Tour de France

[RichC]

Right, but those suspicions should have been investigated by the TUE approval process.

They either were investigated thoroughly, and the thing was approved with a good reason. Or they weren't investigated thoroughly, which means the implementation of the system is not fit for purpose.

The system is certainly the issue but it doesn't look great on Wiggins in all of this.

[RichC]

Yes, but it had to be approved by independent doctors. If they didn't want him to take them then they should have said so at the time. It's not like he did it without asking. And I'm not sure it's that suspicious, if you suffer from mild asthma and allergies then the one time you want to take medication for that is right before a big race rather than risk blowing up with breathing difficulties mid stage.

And doctors can't be coerced or tricked into signing something.

The main issue is the system it's open for abuse and as such there will be those that take advantage of that.

I'm sorry but after seeing so many drug cheats in sport I find it hard to buy he only needed these drugs injected just before grand tours.

I guess time will tell if he's a poor victim of circumstance or not.

[dom9]

The system is certainly the issue but it doesn't look great on Wiggins in all of this.

I disagree.

There is a clear rule book. If I go to the governing body and ask them to approve me taking a substance, and they say "yes - fill your boots", then I'm going to do it.

It's endorsed by the rule by makers, so it is completely 100% valid, and any fallout is not down to me, it's down to whoever approved the medication.

[RichC]

I disagree.

There is a clear rule book. If I go to the governing body and ask them to approve me taking a substance, and they say "yes - fill your boots", then I'm going to do it.

It's endorsed by the rule by makers, so it is completely 100% valid, and any fallout is not down to me, it's down to whoever approved the medication.

Passing the buck just to rule maker is also wrong, yes they need to be more stringent but if you just need to go to a doctor and get him to sign a form to say this is ok then yes the rues aren't strong enough but you're also not blameless if you're are trying to bend the rules to cheating.

Wiggins could be innocent he could be guilty I think only him and a small handful will really know, I hope he's innocent to be honest but I don't agree with the blame lies fully with the policy makers. Integrity is also something you yourself should have and again Wiggins may or may not have that in all of this, I don't know.

I guess we'll see what the outcome is from the UKAD investigation

[captainfog]

And doctors can't be coerced or tricked into signing something.

The main issue is the system it's open for abuse and as such there will be those that take advantage of that.

I'm sorry but after seeing so many drug cheats in sport I find it hard to buy he only needed these drugs injected just before grand tours.

I guess time will tell if he's a poor victim of circumstance or not.

That's just baseless speculation though, isn't it. Nobody has even accused him of doing that.

[RichC]

And I am not accusing him of that either read what I said - it's an observation that doctors COULD be coerced not saying that Wiggins has actually done so .

[dom9]

Passing the buck just to rule maker is also wrong, yes they need to be more stringent but if you just need to go to a doctor and get him to sign a form to say this is ok then yes the rues aren't strong enough but you're also not blameless if you're are trying to bend the rules to cheating.

Wiggins could be innocent he could be guilty I think only him and a small handful will really know, I hope he's innocent to be honest but I don't agree with the blame lies fully with the policy makers. Integrity is also something you yourself should have and again Wiggins may or may not have that in all of this, I don't know.

I guess we'll see what the outcome is from the UKAD investigation

I don't think it is passing the buck at all.

The buck is already with the rules and their implementation.

If the rules allow you to explicitly allow athletes to seek exemption from them, then the process around implementing them must be seen to be bullet proof.

It's the 100% process, not the player at fault in this case.

[Vermilion]

The rules may be the rules, and they may not have broken them, but for me, they held themselves up as being the future of cycling, a clean team, calling out for a clean sport and setting that example.

If they have now used those rules to give one or more of their cyclists and advantage by using performance enhancing drugs, at extremely crucial times at big events, then for me they have been quite disingenuous as a team.

[gratziani]

TUE's that were known and approved dont see what the problem is.

Every sport has them for athletes with asthma and hayfever sufferers (which i suffer from and used to have the injection every year until they stopped on the NHS and **** me it made the summer bearable instead of being stuck indoors all the time zonked and laid low)

[Liverpool]

the one good thing about all this, one of middle managers can no longer say ' i'm not a fan of sport but what Team sky achieved with dave brailsford is really inspiring, marginal gains to achieve great success, thats want I want us to achieve with our resources'

nah lad it was a truck load of money and a load of drugs

[Shaggy]

Brailsford next?

[ame]https://twitter.com/5liveSport/status/789179634810105857[/ame]

[RichC]

Not this side of Xmas I don't think, not unless something more comes out. I'd not be surprised to see him disappear maybe early next year though

[Buzzo]

Throws doubt over everything but really confirms everything we suspected given the ludicrously flimsy nature of their defence. Dodgy as **** from Sir Wiggins et al.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/43281807

[Alex]

I have no idea why Cycling is still a sport at the moment. Nothing is left untainted. Im sure its rife in other sports, but you watch knowing every single rider is doing something to gain an advantage.

Whats the point in regulating if everyone is doing it?

[Buzzo]

I agree.

"Crossing the ethical line"

Its cheating really isn't it. Basically hammering the TUE law.

• The absence of any references to any asthma illness in 2012 by Wiggins in his book.
• The timing of Wiggins' medical exemption applications, just before major races.
• Sutton's admission in a BBC documentary last year that Team Sky used TUEs to "find the gains".
• The inconsistencies and inaccuracies in Team Sky's initial explanations for the 'jiffy-bag' delivery, and Brailsford's apparent request to the Daily Mail to consider a deal that would make the story 'go away'.
• The absence of any medical records at a team that prided itself on its attention to detail, and which has conveniently made establishing what was in the 'jiffy bag' so far impossible.
• The unavailability of Dr Freeman, now under investigation by the GMC, supposedly due to illness.
• The apparent theft of his laptop while on holiday in Greece on which data was kept.
• British Cycling's "chaotic" medical storeroom which they shared with Team Sky, compounding the potential hindering of the Ukad investigation, as revealed by a secret letter the BBC obtained and published in January.
• The unexplained mystery delivery of testosterone patches to the national velodrome in 2011.
• The BBC's exclusive interviews with two former Team Sky riders - Josh Edmondson and Jonathan Tiernan-Locke - both of whom spoke about the unethical use of controversial painkiller Tramadol while on the team's books.

See page 29 of the report where we're told that Wiggins may have been treated with triamcinolone on up to nine occasions, during a four-year period, and that: "It would be hard to know what possible medical need could have required such a seemingly excessive use of this drug... [it] seriously calls into question David Brailsford's assertion that Team Sky only use medicines to treat medical need."

Fairly damning.