Pack your bags Roy

[Exiled_red]

No I read your whole post.

It is just the bits I disagree with decimate the bits I agreed with. Roy has shown absolutely no evidence of getting into the top 6, so to base anything on him doing that maks the rest of your post slightly moot. Trusting him to manage the squad to the end of the season will be one of the worst decisions in the history of the club. That is how badly I think he has us playing. He has us celebrating beating Bolton and Villa like we have just won the league... And comes up with pathetic excuses when we don't.

I am not making this a post about Rafa or Roy, just about Roy. We need to make positive steps forward and we need to make them quickly. Sticking with Roy can do untold damage to our squad for this year and for future seasons. Squad wise, yes, we are weaker than probably City, Chelsea (though they look weak right now), Utd, Arsenal and Spurs... But we should be up around 5th 6th with the players we have now. Not getting left behind by Bolton, Blackpool etc.

That's a good point, the highest position we've been in this season is 8th, and we've only been in the top ten 8 times out of 19!! We got rid of Rafa because he was underperforming in getting the club to 7th last season, with a squad ravaged by injuries. This year with less injuries we're spending more time in the bottom half of the table than the top

[Suarez]

No I read your whole post.

It is just the bits I disagree with decimate the bits I agreed with. Roy has shown absolutely no evidence of getting into the top 6, so to base anything on him doing that maks the rest of your post slightly moot. Trusting him to manage the squad to the end of the season will be one of the worst decisions in the history of the club. That is how badly I think he has us playing. He has us celebrating beating Bolton and Villa like we have just won the league... And comes up with pathetic excuses when we don't.

I am not making this a post about Rafa or Roy, just about Roy. We need to make positive steps forward and we need to make them quickly. Sticking with Roy can do untold damage to our squad for this year and for future seasons. Squad wise, yes, we are weaker than probably City, Chelsea (though they look weak right now), Utd, Arsenal and Spurs... But we should be up around 5th 6th with the players we have now. Not getting left behind by Bolton, Blackpool etc.

We're only 5 points off the top 6 with 18 games to go though. Rafa finished 7th with a group of players he brought in and knew.

Roy's media comments are a joke, he angers me whenever he opens his mouth. His tactics seem to be too route one and more akin to a mediocre side, but if this gets us into a top 6 place by the end of the season, then who are we to argue when we agree that 5 clubs above us have better squads?

I think the issue is that we don't like Roy, he offends us whenever he opens his mouth. We don't like hearing him refer to us as a mediocre team, though in reality, we don't have a top tier squad. We'd rather be playing nice attacking football and finish 6th than playing dire defensive football and finishing 6th. That I can understand, but if people think anyone else would finish above 6th, I think they're pushing it a bit. First Chelsea, then Spurs and City came along spending a fortune. We've fallen well behind, hence we finshed 7th last season.

[Darkon]

I think Rafa lost the belief in Aquilani last season, he also made a comment or two to the media about his desire to play when not at 100%. I think his days were numbered even with Rafa here. He cost us the best part of £20m and didn't have the heart for the premiership, a terrible waste of money. He's playing well again in his homeland but he wasn't interested in England.

Keane gave us more options and got us 3 points against Bolton. I always said that Keane was a lot better striker than his replacement.

Utd, Spurs, City, Chelsea and Arsenal all have far better squads than us. We have one or two great individuals, but overall the depth in the squad is poor.

I unfortunatly have to agree with that, with the current bunch of players, with a few exceptions, we simply don't have a good enough squad to finish above those teams. Our current manager and tactics far from helps, but even a world class manager would struggle to get top 4-5 with the current squad.

I asked the question a couple of months back, if we should look a bit broader than the manager and just "accept" the fact that our squad have become poorer during the last 1½ year while the rest have become better or at least not gone backwards.

The only players we have currently that could go in to any of the teams mentioned, arsenal, utd, chelsea, spurs and city are Torres, Gerrard, Reina and if he ever manages to stay fit Agger. The rest of our squad is not good enough for a top-4 team as it looks now, and it will take a long haul to get us back and we have to live on our reputation alone for a few seasons now. Roy is clearly not the man for the job, but I do think we sooner rather than later need to accept that the next few years will not be title challenging and rather a build up for the futher. This also includes fans needing to be so shortsighted as they are now, which the 'owners thread' perfectly shows that there is plenty of, and give them and a younger progressive manager time to build something special again.

[Exiled_red]

I think Rafa lost the belief in Aquilani last season, he also made a comment or two to the media about his desire to play when not at 100%. I think his days were numbered even with Rafa here. He cost us the best part of £20m and didn't have the heart for the premiership, a terrible waste of money. He's playing well again in his homeland but he wasn't interested in England.

Keane gave us more options and got us 3 points against Bolton. I always said that Keane was a lot better striker than his replacement.

Utd, Spurs, City, Chelsea and Arsenal all have far better squads than us. We have one or two great individuals, but overall the depth in the squad is poor.

I'd disagree with your views on Aquilani, I think if Rafa were here, Aquilani would still be here. Hodgson was mugged on the Aquilani deal especially when he paid for Poulsen, he should have at least tried to get a loan fee for Aquilani or got Poulsen for alot less (or not at all ).

