We're a very average, uninspiring, one dimensional side

[tomasjj]

Teams that don't have the financial clout to compete with the top teams is pretty much everyone though.

Can you list the Premiership sides who play football in its proper sense ie passing the ball rather than launching it. I'm thinking Arsenal, Man U, West Ham (tho not seen much of WHU this term).

Agree on both points. However, playing proper footy won't usually do it if teams sit back and shut up shop. We used to beat Manu doing this because we had Michael Owen up front.

[alunevans]

How do you feel when we score? Isn't it worth for that moment alone? It is for me.

Truthfully? I'll confess. It depends.

When a goal is fashioned and created there is a whole load of build up and anticipation which then results in a goal and I go nuts. You get the oooh, ooooooh, oooooooooh, go ooooonnn, ooooooooooooooooooh, YEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!

But when I've been anaesthetised for an hour or so and suddenly the long ball bounces to one of our men and he all of a sudden sticks it in then it doesn't have quite the same reaction.

Often its more relief than jubilation. And its often too sudden to be caught up in the moment. I'm always pleased obviously, but a percentage goal doesn't really compare to a fashioned one.

It depends on the game and the circumstance of course. But typically a goal in such circumstances lacks the euphoria it once did.

[alunevans]

Agree on both points. However, playing proper footy won't usually do it if teams sit back and shut up shop. We used to beat Manu doing this because we had Michael Owen up front.

I know mate. I've moved on from just criticising us though because I reckon Finnish has a point. I'm criticising the game generally. Its not beautiful anymore. The Watford's and Wimbledon's were always remarkable because they were doing something different. Now everybody does it. Charles Hughes rules!

[The Glove]

I can understand that, but wouldn't it be great if there was some sort of change that could be made which ensured that there was that bit more space and time for people to actually play the ball.

It's not just nostalgia. Let's take two CURRENT football spectacles.

The Football Masters 6 a side tournaments that Sky run, or the average premiership match. Which is more entertaining and enjoyable?

The Football Masters Tournaments in my book are far more entertaining and enjoyable displays of football than the real thing.

Things happen in cycles, the defensive style that more and more teams seem to adopt will soon change. What ever style is successful is copied across the board. Once good attacking/flowing football starts to pick up trophies, we'll see more teams play that way. While we are lifting trophies playing like this, it wont change. If (dare I say) United start picking things up by playing some great flowing football then the pattern will change as everyone mirrors them.

[WILF]

I know mate. I've moved on from just criticising us though because I reckon Finnish has a point. I'm criticising the game generally. Its not beautiful anymore. The Watford's and Wimbledon's were always remarkable because they were doing something different. Now everybody does it. Charles Hughes rules!

Joining this a bit late

Football has changed a lot because of fitness coaches, good diet, no Tony Adams et al style drinking, 22 man squads etc

Many , many players now are good(very) athletes rather than gifted footballers.Space on the pitch is at a premium and time on the ball is non-existent. A player like Sissoko, who let's face is more of an athlete than a footballer at the moment, is seen as undropable by many LFC fans.

The game was more beautiful in the past because there was more time on the ball, more fat, unfit , slow players (drunks) ,and therefore skillful players could show off their talent more.

The cream will always rise to the top, Ronaldinho, Henry, Stevie etc but the general style has changed for now.

As for us, 3 points is all that matters until we win no 19, then we can think about style and beauty

[dww]

Things happen in cycles, the defensive style that more and more teams seem to adopt will soon change. What ever style is successful is copied across the board. Once good attacking/flowing football starts to pick up trophies, we'll see more teams play that way. While we are lifting trophies playing like this, it wont change. If (dare I say) United start picking things up by playing some great flowing football then the pattern will change as everyone mirrors them.

I'm not sure it will, only a very few players are capable of producing good attacking football like United have against the athletic players most teams now contain. Most teams simply can't afford them and there are far more physical athletes around which they can.

Modern training and physical conditioning in my opinion favours defensive play. I'm in favour of some sort of changes to the game. A lot of subtle things could be done such as genuinely clamping down on shirt pulling and giving the attackers real advantage when it comes to offsides. But I would support changes such as bigger goals to compensate for the increase in average goalkeeper height (someone told be the average height has increased by 4 inches since 1985 which is quite incredible).

[bazza76]

I'm criticising the game generally. Its not beautiful anymore.

Istanbul? cardiff?
The beautifull game still exists, just try not to get streesed out by it when its not going your way.

[Rich]

That FA Cup final was hardly beautiful, and if it hadn't had the goals it would have been pretty dreadful - it was entertaining because of the nature of the game, but it wasn't much of a spectacle for quality football, IMO.

