Rafa's Last Season?

[dww]

Only a complete buffoon would say "win the title or you're out" when theres teams of the quality of Utd and Chelsea in our league. A challenge yeah fair enough but demanding the title is ridiculous.

why? was the same not said to houllier. i remember a banner in the kop one year practically saying this.

why was souness, evans, houllier all sacked if not because they could not deliver the title.

only a prick would think otherwise.

The name calling stops here or people go on holiday.

[rage]

So you'd say to the manager "Go and win the league over the League and European Champions or you're out?". Houllier wasnt sacked because he couldnt deliver the title, he was sacked because we werent even challenging for it.

houllier challenged. i distinctively remember him finishing second one year. i'm not sure how closer you can get to challenging without winning it.

evans also challenged i remember we being in with a chance all the way upto the run in one season.

i like to think that we set our standards in winning the title regardless of who the competition is. and yes i expect us to win the title ahead of utd.

i don't go for the 'we just need to challenge' argument to keep rafa. he's had long enough to go out and win it.

who was our last manager to not win the league in 5 years and still be in a job? houllier? evans? souness? dalglish? fagan? paisely?

shanks picked us up in the old second division so he doesn't count as far as i'm concerned.

[rage]

The name calling stops here or people go on holiday.

can i be childish and say he started it?

[Chris]

houllier challenged. i distinctively remember him finishing second one year. i'm not sure how closer you can get to challenging without winning it.

And look what happened in the 2 seasons after it, thats why he was sacked, he wasnt CHALLENGING, christ this is like talking to a brick wall. I give up. You win.

[rage]

And look what happened in the 2 seasons after it, thats why he was sacked, he wasnt CHALLENGING, christ this is like talking to a brick wall. I give up. You win.

i don't want to have an internet squabble where i win

i just don't see why our expectations under rafa should be lower than previous managers. rafa didn't challenge last year and that was his 4th season so why wasn't he sacked?

imo the only thing that kept him in a job was the clever way he swayed the opinion of the fans to back him against the owners.

he needs to win the title this year and its looking good so far.

[mersey86]

I hope a lot of the posters on this site are Mancs and Chavs on a subtle wind-up. Because Liverpool supporters who don't have a decent word for the club are a bit of an embarrassment.

[dww]

can i be childish and say he started it?

I'd rather you didn't though.

And look what happened in the 2 seasons after it, thats why he was sacked, he wasnt CHALLENGING, christ this is like talking to a brick wall. I give up. You win.

I just think you have to accept that some people have different opinions here. I think both sides of this debate have become a bit entrenched at this stage.

It seems reasonable (to me) to say that there is a difference between many of the previous managers and Rafa that mean that I think the position of needing a challenge rather than winning is the most sensible. Firstly I think that in several of the previous regimes a squad was inherited that was one of the best in the league and had more potential - I really don't think that was true of what Rafa inherited. I also think that external features such as the strength of the teams around us and their greater finances was different to how things had been before.

Also Rafa has in his favour the fact he has established us as one of Europe's best sides whether he has won the domestic league or not. We hadn't really been able to say that on a regular basis for a long time.

That doesn't mean that there isn't a legitimate position where the only metric of success is the PL.

I really do believe though that any regime change in the position we are in financially and in terms of building things behind the scenes would be a huge retrograde step - almost no matter who came in.

[dww]

I hope a lot of the posters on this site are Mancs and Chavs on a subtle wind-up. Because Liverpool supporters who don't have a decent word for the club are a bit of an embarrassment.

It would seem slightly pointless, no? I really think that this sort of accusation helps no one - I don't see any current posters who 'don't have a decent word for the club'. Some of them do genuinely dislike the current management but I think all of them do care about the club and want us to be a success.

[pezzzer]

i don't want to have an internet squabble where i win

i just don't see why our expectations under rafa should be lower than previous managers. rafa didn't challenge last year and that was his 4th season so why wasn't he sacked?

imo the only thing that kept him in a job was the clever way he swayed the opinion of the fans to back him against the owners.

he needs to win the title this year and its looking good so far.

rage just grow a set and tell it like it is (in your fooked up world) you and sarb want rafa out, you are in the minority but hey, your intitled to your opinions mate!

[Crazy-Horse]

Why do I get the impression that there are some fans out there, who (if) when we do win the title this year, will still be negative towards Rafa, and all the credit will all go to the players, the fans support, global warming or Rick Parry.

Walk on

[Redspin]

houllier challenged. i distinctively remember him finishing second one year. i'm not sure how closer you can get to challenging without winning it.

evans also challenged i remember we being in with a chance all the way upto the run in one season.

i like to think that we set our standards in winning the title regardless of who the competition is. and yes i expect us to win the title ahead of utd.

i don't go for the 'we just need to challenge' argument to keep rafa. he's had long enough to go out and win it.

who was our last manager to not win the league in 5 years and still be in a job? houllier? evans? souness? dalglish? fagan? paisely?

shanks picked us up in the old second division so he doesn't count as far as i'm concerned.

Shankly won the league in 1964 and 1966 with the FA Cup in between and then went 7 years until 1973 before winning the league again and he wasn't sacked for the total lack of a trophy in that period.

You can't just exclude him because it doesn't fit your argument that our managers going 5 years without winning the title didn't keep their jobs - because he clearly did

[vonk]

There are lots of fans who want Rafa out now. We all know some of them. At the start of the season every fan realised that we needed to mount a sustained title challenge to keep Rafa in a job. Another season of being out of it by January would have been the end after 5 seasons. Winning it would be a bonus. For me, just being in the mix with a few weeks left would be enough. Of course, we all want to win the thing, and we've all been frustrated (even Nicey, I would wager!) at our recent inability to open up a sizeable lead. We've defo had opportunities that we may regret come May. But so far, Rafa has kept up his part of the bargain, in that we are putting in a strong challenge. Unless there is a total collapse in the next two months, we are going to be in with a shout and that will keep Rafa in his job.

[Manofthebog]

Daft thread this.

Some people really need to take a long hard look in the mirror.

Get rid of rafa? Is it 1st April already?

Retarded people, seriously.

Go support someone else. Honestly.

[Clapper]

Why don't you comment the post instead of laughing?
Or do you prefer not to comment like the time one poster listed what Fergie and Wenger have won in their first 5 years?

[Clapper]

Fergusons 5 years

Here is Fergusons first 5 years in the league with ManUre :
86/87 : 11
87/88 : 2
88/89 : 11
89/90 : 13
90/91 : 6
It is widely believed, that Ferguson was one cup-game from being sacked in 89/90, but even though his league positions the first 5 years doesn't show much improvement, I think that the ManUre supporters are happy, that they didn't have a Manchester-Rage as the chairman.