In Comolli We Trust

[Muddled]

I don't know how the clubs finances work, bu t I would assume that we sould have to put aside expenses for add-ons dues to appearences and goals etc, where as add-ons based on league success or champions league qualification would come from the prize money asociated with the success.

Again the additional fees paid and whether this represents value for money depends on the structure of the deal. For example if we sign a player and he makes 1 Premeirship appearence and we go on to win the league, and thus have to pay £1m in add-ons for him, despite winning the league you could argue his one appearence contributed little towards that success therefore the success doesn't always justify the add-ons.

Again going back to my earlier point if we valued him at £6m but were prepared to pay up to £9m plus add-ons, if he is a failure we are still looking to make a loss which we would assume would be a minimum of £3m (the difference between what we paid an what he was worth). As much of his value is based on potential the loss is likely to be much more. As well as considering how much we could save by buying him now and developing him, we also have to consider how much we would lose if he isn't a success.

Fair comments. I wasn't being pedantic, just getting my chat on.

[BrooklynRed]

I think what’s preserving my sanity through this window is that the players we have missed out on haven’t bothered me too much. That’s not to say I don’t think they’d have strengthened the team, I just think alternatives shouldn’t be that hard to find. It also helps that at the minute our rivals aren’t adding players that worry me too much either and some are fighting a losing battle holding on to those that do.

This I agree with 100%, which I why I am optimistic about 2011/12 for us, especially if we can get another big name in the door. from a what "may" happen point of view, Arsenal seem in trouble, City look to be making like for like changes (Aguero for Tevez) in terms of quality, Chelsea seem on the way down to me, and United are still United (until they sign Sneijder, which, if they do, I think they win the league). So, I think we are primed for a move up the table, but I would really love #19.

[RedReet]

I'd be very happy with Enrique; the missus is a Newcastle fan, so I've seen him both live and when watching them on the box and think he would provide a threat going forward, as well being defensively sound. He rarely gets beaten on the ground, is quick (enough) and would add further balance to our team with the addition of Adam and Downing.

As for Dann, I haven't seen enough of him to comment.

The names were sort of irrelevant, I has hinting at the notion of us concluding our business having not left the British market, even if we addressed the areas that we need. I’m wondering if you’re concerned that we’ve finished buying for the summer, or is the issue that the names we’re linked with now are a similar level to those already signed?

[Mostar]

Still early days but I have to say that I am actually getting more and more excited as the start of the season is approaching.

Personally wasn't too crazy about some of our signings (Hendo especially for the money involved and bit underwhelmed with Downing and Adam) but I'm definitely 100% behind Kenny and his vision for the next year.

Still think we need one more game changer cause we only have a couple of those and one may struggle with injuries next year again.

When it comes to Comolli, I do think that some of deals he engineered were dragged too long (e.g. Suarez, Adam and Downing to some extent) but he did business quite quickly and efficiently with Hendo and will reserve my judgement until I see all our new pieces in action.

Hopefully happy days.

[Muddled]

The names were sort of irrelevant, I has hinting at the notion of us concluding our business having not left the British market, even if we addressed the areas that we need. I’m wondering if you’re concerned that we’ve finished buying for the summer, or is the issue that the names we’re linked with now are a similar level to those already signed?

Nah, I'm a little underwhelmed with Downing, but he has my full support and I'd be happy to be proven wrong. I think he fills a problem position, but again that depends on the formation and tactics we'll be playing. The signing of Adam I'm happy with and Henderson for me is an unknown quantity. It's not the players I was questioning, more the way we've conducted our business.

I'd also say that if people are reading it with a tone, that's not the case; it's meant as a calm point of view at our transfer strategy, what other people thought of it and if we'd be happy doing it the same way in the future.

[IN_RAFA_WE_TRUST]

Dinnae trust him, he's french. They are as trustworthy as the english.

[Kenneth]

No wonder he surrenders in fee negotiations.

[Exiled_red]

No wonder he surrenders in fee negotiations.

