Post match thread

[kurtangle01]

Your idea of showing support IS sticking your head in the sand.

Today was ****e. You just said it yourself. However, when i say the same, i'm not showing support. I support the club and Rafa isnt delivering. I want the club to do the best that it can and if the current man is failing in that job, then i want someone who can succeed.

You seem to be content with fighting for 4th place. I'm not.

It could be argued that people who are happy with things as they are dont care enough - but you dont find me questioning YOUR support.

Yet you go round questioning the support of others.

Classy stuff.

I care very much, mate. I love this club and if I didn't I wouldn't spend almost all of my spare cash on it going to matches etc... I'm dissapointed today, as are you, but I wont be calling for the managers head. Neither shoud you.

The bigger picture to me is that as a whole we have improved in the time Rafa has been here and will continue to improve. A few dodgy results doesn't change that.

Look at the youth set up and reserves since his arrival to see that he's trying to build the club not only for now but for the future aswell.

He's the man for the job and the man who will hopefully be in charge for years to come so that he can help the club and the team progress.

You're on here having a go every week and while you might think that shows you care I'd preffer to adopt a different stance of actually supporting the club and the people within it.

The modern day culture of football fans is very different though and some are as fickle and spoiled as they come. They want it and they want it now. I realise that not every one's the same though and opposing views and opinions are what a forum like this is for but some of the hyperbole spouted is really laughable. Like saying winning something doesn't cut it. I bet you'd still be celebrating if we did though, eh?

[Red_hot]

knock him out scott lad

[dww]

1. Too many of our players are out of form/low on confidence at the same time. Add Sami and Alonso coming back from injury and being off the boil, and we look crap.

2. Sad that our defence is so slow that we have to sit so deep. Our team was overstretched as a result.

3. Kuyt and Crouch does not work. Rafa should know this by now. NO DYNAMIC with them.

4. Taking off Babel, our only pacy player on the pitch....

5. Depressing, but we will beat them easily at Anfield. Another good runout for fringe players, and Luton get the bob they were crying for.

To be honest I thought he had faded badly from the game. there were plenty of other candidates to come off but I wouldn't have exempted him from being hauled off.

[kurtangle01]

knock him out scott lad

[Robster007]

1. Too many of our players are out of form/low on confidence at the same time. Add Sami and Alonso coming back from injury and being off the boil, and we look crap.

2. Sad that our defence is so slow that we have to sit so deep. Our team was overstretched as a result.

3. Kuyt and Crouch does not work. Rafa should know this by now. NO DYNAMIC with them.

4. Taking off Babel, our only pacy player on the pitch....

5. Depressing, but we will beat them easily at Anfield. Another good runout for fringe players, and Luton get the bob they were crying for.

[Craig_H]

We shouldn't be able to challenge Man U and Chelsea because we can't compete with them in the transfer market. Arsenal will be the next team we can't compete with and maybe even City.

That means that fourth place will be a realistic goal if Rafa isn't backed in the transfer market.

If we finish higher than that then it's a very good result. Of course I want us to win the title but that isn't realistic and it's unfair to expect that we should win the league until we can match the big teams in the transfer market.

Why cant we compete, but Arsenal can?

Ultimately, whether we 'can' compete or not, we can certainly be better than 20 points off the pace. We can certainly beat Brum, Spurs, Wigan, Reading, Pompey etc etc. And fecking Luton.

I dont agree that we cant compete, when Rafa picks the right system and the best players, we're excellent. That's the frustration, it's not that we're not good enough to challenge, it's that Rafa makes it harder for himself by pissing about with ****e players who arent good enough.

[PaulLinehan]

I named you because it's always you. You love saying I told you so. Every week, mate, every week it's the same with you.

I'm not sticking my head in the sand. We were ****e today and I said so but you just seem to want Rafa's head on a platter, mate.

Show some support, eh?

the very fact that you emphasised "every week" twice means that, in one sense, DJ is right.... because lately it seems like these ****e performances are EVERY WEEK!!!

[Craig_H]

I care very much, mate. I love this club and if I didn't I wouldn't spend almost all of my spare cash on it going to matches etc... I'm dissapointed today, as are you, but I wont be calling for the managers head. Neither shoud you.

The bigger picture to me is that as a whole we have improved in the time Rafa has been here and will continue to improve. A few dodgy results doesn't change that.

Look at the youth set up and reserves since his arrival to see that he's trying to build the club not only for now but for the future aswell.

He's the man for the job and the man who will hopefully be in charge for years to come so that he can help the club and the team progress.

You're on here having a go every week and while you might think that shows you care I'd preffer to adopt a different stance of actually supporting the club and the people within it.

The modern day culture of football fans is very different though and some are as fickle and spoiled as they come. They want it and they want it now. I realise that not every one's the same though and opposing views and opinions are what a forum like this is for but some of the hyperbole spouted is really laughable. Like saying winning something doesn't cut it. I bet you'd still be celebrating if we did though, eh?

