Does Rafa deserve one last throw of the dice?

[red g]

The freebie thing is a bit of a misnomer with anyone, as they'd all be on high wages. Obviously you're referring to the no compensation thing.

Speaking of which, i'd just like to point out that Inter lost 3-1 away to Catania last night, and they are now 4 points ahead of AC Milan, who have a game in hand at home to Chievo on sunday night. They should win and close the gap to 1 point. Inter still have very tricky fixtures, including away at Palermo (4th place in Serie A, unbeaten at home) next weekend, and Roma & away & Juve at home, all still to come. Plus they go to Stamford Bridge in the week, where i'd rate their chances of progression at 50%.

All in all, the pressure is really on for Mourinho, if they go out of the CL and somehow inexplicably throw away their lead in Serie A, Moratti will surely dismiss him.

hodgson to Inter
Mourinho to liverpool
Rafa to Juve/madrid

you heard it here first

[Craig_H]

Heres a couple, Torres and Gerrard have been hardly 100% fit for the whole Season, we lost 2 key players in the Summer and our new midfield general has taken longer to get into the team then was anticipated for various reasons.



Torres, Mascherano, Alonso, Arbeola, Skrtle, Agger, Reina, Johnson, Kyriakos, Ngog, Benni, Reira..........There isn't too much rubbish there, lets be honest the good out weigh the bad by quite a bit.



Do you not feel that the attitude of the players is contributing to our results, lets be honest here the team that lined up against Wigan and Lille where more then capable. Does Rafa need to throw a tea cup to get the best out of World class players??

I think there's a contradiction there, surely.

Firstly you point to players being injured and suggested this as the reason why things have gone ****. This implies that our squad lacks quality and cannot cope with a couple of injuries.

But then you list a high number of players, who you consider to be of a certain quality.

So if he's bought a lot of good players, surely that indicates a good strong squad - therefore, a couple of injuries shouldnt have us suddenly freefalling from finishing 2nd, to competing for 7th

Cant have it both ways. Either he's built a good squad, so we should be able to cope with a couple of injuries. Or the injuries ****ed us up because he HASNT built a good enough squad.

For the record, the mancs have had spells this season when their entire defence has been injured. They seem to have managed.

I agree about players attitudes, it's been poor. But it's also part of the manager's job to manage these things. Again, pointing at the mancs, Ferguson's made a career of successfully managing his players as people and getting the best of them. Rafa is vastly inferior in this aspect of management.

[Craig_H]

Could it be anything to do with lack of fitness from Torres and Gerrard, in fairness they have missed a shed load of games this season.

How does that explain the lack of effort and drive from pretty much every other player?

It's a weak excuse mate. If the lack of fitness of SG & FT is the reason why the others are putting in any effort (i dont believe it is) then Rafa either needs to kick some arses, or not keep picking two players whose lack of fitness is leaving them ineffective on the pitch and making the rest 'not be arsed'.

[Craig_H]

Take Rooney and Berbatov out of the Scums team for the same period of time.

Take Dog Breath and Essien out of the the Chavs.

Both sides have far more resources then our club for a whole list of reasons but the bottom line is these tweo clubs would stuggle if they had to do without these players for the same period that we have gone without Torres and Gerrard.

They would suffer without them, but they wouldnt be in a race for 7th

They'd still comfortably make the top 4.

[Armchairkopite]

I think there's a contradiction there, surely.

Firstly you point to players being injured and suggested this as the reason why things have gone ****. This implies that our squad lacks quality and cannot cope with a couple of injuries.

But then you list a high number of players, who you consider to be of a certain quality.

So if he's bought a lot of good players, surely that indicates a good strong squad - therefore, a couple of injuries shouldnt have us suddenly freefalling from finishing 2nd, to competing for 7th

It certainly wasn't meant to indicate that and your the only one to mention it.

Cant have it both ways. Either he's built a good squad, so we should be able to cope with a couple of injuries. Or the injuries ****ed us up because he HASNT built a good enough squad.

You are creating your own argument to suit yourself.

For the record, the mancs have had spells this season when their entire defence has been injured. They seem to have managed.

