Rafa has taken us as far as he can.

[vlahka]

"It is not driving me crazy. I'm OK,'' said Benitez, whose team trails league leader United by two points. "The game (against Wigan) was crazy. We will see if the game on Sunday will be crazy, too.

"I am calm because I cannot control this craziness. Maybe it has to be crazy for years. I was talking to the players about how to stop the craziness but I do not know if we can.''

No, seriously. When will this crazyiness end? Its getting...crazy.

****ing...seriously... This guy is supposed to instill CONFIDENCE in our team? Crazy days indeed.

[wiw]

Are there more of us? Or are we the last?

Was gutted yesterday but it's still on..we're still going to win it imo. Can't be arsed going into why at the mo

[Joe Le Toff]

(Lurker de-cloaks for the first time in months...)

Not convinced about Moaning Maureeenio. His tactics and style of play during his last 18 months didn't exite me much. [B]]B]Good at grinding out results, mostly.

I think some perspective is needed about Rafa.

Forget comparisons with Ferguson et al and look at Bill Shankly's record - promotion from 2nd Div, Lge, Cup, Lge but then nothing for 7 years. And I don't remember cries of "Shankly must go!" in the late 60s and early 70s before the next title was won in 1973.

Rafa is 5 years into rebuilding and developing his team, on a budget that has been much below his rivals. As with all managers, some players brought in fail to perform, others can exceed expectations. But look where we are - competing in 3 competitions with the chance to win all three (still).

The time to consider if Rafa is the man to take us further will be after the end of the season, and after the ownership and finances have been sorted. Until then we need to back the team and believe. Istanbul 2005 holds a very pertinent lesson for us all.

(with hope in his heart, lurker re-cloaks and settles down to watch and listen for a while..)

Grinding out results consistently is what wins league titles

[Manofthebog]

I'm glad I stayed away from threads like this today.

Tis getting daft at the moment. The time to dissect the season is at the end, not at the end of January, when we're still slap bang in the middle of a title race.

Grow some balls, the lot of you.

If we finish outside of the top four this season, then you have my consent to slag away, but now?

Our fan base is getting worse.

No matter who our manager was, we would back him.
I can never remember this much hatred towards a manager who has steered our great club to where it is, today.

I must admit it, we are nearly as bad a Real Madrid.

[the rev leeroy brown]

I'm glad I stayed away from threads like this today.

Tis getting daft at the moment. The time to dissect the season is at the end, not at the end of January, when we're still slap bang in the middle of a title race.

Grow some balls, the lot of you.

If we finish outside of the top four this season, then you have my consent to slag away, but now?

Our fan base is getting worse.

No matter who our manager was, we would back him.
I can never remember this much hatred towards a manager who has steered our great club to where it is, today.

I must admit it, we are nearly as bad a Real Madrid.

Listen close so i don't have to repeat myself..........talking sense will not be tolerated here!!! U have been warned.

[kris90210]

Last night was very frustrating, but I dont think it signals that Rafa has taken us as far as he can.

We've struggled at times this season because the Summer transfer window was a shambles. Rafa identified the need for 2 attacking full backs, a left winger and a forward who can both score goals and link play. Of all of the signings only one has had any form of success (Riera - and he's dropped off recently). Rafa does have to take a lot of responsibility for the players we brought in over the Summer so thats a black mark against his name right there.

Rafa's transfer policy has always been somewhat hit and miss. But we know for a fact that he wanted to sign Alves, Villa and Berbatov before they became super-stars. Plus he's brought in Reina, Agger, Mascherano, Alonso and Torres who are all class. So he is capable of making inspired signings.

The frustrating thing is that we are so close. If, and its a big IF, the players we signed in the Summer had all come good then we would be well clear of Utd right now. Every manager has off transfer windows. Ferguson, Mourinho, Wenger.

My point is that Rafa knows what we need. He ****ed it up in the Summer. But as this is something that all the best managers do from time to time, I can forgive him that.

Some food for thought. Fergie and a load of the utd players have come out and said this is the best side they have worked with. Thats some statement if you think about it. Bearing that in mind, and bearing in mind that we are 3-4 players away from reaching our potential under Rafa, to be 2 points behind them is no mean feat. Especially when you consider our atrocious run of form.

In the build up to the season, most fans said that the wanted to be in with a chance for the title run in. Well, we're still in with a chance. If we beat Chelsea on the weekend it will put us back on track.

Lets stick by our manager. You'll never walk alone and all that.

p.s. I actually didnt think Lucas played that badly last night - the penalty apart!

[Manofthebog]

Listen close so i don't have to repeat myself..........talking sense will not be tolerated here!!! U have been warned.

me bad.

[mersey86]

I think the standard pattern of building a successful team is to get the defence right first then add the flair. Rafa has got the defence right years ago, but has not managed to add the pieces successfully. As has been wisely pointed out in this thread, that is partly due to our bureaucratic transfer management. If Rafa had got the players he wanted, maybe now we'd be on our way to our 3rd league title under his managment.
What is galling though is his failure to get the best out of what he does have.
There is a perceived obstinacy about him that has contributed to a failure to get the best from Babel and Keane (you could probably add Crouch to that list) and which leads him to pick lineups which can be bewildering to the average supporter. I do not want Rafa to leave, but like most I am very dissatisfied at the moment with the seemingly casual throwing away of our best chance in years (years past and quite possibly years ahead if finances don't get cleared up) of winning the trophy that every true Liverpudlian covets above all others.

