Man Utd Post Match

[calvoboy]

Honestly, are you really all that pessimistic about 4th? Or is it just an emotional reaction to THEM beating us today?

Looking at it logically I expected a draw at best today (though obviously was hoping for better) so we're only a point down on expectations. City and Spurs are the teams with the clear advantage over us - City still have Everton, United, Arsenal, Villa and Spurs to play. Spurs still have Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd and City. They're both going to drop quite a few points before the end of the season. It's nowhere near over yet.

[Exiled_red]

We're 4 points behind Spurs who have a game in hand and 2 behind city who have two games in hand, Villa are 1 point behind us with two games in hand. It's not in our hands, we have to win all our games and hope all the other teams slip up. It's possible, but realistically it's extremely difficult!

[TheElephantMan]

Honestly, are you really all that pessimistic about 4th? Or is it just an emotional reaction to THEM beating us today?

Looking at it logically I expected a draw at best today (though obviously was hoping for better) so we're only a point down on expectations. City and Spurs are the teams with the clear advantage over us - City still have Everton, United, Arsenal, Villa and Spurs to play. Spurs still have Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd and City. They're both going to drop quite a few points before the end of the season. It's nowhere near over yet.

I still expect us to get fourth. I thought we'd lose to Portsmouth and then beat United so we're still in the same place I expected. We were unlucky today (I've calmed down a bit), one **** refereeing decision/dive changed the game. We should still have confidence after the previous two games and we are capable of going on a winning run.

[Rich]

Pretty much nothing worth watching after the Reina penalty save.

Gerrard again was very poor - if he's injured then he shouldn't be played, and if he can't be arsed anymore then he shouldn't be playing either.

[Kenneth]

What was Rafa thinking when he garanteed 4th spot? Sounded stupid at the time and no less so now.

[frank the tank]

I still expect us to get fourth. I thought we'd lose to Portsmouth and then beat United so we're still in the same place I expected. We were unlucky today (I've calmed down a bit), one **** refereeing decision/dive changed the game. We should still have confidence after the previous two games and we are capable of going on a winning run.

We're 4 points behind Spurs who have a game in hand and 2 behind city who have two games in hand, Villa are 1 point behind us with two games in hand. It's not in our hands, we have to win all our games and hope all the other teams slip up. It's possible, but realistically it's extremely difficult!

[The Birdman]

Controversally having watched the incident again for Utd's penalty I have to say it was one in my opinion, if you watch it at normal speed and from the angle the linesman and ref are looking at it he can't tell exactly where the pulling stopped.
Also the main consideration with penalties (again just my opinion) is the question - would we have wanted one given to us for the same situation? I'd hazard a guess that 99% of posters on here would want a penalty for an identical incident but find it easy to blame the ref.

Mascherano seems to have avoided all criticisism on here, he is the captain of his country, an experienced player yet tugs away at Valencia just after we have scored when Carra is coming across which would have forced Valencia to shoot at the near post.
It was also Mascherano that let Park run off him then got caught ball watching and attracted to the near post instead of trying to get back in and pick him up.
How many gilt edged chances did Utd miss?? none that I can remember, we missed 2 in the same move when Torres should have scored and from his mis hit Benayoun should have done better from 6 yards.

Surely no-one expected us to dominate possession and chances when playing at OT?? losing away to Man U isn't expected but it is explainable as they have been the dominant club for the past 20 years.
We went there after an important Thursday night game, they played the previous weekend so had a week to recover.
We need to win every game from now until the end of the season and see where we end up, today's defeat was our 10th in the PL this season, the other 9 have been the problem.

[el matador]

What was Rafa thinking when he garanteed 4th spot? Sounded stupid at the time and no less so now.

he didnt look that bothered today when we lost. Its almost like he accepted it and thought he would enjoy the show.

During the season at various points we have all questioned the manager and that are lots of mitigations in his defence but at the least we should have finished 4th.

The general consensus is that if we finish 4th then rafa deserves another chance, but its pretty clear that 4th is over, and we will struggle to qualify for the europa league.

Despite everything that rafa's done for us, I do think that he's had six seasons at anfield and that's enough. The team needs a change and the supporters need a change.

There might still be a miracle and somehow we finish fourth but im 99% certain that it wont happen. We need to put an end to the rafa benitez reign and move forward with Jose Mourinho.

But Gerrard has a lot to do to win the fans over because his attitude has been really disgusting this season. No one player is ever bigger than the club and he's sadly mistaken if he thinks this is the Steven Gerrard roadshow.

[Ben_Itez]

I'll agree with most of that Birdman but thought the penalty was a free kick, Valencia played it well to win the penalty. Mascherano should be the one we're complaining about. If we'd managed to get to half time at 1-0 our belief would have grown and we would have had a much better chance of winning.

Webb still had a **** game though and the Rooney dive which won a free kick (as someone mentioned) on 80 mins was a complete joke....Rooney even looked at his bench and raised his eyebrows shocked that he'd got the decision and wasnt being booked.

[pondus]

What really annoyed me at the end was that when we were chasing an equalizer in the last 10-15 minutes we still only had Torres alone up front. Hoofing the ball to a lone striker is just a waste of time.

Oh, and I think I have said it before, but it needs to be said again, Howard Webb is a cunt.

[el matador]

I'll agree with most of that Birdman but thought the penalty was a free kick, Valencia played it well to win the penalty. Mascherano should be the one we're complaining about. If we'd managed to get to half time at 1-0 our belief would have grown and we would have had a much better chance of winning.

Webb still had a **** game though and the Rooney dive which won a free kick (as someone mentioned) on 80 mins was a complete joke....Rooney even looked at his bench and raised his eyebrows shocked that he'd got the decision and wasnt being booked.

insuas header gave him absolutely no chance and he had to stick with valencia. He had to make a challenge and it wasnt a penalty but if vidic did that to Torres we would be baying for blood.

It was given at old trafford and it would have been given at anfield.

I also have to say this, in the past argentina produced some brilliant defenders but just recently there has been some utter ****e - colocinni, paletta, di michelis and now insua.

ive never known such crap to eminate from such a top country who's international sides have been built on giving absolutely nothing away. Yet here we are with a left back who cant defend at all. The boy knows absolutely nothing about defending and i dont even know why he's at left back.

Credit goes to maxi who shielded insua well but valencia ran at him twice and skinned him twice. I think Kelly deserves a go there but the decision to let go of arbeloa looks like a shocker.

[Craig_H]

Webb was a cunt, as predicted and he gave them the match.

That said, we didnt help ourselves - we showed no adventure after going behind. Even in the 5 mins added time, they were pressing more than us. Granted Torres should've got us a point but would it have been deserved on the balance of the game? Arguably no.

As is characteristic of Rafa, Kuyt and Maxi played, not for the threat they offer us, but for the defensive work they do - because we were more focused on stopping Neville/Valencia and Evra/Nani than we were on trying to win the game.

One of them should've played, not both. Babel warranted a start.

Insua is a major liability and is getting increasingly woeful and was responsible for letting the ball reach Valencia via a long diagonal, which he could've cut out, but hesitated and then missed - that led to the foul outside the box which, at OT for the home side, equals a peno.

Still dont think 4th is gone, but we need a minimum of 19 points, if not 21. It's not impossible.

[wiw]

Your avatar is depressing me Craig

[Craig_H]

It's Howard Webb who's depressing you mate, not my av.

[Craig_H]

One other thing - watch Park's goal and tell me that Rooney isnt fouling Carra when the cross comes in. ****ing clear cut foul.

Not to mention Maxi getting his head nearly kicked off and Webb giving nothing.

Cheated out of it, we were.