[dww]

Nah, that’s fair enough.

Craig seems to see United’s transfer activity as some sort of success story compared to ours and I was just wondering if anyone else was in the same boat.

I don't think the comparison is very instructive to be honest. United's purchases have been to add depth (Young) and prepare for the future (Jones). They had a strong, league winning squad, and haven't yet made the moves to sort out the areas that means that they are not challenging Barcelona in Europe or really pulling away from other title contending teams in the PL who are all also in transition (bar City).

Our goals are to lay the foundations for a future challenge and to develop a squad/team framework. I think we have done pretty well getting in the players Kenny wants to do that.

Said myself last week in the Cissokho thread that I think we need another match winner in the squad as Suarez will miss the start of the season and Gerrard will take a while to get his fitness back. At least one is also likely to pick up the odd injury too during the season and that will leave us very light in that department.

Personally my concern is defence. I think with a more solid and flexible back 6 we could push on. Not seen anything of Cissokho but I'm very suspicious of trying to build a defence from the fullbacks rather than centreback.

I also think with Johnson as likely first choice rightback it might be prudent to have a more defensive fullback the other side. A lot of talk about Cissokho seems to go - he is good going forward and decent at the back. If we do decide to get a fullback in then I'd rather people mentioned their defending as their defining aspect.

I also think that in the right system we have a decent number of goal threats in the team/squad now. I think perhaps too much is made of individual 'match winners'.

I’ve always had a sneaky feeling we might pull out a surprise marquee signing before the window closes, but if we don’t I won’t be too bothered, at least until the others have been given time to prove themselves.

I would be shocked if we did pick up another big name signing. I think if we were to be sure of anyone we would have moved by now. I guess the only caveat i would allow to that would be players at the Copa America but I would rule established players, including the likes of Aguero as possibles.

[RedReet]

I don't think the comparison is very instructive to be honest. United's purchases have been to add depth (Young) and prepare for the future (Jones). They had a strong, league winning squad, and haven't yet made the moves to sort out the areas that means that they are not challenging Barcelona in Europe or really pulling away from other title contending teams in the PL who are all also in transition (bar City).

Our goals are to lay the foundations for a future challenge and to develop a squad/team framework. I think we have done pretty well getting in the players Kenny wants to do that.

Whist I don’t necessarily disagree, it a completely different conversation, albeit probably a more interesting one.

With Craig I was discussing the quality of the player, their current ability, which in my opinion there wasn’t much in it at this stage.

In this thread I was trying to gauge if buying Jones and Young would pacify those with concerns about Comolli etc., as they were targets we allegedly missed out on. The fact that they joined United and their role in that team is irrelevant as I was considering the scenario of them joining us.

Personally my concern is defence. I think with a more solid and flexible back 6 we could push on. Not seen anything of Cissokho but I'm very suspicious of trying to build a defence from the fullbacks rather than centreback.

I also think with Johnson as likely first choice rightback it might be prudent to have a more defensive fullback the other side. A lot of talk about Cissokho seems to go - he is good going forward and decent at the back. If we do decide to get a fullback in then I'd rather people mentioned their defending as their defining aspect.

Incase my previous post was confusing, I wasn’t saying that we should buy Cissokho or he could be a match winner, just pointing out that was the thread I mentioned my concerns if Suarez and/or Gerrard were out. I’ve no real opinion on Cissokho actually, bar sharing your suspicion that some people only want him due to their obsession with foreign transfers.

If we kept Insua as an attacking LB, I’d be happy enough with a defensively sound first team option. I noticed that when we had possession on Saturday that Insua would push up field and Poulsen went over to cover him (albeit not very successfully ).I was concerned that we wouldn’t have that option if our first team players were playing, especially with Johnson doing the same on the other side.

I also think that in the right system we have a decent number of goal threats in the team/squad now. I think perhaps too much is made of individual 'match winners'.

I was looking at the first couple of matches when Suarez is unlikely to be there and Gerrard is possibly going to be off the pace, if even fit to start.