[Manofthebog]

I think the standard pattern of building a successful team is to get the defence right first then add the flair. Rafa has got the defence right years ago, but has not managed to add the pieces successfully. As has been wisely pointed out in this thread, that is partly due to our bureaucratic transfer management. If Rafa had got the players he wanted, maybe now we'd be on our way to our 3rd league title under his managment.
What is galling though is his failure to get the best out of what he does have.
There is a perceived obstinacy about him that has contributed to a failure to get the best from Babel and Keane (you could probably add Crouch to that list) and which leads him to pick lineups which can be bewildering to the average supporter. I do not want Rafa to leave, but like most I am very dissatisfied at the moment with the seemingly casual throwing away of our best chance in years (years past and quite possibly years ahead if finances don't get cleared up) of winning the trophy that every true Liverpudlian covets above all others.

But with everything, it's a two-way street.

Whenever Babel, or Keane, have been given the chance, mostly, they have been cack.
Babel especially, I was hoping the lad would kick on this year, because he could be anything he wants, but too me, he doesn't seem to want it - it's as if he's been spending too much time with Pennant.

My only slight moan about Keane, was that when he did find form, and the net, Rafa dropped him.
But to that, I will say, that we are not on the training ground 24/7 with the players, like Rafa is, and he's the one who makes the call. Who knows what goes on week in, week out?

But I do agree, that if Rafa was given the proper amounts of money to spend on players, ala the Chavs, and Manure (before you start harping on about the fact that you think he has), we would have had the Vidic's and Ronaldo's of this world, not to mention the Dani Alves's, playing for us.

[Chrono]

But with everything, it's a two-way street.

Whenever Babel, or Keane, have been given the chance, mostly, they have been cack.
Babel especially, I was hoping the lad would kick on this year, because he could be anything he wants, but too me, he doesn't seem to want it - it's as if he's been spending too much time with Pennant.

My only slight moan about Keane, was that when he did find form, and the net, Rafa dropped him.
But to that, I will say, that we are not on the training ground 24/7 with the players, like Rafa is, and he's the one who makes the call. Who knows what goes on week in, week out?

But I do agree, that if Rafa was given the proper amounts of money to spend on players, ala the Chavs, and Manure (before you start harping on about the fact that you think he has), we would have had the Vidic's and Ronaldo's of this world, not to mention the Dani Alves's, playing for us.

So money is the issue?

[Tee]

And with the proper financial backing he would have brought in quality youngsters as well, such as Walcott.

Despite shaking my head in disbelief at some of his decisions I still believe he is the best man for this job. And I am sure that once we get out of this sticky patch we will be very very close to winning that title.

[Scratch]

Hmmmn, don't think this is true, but a mate of mine (well, my boss actually) just got a text saying the rumour is Rafa has gone...

...like i said, it's just a text my boss received and passed on, so it could be complete bollocks. Can't see it myself, not with contract negotiations ongoing, but i figured i'd pass it on.

[Manofthebog]

So money is the issue?

Part of it.

We can't compete with the Chavs or the Mancs, and that's the honest truth.
Would you disagree with that?

[bipjohn]

[QUOTE=Manofthebog;1264085]I'm glad I stayed away from threads like this today.

Tis getting daft at the moment. The time to dissect the season is at the end, not at the end of January, when we're still slap bang in the middle of a title race.

Grow some balls, the lot of you.

If we finish outside of the top four this season, then you have my consent to slag away, but now?

Our fan base is getting worse.

No matter who our manager was, we would back him.
I can never remember this much hatred towards a manager who has steered our great club to where it is, today.

I must admit it, we are nearly as bad a Real Madrid.[/QUOTE]

Spot on.

I was driving along today listening to the national debate about LFC and Rafa and countless people calling in telling Mike Parry (!!) about how bad we are and how much Rafa is losing it and how great Martin O neill is and how great Moyes is........

You know what I am bored, bored, bored of it.

Why does no-one question Wenger????????????? WHY WHY WHY does it seem to be always us...?

Its like Real Madrid, it really is.

Oh, before you say, I am dissapointed and concerned, but not hysterical.

[Chrono]

Part of it.

We can't compete with the Chavs or the Mancs, and that's the honest truth.
Would you disagree with that?

I think I probably would mate.

I look at our squad and it has some incredible talent running right through it and then I look at their squads and notice that it is their average players that make the difference. I wouldn't want Fletcher but the guy does a better job than a lot of our squad and Villa are looking strong with a squad that doesn't compare to ours at all. This to me points to the fact we don't get the most from our players and I think this is because Rafa trusts nobody but himself and regiments his players too much without letting them express themselves.

We do not get the most from our squad and yesterday I was amazed how often we were second to a ball we should have won yet we didn't compete in a mini-tournament in Tokyo.