[alunevans]

Joining this a bit late

Football has changed a lot because of fitness coaches, good diet, no Tony Adams et al style drinking, 22 man squads etc

Many , many players now are good(very) athletes rather than gifted footballers.Space on the pitch is at a premium and time on the ball is non-existent. A player like Sissoko, who let's face is more of an athlete than a footballer at the moment, is seen as undropable by many LFC fans.

The game was more beautiful in the past because there was more time on the ball, more fat, unfit , slow players (drunks) ,and therefore skillful players could show off their talent more.

The cream will always rise to the top, Ronaldinho, Henry, Stevie etc but the general style has changed for now.

As for us, 3 points is all that matters until we win no 19, then we can think about style and beauty

BRING BACK THE BOOZE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[alunevans]

I'm not sure it will, only a very few players are capable of producing good attacking football like United have against the athletic players most teams now contain. Most teams simply can't afford them and there are far more physical athletes around which they can.

Modern training and physical conditioning in my opinion favours defensive play. I'm in favour of some sort of changes to the game. A lot of subtle things could be done such as genuinely clamping down on shirt pulling and giving the attackers real advantage when it comes to offsides. But I would support changes such as bigger goals to compensate for the increase in average goalkeeper height (someone told be the average height has increased by 4 inches since 1985 which is quite incredible).

I think that'd just result in more longshots. If there are any changes then it needs to be something that gives people that bit more time and space on the ball to pass it round.

At the moment, the half way line is the point where you can be offside. Maybe making that "offside line" halfway into the opposing teams half would give more room in midfield.

Though watching the old matches on 442, the thing that I really think has been detrimental to the style of play that teams play these days is the back pass rule.

Then a defender would pass it to the keeper, he'd pick it up and roll it out to the full back. These days a defender in a bit of trouble launches it and so the game takes place in the skies as much as on the floor.

I don't personally think the backpass rule has benefitted the spectacle and beauty of the game. Its speeded it up yes, but its made it much less beautiful too.

[alunevans]

Istanbul? cardiff?
The beautifull game still exists, just try not to get streesed out by it when its not going your way.

My comments are on football generally not Liverpool. There's a lot of footy to watch these days, so my comments are on the game generally.

It was going our way when Ged won us the treble but it was fecking awful then too.

[dww]

I think the backpass rule has had bad and good points. However if the keeper being allowed to keep the ball in his hands for only 3 seconds rule was enforced then I agree with you that the backpass rule is largely redundant and an increase in keepers rolling the ball out rather than hoofing it under pressure would be nice.

Larger goals might well breed more long shots but I genuinely thing it would mean more attacking in general as the odds of scoring would go up. I guess that it would have a more positive effect in Europe than in the PL though. I think it would be worth trying out but also I see that the danger of just ending up with teams punting the ball towards goal from the halfway line all the time has to be guarded against.

I definitely like the idea of an offside line. In general I don't like the offside law as I'm pretty convinced it is nearly always physically impossible for the assistant to keep both necissary references in his field of view at the same time. Anything that minimises it's importance while preventing goal hanging would be a good move IMO.

[alunevans]

Another rule could be that every player has to go out and get bladdered the night before a game

[TartanTerror]

I wonder if teams would still stick to defensive football if the point diffference was increased between a win and a tie - maybe on the order of 1:4 or maybe even 1:5. This would make a draw only marginally better than a loss and maybe teams would "gamble" more frequently for the win. It seems to me with the current 1:3 ratio that teams can afford to settle for the draw.

North American Ice Hockey had similar struggles with the Neutral Zone trap - a mind-numbingly boring (but effective) defensive system of play with which the New Jersey Devils and Dallas Stars won the Stanley cup. More teams started to copy it, and play became worse. The league made some changes such as eliminating the 2 line pass, shrinking the size of goalie gear, and trying to eliminate the clutching and grabbing. I think they have a better product as a result.

Our equivalent in football would be to 1.) As someone already suggested, push the "offside" line to a point somewhere in the attacking half of the field 2.) Enlarge the goals 3.) Retrospective yellow cards for diving 4.) Maybe revamp the point system again as I mentioned above. I think these items would improve the flow of the game and encourage teams to attack. Just my thoughts anyway.

[Mattshark]

Haha... I was only joking, mate.
I don't really care, just wanted to share my differing view.

I guess changing your mind now would be hard since you have wasted so much time trashing the WC... like you said.

The WC had Argentina v Mexico.... Now that was a great game!