Let's look on the positive side of things

[FatTony]

No it's not funny, but it's the first time it's been like this for years, it's desperate i know, but making judgements based on a bad run of form, which represents a small amount of a managers tenure at a club isn't the way to go, imo.

If Torres had a bad season, where he was badly out of sorts, would we all judge him soley on that season, or the other free scoring ones he''d have given us before that ?.

The problem imo is more deeply rooted than this though. I really do believe that we finished 2nd last season because of Scolari, which was a blessing, but also papered over the cracks and just added fodder for those that believe Rafa is the second coming. He's a good manager, but he will not bridge the gap.

Only my opinion I know, but Fergie would be achieving more with this squad. There are so many areas I'm concerned about with Rafa now thats its not funny anymore.

[Mattshark]

Ok so this is and has been a very tough season for us all and we are only at the start of December. In a year many of us, me included hoped we would positioned to be the title favorites we have gone one step forwards 3 steps back....again ....again

There is no getting away from a couple of issues namely we have been savaged my injuries too important players and our squad it would seem is just not as good enough, presently.

But lets take a short break from all the doom and gloom and look at some positives. We have kept 3 clean sheets on the trot. We seemed to have calmed down defending set pieces, gone is the obvious edginess defending set pieces the expression of nervousness and inevitability which use to be painted on Carra's face has been replaced with that more familiar determination and confidence. Rafa has obviously mixed it up and we are defending set pieces differently, noticeably not putting someone on the line, which i think is an excellent idea.

We are undefeated in 6 now. Whilst the results have not been great we are slowly, begrudgingly moving in the right direction. There is no getting away from out current situation, with a combination of a new back four, a new system and horrific injury woes the team has lacked stability. Our players have been frustrated and heads have dropped, the customary slaughter onslaught from the tabloids has not helped but alas coming out of this weekend we have gained on the lg leaders and our squad is nearing coming back to full strength, just as the 3 main title contenders squads are due to be weakened.

United have a defender crisis brewing, Arsenal are without RVP which makes a huge difference to that team and Chelsea have the African cup to contend with. We obviously need to pick up the pace, but the there has been signs of improvement. Stevie looks to be returning to full fitness and is starting to play some nice football again. Carra has seemed to settled again. Benny is fit again, Reira is back, Torres may be on his way back, Aquailani may be about to start is first game, Masher is coming back to his best and Ngog has shown some real maturity and looks like he will make it into the senior team, not to mention Agger is back and Insua has been very solid.

Our next 3 games are all at home against teams that like to play open attacking football, Florentina, Arsenal and Wigan. I personally think its set up to really be the confidence shot we need to get things moving again and I am predicting 3 wins on the trot from these fixtures. Florentina need a win and the pressure is off us. The least our lads can do is put on a show for the fans who have traveled around europe with them this season. I have a feeling this could be a battering.

Then we have Arsenal who have a tough away trip to Olympiakos who need the win. Arsenal coming off back to back defeats to ManU and Chelsea need a result if they are going to keep in it and hopefully we can be at full strength for that game. Another Win in the same week against a top side with a squad growing in strength and perhaps we can start to build some momentum going into Chrimbo.

We have Pompey and Wolves after that before the last game of the year against Villa. By time we meet its very possible we have put 5 wins together on the trot and thats exactly what we need to do.

So lets all get behind the team Wednesday night and let it be the start of a 5 game winning streak leading into that game with Villa.

Dare to Beleive Red Brothers and Sisters

Walk on with Hope in your Hearts

Well said mate, good to have you back fella

[vonk]

And yet with all their 1st teamers fit Burnley managed to beat them, footballs weird eh.

I just can't understand how after being happy with Rafa for this long why any fan would wanto see him gone with this seasons run of results the reason, this is not what we're used to, it's not the norm at all, we were flying last season, especially the second half, playing good football, season on season progression, till this one season.

I trust the man to get it right, not blindly, but based on what i've seen for the vast majority of his time here.

Out of 6 seasons, including this one, we've had one good season in the Premier League. We were also rans for all the others. Sorry for pointing out facts like.

[Nicey]

We have been closing the gap consistently, he had horrible luck at the start of this season and like i said who knows what may happen, lets see were we stand going into the Villa game.

