Kids ?

[Only1mboy]

The point is that none of our youth players are pushing the first teamers but the arsenal ones are.

[Woobus]

The point is that none of our youth players are pushing the first teamers but the arsenal ones are.

Easy answer is we have a far stronger first team than Arsenal, I am sure a lot of our youths would be pushing there first teamers as well.

[The_weatherman]

The thing is that in recent years Wenger hasn't really used it in this way. He seems now to feel (again) he has a group of players at the right stage of development to give the chance to. We are way behind their curve and to some degree we have to accept that it is a long term building process.

This is the whole point for me, Arsene has been fine tuning the youth setup for years. He has had 12 years to do it, Rafa only 4. This is long term project and one that won't work unless we give Rafa time, no other manager comes close to Wenger in this respect but he has also been longer in the job than most.

It will be exciting to see how the reserves progress over the next 3-4 years, I mention the reserves as they won the league but were also among the youngest teams in the league. Rafa's reserves is mostly based on young players, unlike Houlliers reserves for example. Just look at the team put out by Pompey, those games matter to the young players, gives them confidence and experience, it's not always poor standard.

[Craig_H]

Easy answer is we have a far stronger first team than Arsenal, I am sure a lot of our youths would be pushing there first teamers as well.

If our youngsters got the chance in the league cup, then maybe i'd agree but they dont even get to play in that. How do you know our youths would be good enough to push the Arsenal 1st teamers?

Furthermore, i wouldnt say arsenal's kids are 'pushing' their 1st teamers, they just play in the carling cup.

[cannotmakeit]

Typical one good game by another teams youth and out comes our "supporters" bitching, who gives a flying **** about the arsenal youth team? I mean really, why would you ****ing care about any other team but Liverpool?

[Craig_H]

Typical one good game by another teams youth and out comes our "supporters" bitching, who gives a flying **** about the arsenal youth team? I mean really, why would you ****ing care about any other team but Liverpool?

I think the crux of the issue is that people want to see OUR kids progressing too - hence, it is about caring about Liverpool.

Maybe not actually caring and not bothering is better 'support'.

[PTP]

Typical one good game by another teams youth and out comes our "supporters" bitching, who gives a flying **** about the arsenal youth team? I mean really, why would you ****ing care about any other team but Liverpool?

I don't htink people are bitching as such, some have different, sometimes ott opinions. - But it isn't just ONE good game - and it's nothing about caring for any other team - more that, as a football fan, i really enjoyed watching the game from a neutral persepective cause (as another poster posted further up said - dessy just found the post )

Slight digression but was it not just a joy to watch a young side entertain with some 'pure' football? Was it not just refreshing to see the hunger and passion from each and everyone of them to play the game as it was intended? No diving, cheating, moaning at Ref etc? They just got on with it and WANTED to play football and did play football.

now that pretty much nailed it on the head, and all i can see here is quite a few liverpool fans wishing they could say the same about our lads. It's not a negatvie thing, or slagging off the players or rafa - it's just how it is, at the moment wenger can play a complete young side, no first team squad members and they can play like they did last night -

I'm looking forward to watching tonight, like i'm always looking forawrd to watching any liverpool game - but i'd ****ing love to come on here tomorrow and talk about a performance by our ressies in same manner as Arsenals last night, will it happen tho prob not - thats not a negative thing, just that i can't see rafa playing (for arguements sake)

Martin

darby
hobbs
San jose
insua

el zhar
spearing
plessis
flynn

nemeth
pacheco


tonight - which is more or less what wenger did - i'd love to see that team get played and play well and thats what most peoples issues are - that type of team won't get picked cause either they aren't ready yet or aren't good enough.

[ukfootballfan101]

this is exactly why reserve medals or FA youth cups mean dick ****. If they learn how to play this certain way, win or loose then they can be given a chance in the first team. As wenger clearly wants the first team and the youth teams to play the same football. Thats what benitez wants as well it just takes time.

You are spot on there, reserve and youth cups mean nothing. Arsenal have every age group playing the same style of football from 5 years old (or what ever age they join) upwards, so a youth player can go into the first team and they have 5+ years experience playing that system.

You have missed the whole point of this thread though, as so many of you have....Rafa is not involved in the academy, he spends little time there, even with the management changes over the past 12 months he still doesn't like how its being run.

