Ryan Babel's goal

[Guest]

rafa cant possibly rate him when he continually overlooks him to start games in place of voronin or ngog. 12 mill he was and he shows signs of that when he gets longer than a 15 min spell to influence games. he not a defencsive player so why play him on the left when rafa uses the wide players to track back and defend. torres may be ****ed with injury so let him recover and give babel the front man position.

I think Rafa wants Babel to earn his place rather than get it because of his talents. I mean, Voronin and Ngog are probably deserving of a place more because they are actually showing signs they can fit into the team pattern. Babel seems to drift in and out.

[Exiled_red]

For me Babel scored a great goal but everything else he did was poor. Ironically the goal was the hardest thing to do, and that sums him up and is why he is so frustrating, you know he is capable of moments of brilliance but his play beyond that is below average. And at the moment those moments of brilliance are too few and far between to get him a game IMO.

Having said that he offered more in the game than Voronin and with our current (desperate) situation I'd probably pick him ahead of Voronin

[BFG]

Not many people can smash a ball into the net from 25 yards???

We have 6 players that can do that Its a pretty rare occasion that he gets past his man.

He's not completely useless, but he will never amount to the player we need, and Riera is much more effective on the left.

Get rid while he still has a bit of value.

Who are these 6 players who can do that then? Gerrard, Torres, Riera ? ? ? ? Aurelio is a shout but not in open play. Out of the 20- 30 players we have around the 1st team squad that's still constitutes not many.

He goes past players all the time, every single time he's on the pitch and you can tell it's something he's done naturally all his life. I don't see how you can even question that side of his game.

It's the things that you need to learn, practice and then put into action on the pitch that he struggles with and his decision making.

[Havors]

Don't apologise for me, he's still a lazy useless cunt.

lol yep! as is vorinin... and Kiryakos is fast joining the list!

[zimbo]

Yet he has 4 goals from not many more starts and a handful of cameos. Actually it might only be three, two sources I'm looking at have it differently. Still not bad for a slow player with a wild powerful shot who has absolutley nothing to offer as you seem to suggest.

The things he can do that not many can't is smashing it into the top corner from 25 yards and going past a man like he isn't there. I've already said he doesn't do it enough but the talent is unquestionable imo.

I think it's 3 - the 2 against Hull (one of which he knew knack all about) and the one last night.

How many times has he smashed it into the top corner from 25 yards though? I make it twice, the other being in the Chelsea Champs League semi, when Cech let it slip through his hands. More often than not he'll scuff it wide or smash it into the nearest defender.

How often does he go past a man like he's not there? About once every couple of games? If that? It's more likely that he'll turn into a crowd of players and lose possession or fail to keep control of the ball allowing a tackle to be made. With the ability he's supposed to have he should be terrorising defenders, making them scared every time he has the ball. Instead he's way too easy to read and any full-back with anything about him can easily take him out of the game.

He may have shown glimpses of talent, but at the level he's playing we would have expected to see a damn sight more. There were odd occasions when Diouf, Morientes, Keane, Walters, Gonzalez, Kewell, Camara all showed flashes of quality. But a failure to sustain it meant that we couldn't afford to persist with them.

I'd love him to show that he can fulfil his potential. I just don't think he has the fundamental footballing awareness to achieve this. As such, I won't be sorry to see him out of the club.

[Guest]

Babel's problems is in his lack of game intelligence. That is obvious, unless you're lacking in the same department. :P

[BFG]

rafa cant possibly rate him when he continually overlooks him to start games in place of voronin or ngog. 12 mill he was and he shows signs of that when he gets longer than a 15 min spell to influence games. he not a defencsive player so why play him on the left when rafa uses the wide players to track back and defend. torres may be ****ed with injury so let him recover and give babel the front man position.

I like N'gog and he's an out and out centre forward and I don't see Babel as being that. I can also see why he'd go for Voronin instead of Babel sometimes. He doesn't have half the talent Babel does but he is more tactically switched on.

I have a lot more time for Babel than most seem to but he has a hell of a lot to prove and he hasn't shown enought o get a starting berth up front ahead of the ever improving N'gog IMO.

[el matador]

Yet he scored his goal last night from the left.

more centrally and with his right foot.

[Harv]

Who are these 6 players who can do that then? Gerrard, Torres, Riera ? ? ? ? Aurelio is a shout but not in open play. Out of the 20- 30 players we have around the 1st team squad that's still constitutes not many.

He goes past players all the time, every single time he's on the pitch and you can tell it's something he's done naturally all his life. I don't see how you can even question that side of his game.