Even though we’ve only played 2 training friendlies, I found it interesting that we stuck pretty rigidly to the 4231 formation. I thought Kenny might experiment with a Kuyt/Carroll partnership as they might be his only strike option come August. It’s still to early to confidently predict, but on the evidence so far I think it’s fair to assume me might line up on the opening day of the season with…

…………Carroll
Downing..Gerrard..Kuyt
……Adam…Lucas

I should know better than to doubt Kenny, especially after last year when a few eyebrows were raised over his team selection and formation, and I don’t. But I look at that line-up and think if Gerrard isn’t on his game, it could struggle against better opposition. I know and support the whole ‘sum is greater than it’s parts’ theory, but in this instance I think the sum is a bit too reliant on Carroll whom I’m yet to be convinced by.

In terms of goal threat, I don’t see much more in that line-up than we had last year. We have substituted major contributors in Maxi and Suarez, so their replacements would really need to step up to the plate.

Again I should stress that I don’t think the club need to go out and buy another player of Suarez ability, I’m happy enough with our attacking options as they are. I just have a slight concern that we might become too reliant on Suarez, which will be like the Torres situation all over again. I’ll need Carroll to prove his worth now that he’s fit again and Gerrard to show some evidence that he’s over his injury problems before my mind will be completely at ease.

I would be shocked if we did pick up another big name signing. I think if we were to be sure of anyone we would have moved by now. I guess the only caveat i would allow to that would be players at the Copa America but I would rule established players, including the likes of Aguero as possibles.

Party pooper.

Nah, recent evidence suggests that we won’t bring in this ‘marquee’ signing that everyone craves and there is no real reason to think that we will. I've just be harbouring this suspicion that there might be a surprise on the horizon and can live in hope. I convince myself that we are going to win the league every single year no matter what the circumstances, so I guess this isn’t much different.

[dww]

Whist I don’t necessarily disagree, it a completely different conversation, albeit probably a more interesting one.

With Craig I was discussing the quality of the player, their current ability, which in my opinion there wasn’t much in it at this stage.

In this thread I was trying to gauge if buying Jones and Young would pacify those with concerns about Comolli etc., as they were targets we allegedly missed out on. The fact that they joined United and their role in that team is irrelevant as I was considering the scenario of them joining us.

Fair play, I was more commenting on the fact that you said Craig deemed their business more of a success than ours. My point was that it was a bit of an apples/oranges comparison. Taking them as a talking point re: what we have done/could have done in the market:

Literally nothing that could realistically have happened would have stopped people worrying/criticising this summers business. We are used to success of at least CL playing variety. People may have been happier with Young than Downing as he is a more fashionably lauded players and has pace but fundamentally people want a Torres/Aguero type signing and it was never going to happen.

Incase my previous post was confusing, I wasn’t saying that we should buy Cissokho or he could be a match winner, just pointing out that was the thread I mentioned my concerns if Suarez and/or Gerrard were out. I’ve no real opinion on Cissokho actually, bar sharing your suspicion that some people only want him due to their obsession with foreign transfers.

If we kept Insua as an attacking LB, I’d be happy enough with a defensively sound first team option. I noticed that when we had possession on Saturday that Insua would push up field and Poulsen went over to cover him (albeit not very successfully ).I was concerned that we wouldn’t have that option if our first team players were playing, especially with Johnson doing the same on the other side.

This has become a bit confusing so I'll leave the Cissokho point out.

In terms of attacking leftbacks - if we play two attacking players I think we should cover them going up field by dropping Adam into a CB area and the left CB moving across. Adam has claimed CB is his favoured position (even if I'd suspect not his best, and/or it's just that he doesn't like running about much). We don't have a mobile enough DM to cover across - very few are good enough at that to make it a great option (Makelele, Mascherano and Hargreaves the only one that come to mind).

I was looking at the first couple of matches when Suarez is unlikely to be there and Gerrard is possibly going to be off the pace, if even fit to start.