Yes Keane was better than his replacement, given we didn't replace him! But his performances were dire and he was no great loss.

Yes I'll agree that Utd, Spurs, City, Chelsea and Arsenal have better squads than we do now, but at the start of the summer for a couple of those clubs that was certainly debatable, their managers improved their squads while Hodgson spent money weakening ours!

[Suarez]

I'd disagree with your views on Aquilani, I think if Rafa were here, Aquilani would still be here. Hodgson was mugged on the Aquilani deal especially when he paid for Poulsen, he should have at least tried to get a loan fee for Aquilani or got Poulsen for alot less (or not at all ).

Yes Keane was better than his replacement, given we didn't replace him! But his performances were dire and he was no great loss.

Yes I'll agree that Utd, Spurs, City, Chelsea and Arsenal have better squads than we do now, but at the start of the summer for a couple of those clubs that was certainly debatable, their managers improved their squads while Hodgson spent money weakening ours!

Yes, that was my point.


A complete mugging on the Aqualani deal, I agree with that. Seems odd that Rafa didn't try and take him to Inter on loan though.

[red g]

We're only 5 points off the top 6 with 18 games to go though. Rafa finished 7th with a group of players he brought in and knew. Roy's media comments are a joke, he angers me whenever he opens his mouth. His tactics seem to be too route one and more akin to a mediocre side, but if this gets us into a top 6 place by the end of the season, then who are we to argue when we agree that 5 clubs above us have better squads?

I think the issue is that we don't like Roy, he offends us whenever he opens his mouth. We don't like hearing him refer to us as a mediocre team, though in reality, we don't have a top tier squad. We'd rather be playing nice attacking football and finish 6th than playing dire defensive football and finishing 6th. That I can understand, but if people think anyone else would finish above 6th, I think they're pushing it a bit. First Chelsea, then Spurs and City came along spending a fortune. We've fallen well behind, hence we finshed 7th last season.

In a ridiculously **** season. This time last year we had 33points and were 4points of 4th and +12 GD.

[red g]

Yes, that was my point.


A complete mugging on the Aqualani deal, I agree with that. Seems odd that Rafa didn't try and take him to Inter on loan though.

Not really. I am not sure he has the heart to succeed or at least thats how Rafa saw it anyway.

[Suarez]

Not really. I am not sure he has the heart to succeed or at least thats how Rafa saw it anyway.

Thats what I think, my comment was more a reply to the previous post saying that Aqualani would still be here if Rafa was. I don't think he would be, which was the point I was making, if Rafa still rated him then why did he not try and take him to Inter on loan. He didn't because Rafa knows the player and was let down by him.

[Exiled_red]

In a ridiculously **** season. This time last year we had 33points and were 4points of 4th and +12 GD.

If we'd beaten Wolves, Blackpool and Sunderland at home (all of which we should easily be capable of) we'd be on 33 points now in 6th, 3 points behind Spurs in 4th with a game in hand!

[Vermilion]

I'd disagree with your views on Aquilani, I think if Rafa were here, Aquilani would still be here. Hodgson was mugged on the Aquilani deal especially when he paid for Poulsen, he should have at least tried to get a loan fee for Aquilani or got Poulsen for alot less (or not at all ).

Yes Keane was better than his replacement, given we didn't replace him! But his performances were dire and he was no great loss.

Yes I'll agree that Utd, Spurs, City, Chelsea and Arsenal have better squads than we do now, but at the start of the summer for a couple of those clubs that was certainly debatable, their managers improved their squads while Hodgson spent money weakening ours!

Agree.

[red g]

If we'd beaten Wolves, Blackpool and Sunderland at home (all of which we should easily be capable of) we'd be on 33 points now in 6th, 3 points behind Spurs in 4th with a game in hand!

its beyond a joke how we are not in the mix for 4th at this stage of the season.

[Drago]

I'm not sure Rafa rated Aquilani either. I think he realised the massive mistake he made and would have bombed him out in the summer.

[Exiled_red]

its beyond a joke how we are not in the mix for 4th at this stage of the season.

Our highest league position of the season is 8th and we've spent more time in the bottom half of the table than the top.

We're half way through the season and not once have we reached the position our previous manager was sacked for finishing in last season.

[The_weatherman]

Our highest league position of the season is 8th and we've spent more time in the bottom half of the table than the top.

We're half way through the season and not once have we reached the position our previous manager was sacked for finishing in last season.

Of course we do have different owners and a DoF, but I understand where you are coming from and I wholeheartedly agree. Any other club and he'd have been sacked by now, twice!

[dww]

I've been thinking more about this. You're right about how his own words condemn him but in addition to me it suggests Hodgson believes goals are scored by individuals rather than teams. It's certainly true of how we've been playing - no shape in attack, just hit it up and see what happens. Usually, as at the weekend, it requires a bit of magic from Gerrard and/or Torres.

It's an antediluvian approach to football and I hate it.

Aye, good point.

It is certainly unhelpful when you look at the squad we have. Players like Kuyt and Maxi can chip in with goals and in the right set up be creative too. Rafa was all about the team being more than the sum of it's parts.

That said Rafa was also prone to talking about the need for more '£20m players'.