It's the things that you need to learn, practice and then put into action on the pitch that he struggles with and his decision making.

Torres, Gerrard, Agger, Johnson, Aquilani, Riera....if you add Aurelio that makes 7.

[el matador]

errr......he's played on the left for every team he has played for. He was a Left winger/forward at Ajax.

He doesnt have striker ability either

the summer we signed him he played for the dutch under 21s up front and he scored a few goals for them

He plays on the left of a 433 front trio for holland not on the left of a 4231 -left midfield for us.

Its not the same.

[BFG]

How many times has he smashed it into the top corner from 25 yards though? I make it twice, the other being in the Chelsea Champs League semi, when Cech let it slip through his hands. More often than not he'll scuff it wide or smash it into the nearest defender.

How often does he go past a man like he's not there? About once every couple of games? If that? It's more likely that he'll turn into a crowd of players and lose possession or fail to keep control of the ball allowing a tackle to be made. With the ability he's supposed to have he should be terrorising defenders, making them scared every time he has the ball. Instead he's way too easy to read and any full-back with anything about him can easily take him out of the game.

He doesn't do it enough I've said that but I believe he has the technique to do it regularly.

I disagree about him not going past players enough though. I see him do it every game, it's the decsion making after he's beat the first man that's often the problem - usually trying to beat 2 more and losing it.

I'm not saying Ryan Babel is Van Basten, just that he isn't absolutely '****'. I agree he hasn't contributed enough given his ability but he has contributed a few goals and a good assist for Torres at West Ham. If he doesn't improve and add consistency to his game before the end of the season I also would let him go if a decent offer came in.

[el matador]

young players just need to play.

Look at ashley young when he first went to villa - he didnt look anywhere near a 9.5m signing but they stuck with him and he played pretty much every game for them and now he looks like a player.

Rafa sticks by lucas and insua even when they are having shockers but he doesnt give babel the same support. He isnt fair as a manager and although ryan hasnt helped himself at times he needs confidence and games.

Rafa doesnt like flair / individual players and unfortunately babel is one of those.

[Harv]

As long as he's playing for us we must back him, anything else is pure fickleness and doesn't deserve to be called a supporter IMO. You're as ****, supporter wise, as he's inconsistent on the field. Fans support their club and its players through thick and thin (unless the player doesn't give a ****).

Babel has loads of talent in the first place, you can't say he's got none of it. The failings that he has is with his character and maybe the fact that he allows his head to drop in face of adversity. He needs to grow some balls and accept the criticism and harness his talents. It's probably never going to happen here but I'll bet that he'll become a success at another club, where's there's less pressure.

fickleness? Saying a player isn't good enough is fickle? He simply isn't good enough. Its not even up for debate, he can't even run a game out FFS. He's the laziest ****er i've seen for some time. He shows glimpses of talent...but are you seriously happy watching him play like a turd for 4 games, with the odd moment of talent thrown in? Im not. I want to win. Half hearted players like Babel and Voronin dont help.

I've been supporting Liverpool for 15 years and quite frankly i'm sick of seeing the Mancs simply stroll into the lead in titles won.

You may be happy watching ordinary players swan around on the field hlaf arsed, doing a nice trick every now and then, but i'm not. So don't dare call me a **** supporter because i don't support a player who cant even be bothered half the time. Kuyt is **** too, but he runs himself into the ground for the team, and because of that i will support the guy till he leaves. Babel does nothing. He's a waster, and i cannot wait till the day he ****s off.

[Harv]

the summer we signed him he played for the dutch under 21s up front and he scored a few goals for them

He plays on the left of a 433 front trio for holland not on the left of a 4231 -left midfield for us.

Its not the same.

U21's Paaaleease, you're kidding right?

No its not the same.....but then neither is playing centrally.

Basically the position he likes to play in is the spot where he doesnt have to track back and defend......says it all.

[BFG]

Rafa sticks by lucas and insua even when they are having shockers but he doesnt give babel the same support. He isnt fair as a manager and although ryan hasnt helped himself at times he needs confidence and games.

Rafa doesnt like flair / individual players and unfortunately babel is one of those.

That's pretty unfair criticism of the manager IMO. Lucas and Insua play every game because of injuries to other players in their position. Had Aurelio and Aqualani been fitter they would have played less. At times they've both also shown a level of consistency and a willingness to follow instructions that Babel hasn't so deserve more game time.

The fact that Garcia and Benyoun have both been fixtures in our team also disproves your theory about Rafa not liking flair players. They just have to show a lot more in the way of game intelligence, tactical discipline and consistency to stay in his team than Babel has ever offered.