Even though we’ve only played 2 training friendlies, I found it interesting that we stuck pretty rigidly to the 4231 formation. I thought Kenny might experiment with a Kuyt/Carroll partnership as they might be his only strike option come August. It’s still to early to confidently predict, but on the evidence so far I think it’s fair to assume me might line up on the opening day of the season with…

…………Carroll
Downing..Gerrard..Kuyt
……Adam…Lucas

I should know better than to doubt Kenny, especially after last year when a few eyebrows were raised over his team selection and formation, and I don’t. But I look at that line-up and think if Gerrard isn’t on his game, it could struggle against better opposition. I know and support the whole ‘sum is greater than it’s parts’ theory, but in this instance I think the sum is a bit too reliant on Carroll whom I’m yet to be convinced by.

In terms of goal threat, I don’t see much more in that line-up than we had last year. We have substituted major contributors in Maxi and Suarez, so their replacements would really need to step up to the plate.

Again I should stress that I don’t think the club need to go out and buy another player of Suarez ability, I’m happy enough with our attacking options as they are. I just have a slight concern that we might become too reliant on Suarez, which will be like the Torres situation all over again. I’ll need Carroll to prove his worth now that he’s fit again and Gerrard to show some evidence that he’s over his injury problems before my mind will be completely at ease.

I quite like them actually. Although I accept this may be me being over optimistic but I'd like the team you put out if either Meireles or Aquilani were to replace Gerrard.

To a degree I don't think the front 6 are a big problem for us now. It's sorting out the back 4 we need to do. With a solid defence I think the rest of the squad is quite capable of challenging strongly for 3rd.

[RedReet]

Fair play, I was more commenting on the fact that you said Craig deemed their business more of a success than ours. My point was that it was a bit of an apples/oranges comparison. Taking them as a talking point re: what we have done/could have done in the market:

Literally nothing that could realistically have happened would have stopped people worrying/criticising this summers business. We are used to success of at least CL playing variety. People may have been happier with Young than Downing as he is a more fashionably lauded players and has pace but fundamentally people want a Torres/Aguero type signing and it was never going to happen.

Poorly worded.

This has become a bit confusing so I'll leave the Cissokho point out.

Good call.

In terms of attacking leftbacks - if we play two attacking players I think we should cover them going up field by dropping Adam into a CB area and the left CB moving across. Adam has claimed CB is his favoured position (even if I'd suspect not his best, and/or it's just that he doesn't like running about much). We don't have a mobile enough DM to cover across - very few are good enough at that to make it a great option (Makelele, Mascherano and Hargreaves the only one that come to mind).

I did read this, but I think I'd need to see it in practice before I'm comfortable with it being a tactic that Kenny would consider. I did consider Adam moving over to cover the LB, then thought it probably a bit counterproductive as would the LB add more to our attack going forward than Adam who would have to be sacrificed. I suppose I’d have similar concerns with the CB proposal too.

I quite like them actually. Although I accept this may be me being over optimistic but I'd like the team you put out if either Meireles or Aquilani were to replace Gerrard.

To a degree I don't think the front 6 are a big problem for us now. It's sorting out the back 4 we need to do. With a solid defence I think the rest of the squad is quite capable of challenging strongly for 3rd.

Do you think that team would be good enough to trouble Arsenal away on the second game though? Maybe after Sunderland I could be convinced, but at the minute I wouldn’t be confident.

I don’t know what to make of the back 4 situation anymore. I can be quoted often for saying we desperately need a new LB and CB. When I break the CB situation down and consider that Carra will probably be first choice for the majority of games, Agger should always play when fit and Skrtel didn’t miss a game last year and finished the season strongly, I don’t know where this new signing would fit in. I’ve sort of accepted than Kenny sees a new CB as a luxury and he’ll take a punt if he sees a good deal, but won’t be held to ransom.