For the record our defence has been decimated with injuries this season also but dont let the facts stand in the way of a good argument eh, Craig.

I agree about players attitudes, it's been poor. But it's also part of the manager's job to manage these things. Again, pointing at the mancs, Ferguson's made a career of successfully managing his players as people and getting the best of them. Rafa is vastly inferior in this aspect of management.

It would seem as though Ferguson has that aspect over Rafa I wonder if Rafa flogged Gerrard would that change?? wh knows

Any way you see what you want, I am not in the humour of going around in circles .

[Craig_H]

It would seem as though Ferguson has that aspect over Rafa I wonder if Rafa flogged Gerrard would that change?? wh knows

Any way you see what you want, I am not in the humour of going around in circles .

But if you've got a lot of good players, surely that does equate to having a good squad??

[Armchairkopite]

But if you've got a lot of good players, surely that does equate to having a good squad??

Hows that.

[Armchairkopite]

What is a lot, please clarify

[Armchairkopite]

Did i specify that we had a lot of good players right now?

Answers on a postcard.

[Armchairkopite]

Keep up Craig

[Craig_H]

To quote fredo, you're playing with semantics now. And if you just want to post 3 times in a row, with just nonsense and being a dick about it, i cant be arsed to bother with you.

You reeled off a fair list. And in other thread, i posted to Lectar about the first team and then listed another 8 players in the squad, all of whom were good players, and internationals.

We have decent quality backup for most positions. People have fallen into the trap of thinking if someone isnt to Gerrard or Torres quality, they're not good enough. That's not true.

[einar]

Am I the only one who read about Rafas view on motivation?

As I see it, after reading many interviews with him and his staff, it seem clear to me that he does not believe in motivation. The way he sees it is that the players themselves should be motivated enough to begin with. (there was no miracle team talk at half time in Istanbul. He just changed the team and tactics and told them if they scored one goal, anything could happen.)


What he believes is the best way to get the most out of the players is give them the best possible circumstances to succeed. And then they automatically go out and do their best because of their ambition and bus size egos.

So I think demanding that he be out of a job because he does not manage his players like Ferguson does, is a bit of the mark.

[Craig_H]

Am I the only one who read about Rafas view on motivation?

As I see it, after reading many interviews with him and his staff, it seem clear to me that he does not believe in motivation. The way he sees it is that the players themselves should be motivated enough to begin with. (there was no miracle team talk at half time in Istanbul. He just changed the team and tactics and told them if they scored one goal, anything could happen.)


What he believes is the best way to get the most out of the players is give them the best possible circumstances to succeed. And then they automatically go out and do their best because of their ambition and bus size egos.

So I think demanding that he be out of a job because he does not manage his players like Ferguson does, is a bit of the mark.

I'm sorry but when the results and the quality of football are pure ****, it's not remotely off the mark.

Do what you like rafa, use whatever methods you want and pick whatever players you want. Total control, as you wanted.

But if it fails, you're the one who carries the can.

[Armchairkopite]

Am I the only one who read about Rafas view on motivation?

As I see it, after reading many interviews with him and his staff, it seem clear to me that he does not believe in motivation. The way he sees it is that the players themselves should be motivated enough to begin with. (there was no miracle team talk at half time in Istanbul. He just changed the team and tactics and told them if they scored one goal, anything could happen.)


What he believes is the best way to get the most out of the players is give them the best possible circumstances to succeed. And then they automatically go out and do their best because of their ambition and bus size egos.

So I think demanding that he be out of a job because he does not manage his players like Ferguson does, is a bit of the mark.

Aye, just a bit mate.

[Armchairkopite]

I'm sorry but when the results and the quality of football are pure ****, it's not remotely off the mark.

Do what you like rafa, use whatever methods you want and pick whatever players you want. Total control, as you wanted.

But if it fails, you're the one who carries the can.

Your right lets disregard all of the other factors.

Rafa cannot motivate Steven Gerrard the captain of Liverpool Football Club to play decent football, he must go, obviously its the managers fault how can a local lad 29 years of age, captain of one of the biggest clubs in Europe be expected to motivate himself.

Its a wonder he can get himself out of bed in the mornings all by himself to be honest.