day bender.

- Sun's shining, there is a bit of feel good factor, there's footy on - there will be good drinking sessions, all day bbq's everyone out and in a good mood - it's great

Also - i wouldn't be surprised if Hodgson got sacked by then - a **** couple of draws in the last few games meaning we scrape the qualifiers but there is uproar over our performances and hodgsons style - hodgson will be forced to step aside and a new manager will come in which will just give enough of lift to the players to scrape through to the final

[Shaggy]

They won't sack him, no way. England will scrape through, endure yet another dismal tournament - yawn - and he still won't be sacked.

[PTP]

It's not doing it that's the problem, it's the way they do it. I was in Spain for their World Cup win and the atmosphere is completely different. It wasn't full of skinheaded, blind drunk, right wing hooligans for a start. We - I say 'we', I've got nothing to do with it - are boorish and obnoxious. In Spain the atmosphere was wonderful and cultured. Not here it ain't.

well **** off to spain then

i do get you and i agree with you - but you can still "jump on the bandwagon", 'support' england without having to shave your head, paint your house, get a tattoo and have a fight - it's avoidable - plenty of people who are football fans, have a good time supporting england at a world without all that bull **** and when england lose can just carry on watching the football without being upset

with regards the hyperbole - yeah that's **** but the media as whole is **** nowadays and i ignore it as much as possible anyway

[RedProf]

It's not doing it that's the problem, it's the way they do it. I was in Spain for their World Cup win and the atmosphere is completely different. It wasn't full of skinheaded, blind drunk, right wing hooligans for a start. We - I say 'we', I've got nothing to do with it - are boorish and obnoxious. In Spain the atmosphere was wonderful and cultured. Not here it ain't.

See, I don't think it is to do with nations quite so much, just the type of people. Are there more Ingurland chavs that surface than Spanish equivalents? Very possibly.

But I watched a couple of the 2010 world cup games over in Alicante. The first one I sat in a Spanish bar with a lot of older Spaniards and it was a nice pleasant atmosphere. The next one I watched was in more of a 'pub' type place, and afterwards most of the Spanish young lads went outside, set off fireworks, and a mass brawl ensued where the police had to come along and sort it. And that was on a night they won (possible beat Portugal if I remember right).

I just think the problem is people. Get the wrong sort and it might kick off, or be subjected to ott patriotism.

[Roboklopp]

I agree with Shaggy. It's absolute ****e & much more fun sans-England.

[Kenneth]

It's not doing it that's the problem, it's the way they do it. I was in Spain for their World Cup win and the atmosphere is completely different. It wasn't full of skinheaded, blind drunk, right wing hooligans for a start. We - I say 'we', I've got nothing to do with it - are boorish and obnoxious. In Spain the atmosphere was wonderful and cultured. Not here it ain't.

With respect, I hardly think your experience of Spain winning while you were on holiday is necessarily a representative sample of 'the Spanish' and your skinhead description isn't represented of 'the English ' either. It's lazy stereotyping actually.

[PTP]

See, I don't think it is to do with nations quite so much, just the type of people. Are there more Ingurland chavs that surface than Spanish equivalents? Very possibly.

But I watched a couple of the 2010 world cup games over in Alicante. The first one I sat in a Spanish bar with a lot of older Spaniards and it was a nice pleasant atmosphere. The next one I watched was in more of a 'pub' type place, and afterwards most of the Spanish young lads went outside, set off fireworks, and a mass brawl ensued where the police had to come along and sort it. And that was on a night they won (possible beat Portugal if I remember right).

I just think the problem is people. Get the wrong sort and it might kick off, or be subjected to ott patriotism.

- with a bit of planning, the world cup can be great and you can support england and not get caught up in all that.

For example, i'd never go to a busy town centre or a city to watch it - your asking for it if you go The Walkabout or places like that.

Maybe i am lucky with my local - firstly its a big red pub - and most reds, like most of us on here, are not too fussed about England, so already we've eliminated that 'Ingurland' type of fan/mentality cause i'd say 90% of the people in there despise that...and the other 10% that think about going full on Ingerlund decide against it because they'd look like tits.

Also it's a good location, it's a pretty nice area and it's a little out the way, there is no other bars or pubs for about 1-2 miles - and i'd generalise a bit and say the 'ingurland' type fans like to watch it somewhere where there is a few bars/pubs all close by so they can bounce from pub toilet to pub toilet doing lines of coke looking for fights.


And then if you don't fancy that - there is always mates having bbq's - load of you pile into a mates house, drink, sun, food, footy - it's great.

[Fredo]

Agree with Shaggy all the way here. All the way. I quite liked the England team before coming here but I've come to hate them now. It's all so dull and to be honest, the nationalistic claptrap which comes with it (St. George flag etc) I do find offensive to be fair (as an outsider coming in).

[Shaggy]

well **** off to spain then

i do get you and i agree with you - but you can still "jump on the bandwagon", 'support' england without having to shave your head, paint your house, get a tattoo and have a fight - it's avoidable - plenty of people who are football fans, have a good time supporting england at a world without all that bull **** and when england lose can just carry on watching the football without being upset

with regards the hyperbole - yeah that's **** but the media as whole is **** nowadays and i ignore it as much as possible anyway

I'm not having a pop at anyone who enjoys it. Loads of my friends and family go down the pub and wave their flags. Just not for me.

With respect, I hardly think your experience of Spain winning while you were on holiday is necessarily a representative sample of 'the Spanish' and your skinhead description isn't represented of 'the English ' either. It's lazy stereotyping actually.

A bit, but I've seen way more than my fair share of mass brawls at England football 'occasions' - it is often the English way. We all know that. The pondlife come out to play and I'd really rather not get involved or be associated with all that bollocks. Sure it's not like that everywhere, obviously. But it is prevalent, I've seen it with my eyes.

[Rich]

As usual the minority spoil it for others.

Personally, we should, as a nation, we proud of our flag. We should see it more and we should all be a little bit nationalistic and have a pride in our country.

Unfortunately a lot of this stuff has been corrupted.

[Fredo]

Why would you be nationalistic about your country though? Your identity is personal surely, that is, what you've lived through and experiences in your life. Waving flags can be seen as aggressive depending of where you come from. Imagine waving a US flag in Iraq for instance. The St. George flag is synonymous with England's former all conquering colonial past.

That's why I can't be bothered with International football as a whole. I watch it, but minus all the jingoistic claptrap.