Vaughan quits as one day captain...

[Red Chilli]

We were but then you inexplicably said you reckon his technique is "very poor" - and dismissed him as simply "a good county player" - which is patently bollocks.

Why does that mean we are now talking about Tests?

IF you want me to explain why his technique is poor in ODI's I will. He leaves too big a gate when playing/driving on the off side and gets out very early in his innings and is a slow starter.
So now are you going to explain your "patently bollocks" comment?

You said you can't accept that he's good enough to put one over the Aussies - when he's done as much several times already, both in ODIs and Tests.

Come on then, name the occasions.

[Shaggy]

• First Test in the last Ashes: 96
• Second Test: 206 Only the third EVER Englishman to hit a double century in Australia. Must be that dodgy technique.
• Commonwealth Bank series: consecutive ODI centuries against NZ and Australia, only the 8th Englishman ever to do. Also MOM in the final, top scoring with 70.

He averages 36 against Australia in ODIs with a highest score of 120 not out.

An unequivocal success both in the Test and ODI arenas. Looks like that big gate he leaves is giving him real problems.

[Red Chilli]

EDIT- You've changed your original claim that he has an average of 45 or something


Don't know where you get your stats from but here are his stats from cricinfo.com

.......Mat Inns NO Runs HS . Ave .. BF .. SR .. 100 50.. 4s .. 6s
Tests 23 . 43...4..1686 206 43.23 3882 43.43 .4 .. 4 ..180.. 12
ODIs 121 110 25 .2966 120*34.89 4019 73.79 4 ..15.. 218 ..29

Average of 35 in ODI's, nothing to write home about especailly comapred to Pietersen

[Shaggy]

EDIT- You've changed your original claim that he has an average of 45 or something


Don't know where you get your stats from but here are his stats from cricinfo.com


Average of 35 in ODI's, nothing to write home about especailly comapred to Pietersen

You asked for examples and I provided them.

As for "the edit", I was simply looking at the wrong column.

Suddenly you're shifting the goalposts from Collingwood being "not good enough" to now having an average not comparable to Pietersen's - tell us something we don't know.

Captaincy has not very much at all to do with having a good average.

[Red Chilli]

You asked for examples and I provided them.

As for "the edit", I was simply looking at the wrong column.

Suddenly you're shifting the goalposts from Collingwood being "not good enough" to now having an average not comparable to Pietersen's - tell us something we don't know.

Captaincy has not very much at all to do with having a good average.

Neither has technique Shaggy, as David Trezeguet will testify.

You brought up made up averages to prove your point that he has a good technique when in fact it does nothing of the sort.

He has a poor technique, like it or not Shaggy, and I have explained it. So it is no longer "inexplicable"

As for your examples "every dog has his day", you've hardly overwhelmed me with all these examples. The pitches in Australia were flat.

[Shaggy]

Neither has technique Shaggy, as David Trezeguet will testify.

You brought up made up averages to prove your point that he has a good technique when in fact it does nothing of the sort.

He has a poor technique, like it or not Shaggy, and I have explained it. So it is no longer "inexplicable"

As for your examples "every dog has his day", you've hardly overwhelmed me with all these examples. The pitches in Australia were flat.

Made up averages? Sorry? The averages in my post above are all factually correct.

Trezeguet has absolutely nothing to do with this topic.

You're right - technique has **** all to do with credentials for being a good captain - so why did you bring it up in the first place?

Flat pitches? You've got an excuse for seemingly every good performance of Collingwood's.

You are clearly missing my point by about a hundred million miles if you think my "point" is about his technique. That's you blathering on about that - not me.

My point is that he is a proven international cricketer suitable for the ODI captaincy - whether you like it or not - and he is far better than "a good county player", as you dismiss him.

[Red Chilli]

Made up averages? Sorry? The averages in my post above are all factually correct.

Trezeguet has absolutely nothing to do with this topic.

You're right - technique has **** all to do with credentials for being a good captain - so why did you bring it up in the first place?

Flat pitches? You've got an excuse for seemingly every good performance of Collingwood's.

You are clearly missing my point by about a hundred million miles if you think my "point" is about his technique. That's you blathering on about that - not me.

My point is that he is a proven international cricketer suitable for the ODI captaincy - whether you like it or not - and he is far better than "a good county player", as you dismiss him.

My original point is that his place is vulnerable and therefore he is not suitable to be captain of the team, just as Vaughan wasn't. And Vaughan has a better record in Tests than Collingwood. Vaughan's technique at ODI cricket was not good enough, the same could happen to Collingwood.

[Shaggy]

Fair enough. I disagree like, but fair enough.

IMO Collingwood is one of the first names on the teamsheet. He's one of our best one-day bats, is our single best fielder by a mile and is a useful bowler.

[Red Chilli]

Fair enough. I disagree like, but fair enough.

IMO Collingwood is one of the first names on the teamsheet. He's one of our best one-day bats, is our single best fielder by a mile and is a useful bowler.

Agree about the fielding.

BTW: The cricket is going well isn't it?

[TheStig]

I think Collingwood is the best option.

I really like Pietersen, but he should be left to concentrate on batting.

Agree with Shaggy, I think Collingwood is a more rounded player.

[Neil Young]

I'd like to see Sobers given his chance. OK so he's 93 and from Barbados but he's better than the other candidates.

[captainfog]

Colly for captain








and keeper

[Shaggy]

BTW: The cricket is going well isn't it?

An excellent three days, although the Windies are shockingly poor. What a sorry state of affairs West Indian cricket is.

[Red Chilli]

An excellent three days, although the Windies are shockingly poor. What a sorry state of affairs West Indian cricket is.

and they have such talented youngsters

It's a shocking state of affairs. In the past, all the other nations were shockingly unprofessional and generally disorganised and the WIndies greatness could shine through. Now their in-fighting and political selections combined with complete disorganisation leab=ves them well behind the organised professional Test nations.

[Neil Young]

It's a shame but I think you (no doubt inadvertently) do a disservice to the great West Indies teams of the seventies and eighties. They didn't just shine because the other teams were unprofessional (I don't even think that's true, according to the standards of the time at least) but because they were probably the best cricket team ever.