Atmosphere at Anfield (cut from R.Madrid post-match thread)

[Pacman]

To be fair, I'm not sure that a reefered-up butchering of White Winter Hymnal was ever going to go down too well with the regulars.

[Vermilion]

Not read all the debate about the fans, or what started it, but Carra said today on RADIO...'Talk Spite' to be exact, when asked why we can beat Madrid twice but not Stoke etc, he said..

"Well, our own fans have asked that, but i could easily turn it round and say how come they can give us such an atmosphere on Big European nights..but not against teams like Stoke".

Not an exact quote, as it's from memory, but it's what Carra said. He went on to say that Big games seem to generally bring the best out of players.

My take on it is..that, no matter what players get paid, no matter how much they want to win every game, they are human beings first, and prone to the same human frailties as everyone else.....bucket loads of cash just means they are good football players, not super human emotionless robots able to quash their feelings & human traits on demand.

[Guest]

Now i've heard it all - when the team plays ****, it's the fans fault

They play a part, a big part Syd, a big part. Repeat ad nauseum.

[Craig_H]

They play a part, a big part Syd, a big part. Repeat ad nauseum.

Playing a big part and being at fault are worlds apart.

A keeper plays a bit part in a penalty, but isnt generally at fault if it goes in.

[Guest]

Playing a big part and being at fault are worlds apart.

A keeper plays a bit part in a penalty, but isnt generally at fault if it goes in.

I'll rephrase it. They're equally at fault.

[Craig_H]

You can rephrase it. But they arent.

It's not the fans 'fault' if the team play ****. Not remotely.

[Guest]

You can rephrase it. But they arent.

It's not the fans 'fault' if the team play ****. Not remotely.

They should shoulder a lot of it. Anfield is a morgue these days, especially against 'lesser teams'. No motivation whatsoever (or so it seems for the majority) to roar the team on.

Of all the matches I've watched, the team started well enough and with enough verve to give the fans ammunition to get behind them. Patience is the key and fans don't seem to have it, as these type of games tend to peter out in the end.

Fans fault as well, as they're often referred to as the '12th man'. Without doubt whatsoever.

[Guest]

And Carragher just touched on that 'again' in his post match Real interview. See, it's nothing 'random' here. It is indeed a problem.

I'm not laying the blame solely on supporters, just saying that if they could treat each and every game like it was a match against Real, or a CL cracker, we would have won that league at a canter ... in theory.

[Craig_H]

It's not the fan's 'fault' though, you're missing the point.

They can help, sure. But what happens then if a game is behind closed doors? The team cant perform?

This is an absolute gem though, cant blame the manager, wont even blame the players now - it's just the fans Priceless stuff mate.

Did Carragher use the word 'fault'? Show me a link if he did.

[Guest]

It's not the fan's 'fault' though, you're missing the point.

They can help, sure. But what happens then if a game is behind closed doors? The team cant perform?

This is an absolute gem though, cant blame the manager, wont even blame the players now - it's just the fans Priceless stuff mate.

Did Carragher use the word 'fault'? Show me a link if he did.

Don't have a link someone mentioned it on here.

FFS, I ain't 'defending' the manager or trying to find excuses or even being 'biased'. Players have to shoulder the blame 'as well' but it's a catch 22 situation. As stated by yourself, players do get edgy when things start to go wrong and when fans are starting to 'moan and groan'. Go onto the pitch FFS or better, try to be more vociferous and instill some belief in those players. They are humans, equally so than most of the 'drunken' retards filling up a football stadium, even if they're paid loads amount of money to do their job.

As I've said, we've started most of these matches well enough but it's petered out as the game wore on, partly due to the fact that fans started to get on some players' backs. It's a simple equation at the end of the day. We need this belief back and this includes fans, who before the kick off to a match against a team like Stoke, are always fearing for the worst.

Such a stark contrast to CL match days. Is it because of the fact that it's more of a 'glamorous' night out? Our bread and butter is simply ... too much of the 'bread and butter' or so it seems.

[Craig_H]

You can continue on with all that, but the only thing i'm disputing is the notion of it being the fans FAULT if the TEAM plays ****.

