Perspective and perception. Is Rafa a victim of his own success?

[Baldemort]

How many games have we drawn? How many of those drawn games could have been prevented had different players been on the pitch? I don't mean to single out players but Lucas has been a big culprit and caused us to drop points at Wigan and lose against Everton. Why does Rafa wait until the 65th minute to make a substitution in games where we're clearly struggling? The signing of Robbie Keane was a mistake (it doesn't matter who apparently made the signing, but Rafa gave the initial OK to the transfer and could have prevented it if he wanted). The list of mistakes this season has been endless.

If he's making 'more' mistakes than before, then why are we where we are in the league. We have progressed have we not?

[Craig_H]

If he's making 'more' mistakes than before, then why are we where we are in the league. We have progressed have we not?

I dont think it's as easily quantifiable as simply 'more' or 'less' mistakes.

It's also down to whether those mistakes have actually cost us and how often. He can make more mistakes, but they could cost us less. Or he could make less mistakes, but they might ALL prove costly.

[saj]

If he's making 'more' mistakes than before, then why are we where we are in the league. We have progressed have we not?

Why is our home form this year worse than say Rafa's second season?

[EwarWoo]

Why is our home form this year worse than say Rafa's second season?

If he's doing so much worse why are we in second place and still in with a shout for the title race?

[Tee]

I was talking about Chelsea and Arsenal.

Sorry dude.

[Craig_H]

Sorry dude.

No need for apologies mate. I wish it WAS the mancs who were having the stinker.

[Woobus]

Where am I have supposed to ****ed off to 'anyways'?

Why should he still be experimenting after almost being in charge for 5 years? Don't you think it's poor management if a manager is still experimenting after 5 years in charge? And if you read my original post, I'm not pro or against Rafa. I don't support Rafa - I support Liverpool FC. No manager, player is bigger than the club.

Of course he should be, I doubt any manager in the top half is still playing the same type of football as 5 years ago. United certainly arent playing the same style of football as previous years.
Its ever changing and you need to keep changing with it. That could well be Wengers problem as he hasnt moved along with the league enough.

[Craig_H]

If he's doing so much worse why are we in second place and still in with a shout for the title race?

Because our away form has been good and because nobody else had a particularly good first half of the season?

So far, we've not actually dropped as many home points as last season, so if we win more or less all of the remaining home games, the home record will actually have improved.

Having said that, our overall league record last season was nowhere near good enough for a title challenge, so it has HAD to improve if we wanted to mount one.

[Woobus]

Why does Rafa wait until the 65th minute to make a substitution in games where we're clearly struggling?

How many times has using subs in the 65 minute paid off? If he had of made his subs at half time then they might not have been able to create as much mayhem against a very tired defense.
Its a very tiring argument with no evidence that making changes that early on would have changed the result, while there is evidence his subs at 65 minute have changed plenty of games in our favour.

[saj]

If he's doing so much worse why are we in second place and still in with a shout for the title race?

Why have United gone from being 8/9 points behind us, to being 2 ahead of us in the last month? And remember, there's no prizes for finishing second - regardless of whether you've improved on the previous season

[EwarWoo]

Because our away form has been good and because nobody else had a particularly good first half of the season?

But surely that indicates the league is tighter and he's not making more mistakes it's just harder to get the results?

I keep doing teh math in my head and I can't for the life of me work out how our vast improvement in position is in no way down to Rafa improving things?

When we drop points it's Rafa's fault and we're ****, when we gain position it's cos everyone else is **** and we still are?

We've been listening to too much WUM material from the scum fans me thinks. Some of us are starting to believe it.

We're improving. If they try to take that way from us I tell 'em where to get off. Our own fans trying to take it away from us and repeating their crap just buffudles me.

[saj]

How many times has using subs in the 65 minute paid off? If he had of made his subs at half time then they might not have been able to create as much mayhem against a very tired defense.
Its a very tiring argument with no evidence that making changes that early on would have changed the result, while there is evidence his subs at 65 minute have changed plenty of games in our favour.

There's no argument for or against making early/late substitutions. But one thing is for sure, why wait until the 65th minute to take off a player who's played poorly for 65 minutes when you can take them off after 45/50?

[Fierce]

But surely that indicates the league is tighter and he's not making more mistakes it's just harder to get the results?

I keep doing teh math in my head and I can't for the life of me work out how our vast improvement in position is in no way down to Rafa improving things?

When we drop points it's Rafa's fault and we're ****, when we gain position it's cos everyone else is **** and we still are?

We've been listening to too much WUM material from the scum fans me thinks. Some of us are starting to believe it.

We're improving. If they try to take that way from us I tell 'em where to get off. Our own fans trying to take it away from us and repeating their crap just buffudles me.

This is the crux of the argument for me. So many people on this site and I'm assuming others too seem to hold this belief. Its bollocks

[Craig_H]

But surely that indicates the league is tighter and he's not making more mistakes it's just harder to get the results?

I keep doing teh math in my head and I can't for the life of me work out how our vast improvement in position is in no way down to Rafa improving things?

When we drop points it's Rafa's fault and we're ****, when we gain position it's cos everyone else is **** and we still are?

We've been listening to too much WUM material from the scum fans me thinks. Some of us are starting to believe it.

We're improving. If they try to take that way from us I tell 'em where to get off. Our own fans trying to take it away from us and repeating their crap just buffudles me.

As i was saying before, it's hard to say he's made 'more' mistakes or 'less' mistakes, it just isnt possible to quantify it that simply.

Of course he deserves credit for the positive stuff, only a fool would suggest otherwise.

I think the disappointment from dropping so many home points, as well as the realisation that we'd be walking this league now if we hadnt, is what makes people jump to conclusions and they're reaching wrong ones in many cases.

I'd say that part of the reason for the dropped home points is down to Rafa's cautious nature. But that same cautious nature has allowed us to hold our own in tougher games like Chelsea away, and then from that equilabriam position, go on to pinch a winner.

Works both ways, of course it does.

[Kenneth]

As i was saying before, it's hard to say he's made 'more' mistakes or 'less' mistakes, it just isnt possible to quantify it that simply.

Of course he deserves credit for the positive stuff, only a fool would suggest otherwise.

I think the disappointment from dropping so many home points, as well as the realisation that we'd be walking this league now if we hadnt, is what makes people jump to conclusions and they're reaching wrong ones in many cases.

I'd say that part of the reason for the dropped home points is down to Rafa's cautious nature. But that same cautious nature has allowed us to hold our own in tougher games like Chelsea away, and then from that equilabriam position, go on to pinch a winner.

Works both ways, of course it does.

So it's basically Rafa's inability to adapt appropriately that is the problem