I’ve almost came round in my LB convictions too and could maybe accept the situation if Aurelio was fit right now, even if he couldn’t be relied upon. Until it was highlighted recently, I didn’t realise just how hard done by Insua was and would be happy to see him play certain games as his record and our results were actually pretty good as a whole. If Aurelio could make even 10-15 games, even rotate him for Insua for easier home games then I think we could get by. Johnson could step in for the harder games when Aurelio is out which would at least give us some solidity at the back based on last years evidence. And of course we also have Robinson and Flanagan who have continued to impress in pre-season. Aurelio is out sadly though (anyone any news?) so I would still prefer us to bring in a more reliable option. Whether Kenny still sees it as a priority, whether he’s waiting on the right deal or whether he’s waiting on maybe selling Insua, who knows?

[dww]

I don’t know what to make of the back 4 situation anymore. I can be quoted often for saying we desperately need a new LB and CB. When I break the CB situation down and consider that Carra will probably be first choice for the majority of games, Agger should always play when fit and Skrtel didn’t miss a game last year and finished the season strongly, I don’t know where this new signing would fit in. I’ve sort of accepted than Kenny sees a new CB as a luxury and he’ll take a punt if he sees a good deal, but won’t be held to ransom.

I’ve almost came round in my LB convictions too and could maybe accept the situation if Aurelio was fit right now, even if he couldn’t be relied upon. Until it was highlighted recently, I didn’t realise just how hard done by Insua was and would be happy to see him play certain games as his record and our results were actually pretty good as a whole. If Aurelio could make even 10-15 games, even rotate him for Insua for easier home games then I think we could get by. Johnson could step in for the harder games when Aurelio is out which would at least give us some solidity at the back based on last years evidence. And of course we also have Robinson and Flanagan who have continued to impress in pre-season. Aurelio is out sadly though (anyone any news?) so I would still prefer us to bring in a more reliable option. Whether Kenny still sees it as a priority, whether he’s waiting on the right deal or whether he’s waiting on maybe selling Insua, who knows?

My problem with the back 4 is not with any of the individuals - I just don't think the balance is right. We have overlapping problems with players aerially and to some degree in terms of pace and ability to play or bring the ball into midfield. When Agger is fit this is minimised but we rely on him too much for such an injury prone player.

The transition from defence to midfield is key for me and Carragher, Sktrel and Johnson are all either too conservatively minded or poor at judging the odds when making it. Insua at times is naive in that way. Aurelio and Agger are great in this regard but we are almost never going to have both in the team.

[RedReet]

My problem with the back 4 is not with any of the individuals - I just don't think the balance is right. We have overlapping problems with players aerially and to some degree in terms of pace and ability to play or bring the ball into midfield. When Agger is fit this is minimised but we rely on him too much for such an injury prone player.

The transition from defence to midfield is key for me and Carragher, Sktrel and Johnson are all either too conservatively minded or poor at judging the odds when making it. Insua at times is naive in that way. Aurelio and Agger are great in this regard but we are almost never going to have both in the team.

I suppose the encouraging thing is our defence did look much better under Kenny, despite all the injury problems. We had an excellent record with Agger in the team IIRC, but even when he got injured again we finished the season strongly with Carra and Skrtel at the back, picking up some good results along the way (bar the last 2 of course). We also had our FB’s changing on a weekly basis and were still pretty sound defensively. Kenny and Clarke will also have had all summer to work with the defenders, so hopefully we’ll see even further improvement.

It will be interesting to see our approach when carrying the ball from defence next year though. When Kenny first took over it was blatantly obvious that the defenders and Pepe were instructed to keep the ball on the deck and pass it out whenever possible. We took a few risks at the back, most notably against Chelsea when Agger near got caught out a few times. I felt there was a noticeable change after that match and we changed our style a bit, taking less chances and playing more direct. I’ve actually just checked and realised Agger only played properly two more times after that game, so I wonder if that was the main reason, or if Chelsea’s high pressing game had much of an influence.

[topscorer]

Whenever I listen to an interview of Comolli about a new signing I think we've just bought the best player in the world

Good summer Comolli, well done