Carry on though.

[Guest]

You can continue on with all that, but the only thing i'm disputing is the notion of it being the fans FAULT if the TEAM plays ****.

Carry on though.

Yeah and your analogy of playing behind closed doors and the need to perform just as much is just a fallacy.

[MrMichael]

I think its pretty impossible to expect the crowd to be like that for every game anyway, local derbies, games against huge rivals or massive European clubs etc will inevitably see a greater atmosphere than in some other games. The crowd can certainly help fire up the team, but it shouldn't be a pre-requisite for them to perform, especially considering 50% of games in a season are played away from home, and I really don't think it is either.

Old Toilet can be like a morgue at times but that doesn't stop ManYoo from dominating most of the weaker sides there.

Ultimately, the reasons behind us failing to beat some poor sides at Anfield this season are far more to do with a lack of urgency in our play at times, a lack of consistent creative ideas, a lack of goals from our midfield, and a lack of genuine quality back-up options when our best players, ie. Torres and Gerrard, are either injured or out of form. The atmosphere at Anfield may have played a role too, but if so its a minor one compared to on-pitch issues, and is really a chicken & egg argument anyway - the crowd get nervous because they can see with their own eyes the team struggling to break a packed defence down, then that nervousness probably does transmit itself to the players on the pitch, which in turn makes the crowd more nervous still.

Certainly a section of our match-goers, especially the ones who do things like boo our own players, need to take a long hard look at themselves, but the whole "12th man thing" can be as easily overstated as underestimated.

[Guest]

Professional football is a tough job, so we can't expect the team to perform as well week in week out. Humans aren't mechanical devices and we can expect a fall below their usual high standards from time to time. As opposed to that, it doesn't ask much of a supporter to be vociferous and to get behind their team on match days, especially if it's at Anfield.

That is why, I think, that we should be more 'progressive' with our view that it's only a 'teams' duty' to perform on a match day, just to 'get the fans going'. It's part and parcel of being in it together. I have noticed that our away support is outstanding most of the time, when subconsciously (or not), fans tend to be naturally inclined to give more backing to the team on these occasions, maybe because of the obvious fact that we are at a 'disadvantage' when playing away.

It should come naturally to us that it's our duty to try to remain positive and to be patient during a match, so that our nervousness doesn't translate to the players, which should give them a platform to express themselves better in order to wear teams down.

Of course, if players aren't giving their all and are just being passengers, those same supporters are entitled to let their feelings known. There's a fine line between giving 100% and being affected by events occurring outside their control. Old Trafford expect their team to win these days, that's the difference with us. We're 19 years and still counting and there's much more pressure. This is at our disadvantage, something which we often overlook when analyzing such things.

The platform should be there for each and every LFC player to perform to the best of their abilities. Yes there's pressure, but we are not dealing with robots here.

[Guest]

Every team would miss a Gerrard and Torres. We have proved that we can live without them, by beating Real, Chelsea and Man. Utd without these players. Whilst we don't have a star studded line up compared to what Chelsea and Man.Utd have, we still are a team good enough to win the league, in my opinion. I really thought this year would have been our year.

It's about the consistency of performances, and sometimes stupid mistakes which made us concede stupid goals which was our undoing this season. Man.Utd have had a lot of 1-0 wins, thing which was associated with us not so long ago. Just off the top of my head, I think we've scored more or less the same amount of goals as them this season, so their durability stems out of their excellent defense this season. Who would have thought so?

All of this to say that we can spend time analyzing a season, matches etc ... but there is always a fine line where we would have missed something along the way. There is no concrete and definite answer as regards our patchy form in the league since the turn of the year. We're right up there with Chelsea this season, showing that we're progressing and getting there.

I won't hold my breath, but we'll have a clearer picture as to where we stand after Saturday's match. Win that and we can still have slim hopes of catching United, as their form has been 'patchy', to say the least, recently. They certainly haven't been to their flowing best on a consistent basis. We seem to have expanded our game a little more but lost out a bit in our consistency in preserving out a result.