John Barnes On Lucas & The Liverpool Squad

[Redspin]

The big thing here for me is that those who "do not rate him" don´t seem to be basing their opinion on much. We know he works hard, we know he passes well. It is not his job to play the miracle pass. He is there to keep it simple and the ball moving and he does that brilliantly. We know he tackles very well, even better then Mascherano. We know he has game intelligence, he is very good positionally both defensively and offensively. He is strong in the air. He is very good technically. If one watches carefully how he receives the ball and passes it one can see that. And if you look at the game against Newcastle he was not just good in that game, he was great. Any other midfield player in the league would have been proud. And in the other games he has played for us, especially this year, he has been close to that level. So it seems to me that the only thing he has done wrong is giving the penalty away and getting sent off against Everton. And when you have just turned 22 you are allowed to make mistakes. I would bet my house that Carra and Gerrard made more mistakes at the age of 22 then Lucas does. And saying that he let the team down in those games is very unfair. If so then Carra let the team down against Hull. And I think we all agree that is bull****.

IMO the only thing the lad needs is more experience, support and more time on the pitch. I think he has the potential to become a great player for us.

Well said. None of the whingers on here seem to acknowledge the quite excellent performance he gave against Man U on Saturday filling Alonso's role superbly. He was streets ahead of the ponderous Carrick and the basically useless Anderson in their midfield - another Brazilian who cost them 3 times what Lucas cost us, who usually plays very averagely but somehow escapes criticism in the media

[dww]

Well said. None of the whingers on here seem to acknowledge the quite excellent performance he gave against Man U on Saturday filling Alonso's role superbly. He was streets ahead of the ponderous Carrick and the basically useless Anderson in their midfield - another Brazilian who cost them 3 times what Lucas cost us, who usually plays very averagely but somehow escapes criticism in the media

The thing is that Anderson has been a cog in a highly successful machine. For large parts of last season he was very good for them and then seemed to suffer burn out. He has also had at least one splendid game (against us). Players are often forgiven a lot when they play in a winning team. The problem for Lucas has been that he has played in a team which has been in indifferent form for a lot of the season which has added the pressure on him to step up. He also hasn't had, until now, one big game which people could point to as an indication of his potential.

After a lot of talk of how Brazil has struggled for CMs in recent years they now seem to have three exceptional prospects in Lucas, Denilson and Anderson.

[barnes10]

i think lucas is going to be a great player. a shame if thats not with us.

he does get too much stick but thats keyboard warriors/managers for you.

[Craig_H]

The big thing here for me is that those who "do not rate him" don´t seem to be basing their opinion on much. We know he works hard, we know he passes well. It is not his job to play the miracle pass. He is there to keep it simple and the ball moving and he does that brilliantly. We know he tackles very well, even better then Mascherano. We know he has game intelligence, he is very good positionally both defensively and offensively. He is strong in the air. He is very good technically. If one watches carefully how he receives the ball and passes it one can see that. And if you look at the game against Newcastle he was not just good in that game, he was great. Any other midfield player in the league would have been proud. And in the other games he has played for us, especially this year, he has been close to that level. So it seems to me that the only thing he has done wrong is giving the penalty away and getting sent off against Everton. And when you have just turned 22 you are allowed to make mistakes. I would bet my house that Carra and Gerrard made more mistakes at the age of 22 then Lucas does. And saying that he let the team down in those games is very unfair. If so then Carra let the team down against Hull. And I think we all agree that is bull****.

IMO the only thing the lad needs is more experience, support and more time on the pitch. I think he has the potential to become a great player for us.

To my mind, there are others who can keep it simple, keep the ball moving AND do more.

Lucas has improved his previous level of poor and is now decent/ok. I'd prefer more than just decent though and i still dont think he offers a significant impact in either half of the park.

I'd go back to asking the question - if you're picking a team for a Champions League final tomorrow, you're not going to pick Lucas. And there's a reason for that.

Well said. None of the whingers on here seem to acknowledge the quite excellent performance he gave against Man U on Saturday filling Alonso's role superbly. He was streets ahead of the ponderous Carrick and the basically useless Anderson in their midfield - another Brazilian who cost them 3 times what Lucas cost us, who usually plays very averagely but somehow escapes criticism in the media

I think players are judged by the standards they set themselves, and by his own previous poor standards, he was very good at Old Trafford.

By the standards of a side who have genuine aspirations of winning the league and wanting to be the best side in europe, i dont think his level is high enough.

Why would every Liverpool fan choose Alonso and Mascherano ahead of Lucas pretty much every day of the week?

Might it be because they are top players, befitting of a top quality side like LFC and Lucas perhaps isnt? I think so.

As for Carrick, Anderson and the like - i dont really see why it matters about other players at other clubs, i'm only concerned about Liverpool.

[BFG]

I'd go back to asking the question - if you're picking a team for a Champions League final tomorrow, you're not going to pick Lucas. And there's a reason for that.

Because they are hugely experienced players who'd get into most sides in the world and Lucas is a promising although relatively inexperienced youngster?
That's the point mate, he's young, he's 4th choice and he's got all the ability to potentially go on and be a super player. At the moment he's got more than enough quality to be a squad player at any club and doesn't deserve even half the grief he gets.

[dww]

To my mind, there are others who can keep it simple, keep the ball moving AND do more.