And if Rafa isn't involved how can we expect a youth team to do what Arsenal's do? How can they possibly learn Rafa's system of play if he has nothing to do with how they are coached?

Unless the academy management setup and Rafa's management team (Ablett, Pelingrino etc) are aligned and start working together we will never produce a youth team that are capable of delivering the team play we have seen from Arsenal. Politics and internal disputes are destroying the club.

[Mike]

Agree, Pellegrino should work with the ressies at times and get them playing Rafa's way.

[ukfootballfan101]

this is exactly why reserve medals or FA youth cups mean dick ****. If they learn how to play this certain way, win or loose then they can be given a chance in the first team. As wenger clearly wants the first team and the youth teams to play the same football. Thats what benitez wants as well it just takes time.

Agree, Pellegrino should work with the ressies at times and get them playing Rafa's way.

The reserves and the academy are two different things. Ablett and the reserve team are already under Rafa's control, It's the group below that he has no control over.

Some fans on other forums think Rafa has intentionally filled the reserve team with players, many of whom he doesn't think will make it, but they are filling up spaces so he doesn't have to promote a player from what in his eyes is Rick Parry's Academy, it sounds very childish, I'm in two minds about if I believe it or not, but with the quality (or lack of it) some players have it is a logical argument.

Btw, does anyone know who the reserves train with? I know they are based at Melwood, but do they train mainly as a group by themselves? I assume they do.

[Woobus]

If our youngsters got the chance in the league cup, then maybe i'd agree but they dont even get to play in that. How do you know our youths would be good enough to push the Arsenal 1st teamers?

Furthermore, i wouldnt say arsenal's kids are 'pushing' their 1st teamers, they just play in the carling cup.

Due to them being the better team last year and winning the league, but it really just my opinion and wouldnt be to sure about it as only seen the Arsenal kids a couple of times. As you say they have only played in the League Cup which even the lower league teams dont seem to take it to serious now.
I think they are pretty similar to us and have 3 to 4 players who should make it to there first team over time.

[Craig_H]

I'll be astonished if 3 or 4 of ours establish themselves as first teamers.

[Woobus]

I'll be astonished if 3 or 4 of ours establish themselves as first teamers.

Think San Jose, El Zhar, Plessis, Insua and Nemeth all have chances. Plessis wasnt the best at the start of the year but then was so the rest of the team. El Zhar has really impressed me in his few sub roles this season, really helped change a couple of games.
Think if Nemeth had of been fit he would have played a bit in the first team this season, hopefully he will get a few games later in the season.
A lot of the rest of the squad is still to young and hard to tell how at the minute.

[Exiled_red]

The problem for me is that we'll never know how good any of these players are until they get a few games in the first team and none of them are at the moment, according to the official site Spearing, Darby and Insua (who many would argue are some of the reserve players closest to the first team) have been at Melwood since 2007 and only Insua has made first team appearances yet, 6 in total (including sub apps), Plessis who joined later has also made 6 apps. Even El Zhar who made his debut back in 2006 has only made 12 appearances mostly as subs.

If we could at least put one youngster on the bench for must Premiership games and if we are 2 or more goals up stick them on for 20mins or so to give them experience, other teams manage it. If we don't give players a try we will never know if they'll make it or not

[cumbriankop]

The problem for me is that we'll never know how good any of these players are until they get a few games in the first team and none of them are at the moment, according to the official site Spearing, Darby and Insua (who many would argue are some of the reserve players closest to the first team) have been at Melwood since 2007 and only Insua has made first team appearances yet, 6 in total (including sub apps), Plessis who joined later has also made 6 apps. Even El Zhar who made his debut back in 2006 has only made 12 appearances mostly as subs.

If we could at least put one youngster on the bench for must Premiership games and if we are 2 or more goals up stick them on for 20mins or so to give them experience, other teams manage it. If we don't give players a try we will never know if they'll make it or not

my hope is that when we get in our flow this year and in some games when we get 2 up we WILL see this happen, but we can't risk momentum in the league nor would i want to

i am all in favour of the 7 subs rule and hope we use it to keep the reserves motivated as they see the MOTM or whatever get a bench slot on the following weekend as i think was mentioned in a previous thread