Currently we are 3 points behind 4th place
We are 4 points behind Arsenal
We are 10 points behind ManU
and 12 points behind Chelsea

I expect those numbers will improve by Christmas

[Guest]

Well, the fact of the matter is that any team can beat any other over one match, its the course of the season that counts and Man Utd, who happen to have been beaten by Burnley and ourselves, are only a couple of points off the top of the EPL and in the next round of the CL. Its only just turned December and we're out of both. Thats not too funny.

I think Man Utd are playing above their level this season. We were just devoid of confidence added to the fact that we were crippled with injuries. Reasoning and criticism like our fans give the team doesn't help IMO. There's too much expectation.

[Guest]

The problem imo is more deeply rooted than this though. I really do believe that we finished 2nd last season because of Scolari, which was a blessing, but also papered over the cracks and just added fodder for those that believe Rafa is the second coming. He's a good manager, but he will not bridge the gap.

Only my opinion I know, but Fergie would be achieving more with this squad. There are so many areas I'm concerned about with Rafa now thats its not funny anymore.

Nobody disputed the fact that Chelsea were better than us, they have a bigger squad, that is all. Our first 11 is possibly the best in the premier league but when we scratch that surface we don't have as much resources. Too many players are inconsistent also.

[FatTony]

Nobody disputed the fact that Chelsea were better than us, they have a bigger squad, that is all. Our first 11 is possibly the best in the premier league but when we scratch that surface we don't have as much resources. Too many players are inconsistent also.

I don't believe that at all.

[Guest]

I don't believe that at all.

With Alonso, instead of Lucas, and possibly Aquilani. But this is arguable. You might not agree but I think I have a strong case to being right.

[BobTheCharmer]

Our first 11 is possibly the best in the premier league

Are you being serious my friend?

Ah **** it, some like rafa, some loathe him, some want more time some want change. Lifes too short for arguments. Until Rafa brings us the success that some believe will come there's no definitive answer.

[Scratch]

Are you being serious my friend?

Ah **** it, some like rafa, some loathe him, some want more time some want change. Lifes too short for arguments. Until Rafa brings us the success that some believe will come there's no definitive answer.

Reina

Johnson
Carra
Agger
Aurelio

Mascherano
Aqualani
Gerrard

Kuyt
Torres
Benny


It ain't far off it...i'd like to see a better LW brought in, as i think Benny makes a bigger impact from off the bench, but other than that i'm pretty happy with that squad up against the likes of Man U, Chelsea and City/Arse/Spurs.

Problem is, we ain't seen that team play yet, not even close to it.

[Guest]

Are you being serious my friend?

Ah **** it, some like rafa, some loathe him, some want more time some want change. Lifes too short for arguments. Until Rafa brings us the success that some believe will come there's no definitive answer.

Thing is, people who don't like Rafa will have no choice to bear with him in the long run. He'll be here next season, independent of the fact we finish 10'th or are relegated. So it's better to love him than loathe him for your health I'd say.

[FatTony]

Thought it would be interesting to look back at some threads from the start of the season to see how things panned out, and its interesting to see who said what and how things have since panned out, especially from the "negative" side as we do tend to take a lot of grief

This makes good reading:

http://www.est1892.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=62788

[Nicey]

Are you being serious my friend?

Ah **** it, some like rafa, some loathe him, some want more time some want change. Lifes too short for arguments. Until Rafa brings us the success that some believe will come there's no definitive answer.

----------------Pepe-----------------

Johnson - Agger - Carra - Aurrelio

Gerrard - Masher - Aquilani - Benny

---------Torres ------Kuyt----------


I think he may have a point

[BobTheCharmer]

Reina

Johnson
Carra
Agger
Aurelio

Mascherano
Aqualani
Gerrard

Kuyt
Torres
Benny


It ain't far off it...i'd like to see a better LW brought in, as i think Benny makes a bigger impact from off the bench, but other than that i'm pretty happy with that squad up against the likes of Man U, Chelsea and City/Arse/Spurs.

Problem is, we ain't seen that team play yet, not even close to it.

Reina
Johnson
Carra
Gerrard
Torres

the rest are up for serious debate whether they're that good.

[FatTony]

With Alonso, instead of Lucas, and possibly Aquilani. But this is arguable. You might not agree but I think I have a strong case to being right.

I'd take the entire back four of chelsea over ours and add Lampard, Essien, Joe Cole, Malouda (yes) and Drogba and Anelka as backup striker. I think they'd take Gerrard, Torres, and possibly Mascher.