If i dont think the manager will take the club as far as it's capable of going, why SHOULDNT i want someone better? I dont understand your logic here.

I want the best for the club and the available evidence is suggesting to me that Rafa cant achieve that.

As for 'wanting it now', Rafa's in his FOURTH year and despite what you might say about improvement, i'm afraid the league tables dont back you up.

Four years is enough to be making a PROPER challenge. Not winning it is fine. Being out of it in January AGAIN isnt good enough and i cant believe you think it is.

[PaulLinehan]

If i dont think the manager will take the club as far as it's capable of going, why SHOULDNT i want someone better? I dont understand your logic here.

I want the best for the club and the available evidence is suggesting to me that Rafa cant achieve that.

As for 'wanting it now', Rafa's in his FOURTH year and despite what you might say about improvement, i'm afraid the league tables dont back you up.

Four years is enough to be making a PROPER challenge. Not winning it is fine. Being out of it in January AGAIN isnt good enough and i cant believe you think it is.

[kurtangle01]

If i dont think the manager will take the club as far as it's capable of going, why SHOULDNT i want someone better? I dont understand your logic here.

I want the best for the club and the available evidence is suggesting to me that Rafa cant achieve that.

As for 'wanting it now', Rafa's in his FOURTH year and despite what you might say about improvement, i'm afraid the league tables dont back you up.

Four years is enough to be making a PROPER challenge. Not winning it is fine. Being out of it in January AGAIN isnt good enough and i cant believe you think it is.

As I said before. I'd love to see us challenging but it's not our right to do so. These things can take time and yes it can be frustrating but if you look at the filth now. They're where they are because they kept faith in their manager.

It's no mistake that some of the longest serving managers in the league are the most succesful.

I still think that it may be the seasn after next that Rafa is able to seriously challenge. As long as we improve in the meantime is what matters.

[Craig_H]

As I said before. I'd love to see us challenging but it's not our right to do so. These things can take time and yes it can be frustrating but if you look at the filth now. They're where they are because they kept faith in their manager.

It's no mistake that some of the longest serving managers in the league are the most succesful.

I still think that it may be the seasn after next that Rafa is able to seriously challenge. As long as we improve in the meantime is what matters.

It's not our right, but with the money we've spent and some of the players we have, we SHOULD be challenging. I wonder if you'd EVER say Rafa should go, WHATEVER happened. I could see you being content to keep the manager if we finished 8th or something. Bizarre.

As for improving in the meantime - that's just my point, we havent and we arent.

[kurtangle01]

It's not our right, but with the money we've spent and some of the players we have, we SHOULD be challenging. I wonder if you'd EVER say Rafa should go, WHATEVER happened. I could see you being content to keep the manager if we finished 8th or something. Bizarre.

As for improving in the meantime - that's just my point, we havent and we arent.

Two CL finals, winning one, and our highest points tally in he prem suggests that we are improving.

Obviously if we were finishing 8th he should go but we aren't, are we? That's just bollocks to try and suit your argument.

[Darth Marty]

what I am certain of is that the whole framework of our beloved club is/has improved 100 times, from the youth setup, to fitness levels, scouting, buying & selling and eventually down to our 1st XI...it has improved and will continue to do so, sacking Rafa now would undo 90% of all that hard work and set us back even further. If in 3 seasons time we are playing like this then sack Rafa, and i bet he wouldnt mind then because he knows whats expected of him. That said he should be given far more support from the owners than he has been getting, its ****ing disgraceful that the cunts havent ended this bull**** scenario.

[vonk]

It's not our right, but with the money we've spent and some of the players we have, we SHOULD be challenging. I wonder if you'd EVER say Rafa should go, WHATEVER happened. I could see you being content to keep the manager if we finished 8th or something. Bizarre.

As for improving in the meantime - that's just my point, we havent and we arent.

Agreed DJS. I want Liverpool to succeed, preferably with Rafa, but if its without him, so be it. I'm a Liverpool fan as opposed to a fan of individuals. I don't see how we have improved where it matters, on the pitch. We look devoid of ideas, unmotivated and our football is poor. It's sad because I'm struggling to remember a performance that really got me excited since Derby.

[kurtangle01]

what I am certain of is that the whole framework of our beloved club is/has improved 100 times, from the youth setup, to fitness levels, scouting, buying & selling and eventually down to our 1st XI...it has improved and will continue to do so, sacking Rafa now would undo 90% of all that hard work and set us back even further. If in 3 seasons time we are playing like this then sack Rafa, and i bet he wouldnt mind then because he knows whats expected of him. That said he should be given far more support from the owners than he has been getting, its ****ing disgraceful that the cunts havent ended this bull**** scenario.