Lucas has improved his previous level of poor and is now decent/ok. I'd prefer more than just decent though and i still dont think he offers a significant impact in either half of the park.

I'd go back to asking the question - if you're picking a team for a Champions League final tomorrow, you're not going to pick Lucas. And there's a reason for that.



I think players are judged by the standards they set themselves, and by his own previous poor standards, he was very good at Old Trafford.

By the standards of a side who have genuine aspirations of winning the league and wanting to be the best side in europe, i dont think his level is high enough.

Why would every Liverpool fan choose Alonso and Mascherano ahead of Lucas pretty much every day of the week?

Might it be because they are top players, befitting of a top quality side like LFC and Lucas perhaps isnt? I think so.

As for Carrick, Anderson and the like - i dont really see why it matters about other players at other clubs, i'm only concerned about Liverpool.

Possibly the reason Carrick and Anderson are bought up is because they play for what is widely regarded as the best side in Europe and who are the biggest barrier between us and winning the league. Therefore making it reasonable to judge our current playing staff against theirs.

[Craig_H]

Because they are hugely experienced players who'd get into most sides in the world and Lucas is a promising although relatively inexperienced youngster?
That's the point mate, he's young, he's 4th choice and he's got all the ability to potentially go on and be a super player. At the moment he's got more than enough quality to be a squad player at any club and doesn't deserve even half the grief he gets.

That's all fine and he may well go on to become a useful option, i wouldnt dispute that.

I cant really see this whole 'he is playing really well' or 'he has been excellent' stuff though, because at best, he's been 'good' and not hugely more than that.

That's all i've been saying.

[Guest]

What's your take on Carrick Craig? I think he has turned into an excellent player for United, worthy of a place in the England squad.

[Craig_H]

What's your take on Carrick Craig? I think he has turned into an excellent player for United, worthy of a place in the England squad.

He's a very good player who like most good english players, was vastly over priced. He's unfortunate that the likes of Barry, Gerrard and Lampard are better than him at their respective strengths, but Carrick's a class act. Sadly for him, Barry's a better holding midfielder, Hargreaves has more energy when fit, and Gerrard is infinitely better than him both defensively and going forward. Lampard's a better attacking midfielder, so i dont see where Carrick could fit into an England midfield.

He's very good, without doubt but i wouldnt call him world class, and i dont think he'd get in our team week in, week out.

[RedReet]

To my mind, there are others who can keep it simple, keep the ball moving AND do more.

Lucas has improved his previous level of poor and is now decent/ok. I'd prefer more than just decent though and i still dont think he offers a significant impact in either half of the park.

Lucas is an intelligent footballer and has a keen eye for a pass. Even when he has a bad game what has always impressed me most is at times he has shown to be on the same wavelength of Xabi, Nando and Stevie during certain passages of play, a skill that can’t be taught. It might be his movement around these players or his reading and returning of first time passes, but it’s a quality that only top players (and not I don’t think he’s that good yet, but has potential) have.

He had a great game against United on Saturday, but if he gets the chance to develop a better understanding with the rest of the team, then there could be much more to come.

[Craig_H]

Maybe we see different things then, fair enough.

I think, if he played for someone else, very few of these perceived 'qualities' would be noticed by some people.

[BFG]

That's all fine and he may well go on to become a useful option, i wouldnt dispute that.

I cant really see this whole 'he is playing really well' or 'he has been excellent' stuff though, because at best, he's been 'good' and not hugely more than that.

That's all i've been saying.

For a young lad who's mostly a reserve and cost what Anderson's right leg did, I'd say that 'good' is good enough.

[Guest]

Lucas is an intelligent footballer and has a keen eye for a pass. Even when he has a bad game what has always impressed me most is at times he has shown to be on the same wavelength of Xabi, Nando and Stevie during certain passages of play, a skill that can’t be taught. It might be his movement around these players or his reading and returning of first time passes, but it’s a quality that only top players (and not I don’t think he’s that good yet, but has potential) have.

He had a great game against United on Saturday, but if he gets the chance to develop a better understanding with the rest of the team, then there could be much more to come.

Craig keeps it simple in here too; keep the conversations ticking nicely until we finally realize that we've been lulled into arguing with him. He even managed to fool us by doing a Jesus Christ on us; coming back from the dead a totally different man.

[Craig_H]

For a young lad who's mostly a reserve and cost what Anderson's right leg did, I'd say that 'good' is good enough.

I see what you did there.

My point is that he's only been 'good' in about 3 games.

Most of his performances have been, according to my expectations at least, poor. That's the problem.

Craig keeps it simple in here too; keep the conversations ticking nicely until we finally realize that we've been lulled into arguing with him. He even managed to fool us by doing a Jesus Christ on us; coming back from the dead a totally different man.

How about you show me where i said that the mancs 'wont drop points' ?

You're good at making up false quotes and then presenting them emphatically as if you're in a strong debating position. You should work for a tabloid newspaper.

[Assassin]

It seems as though you're not willing to ALLOW me to have my opinion on him - either i agree that he's good, or i'm slating him. I find that strange, personally.

You are entitled to your opinion, likewise, I am entitled to mine. I do not agree with your opinion on Lucas.

I am sure, personally, you will find it strange that I dont agree with your thoughts, as in your opinion you are always right